AIBU to think sex is a duty to your partner?

[2weanornot2wean]

Barring physical and mental illness, disability, and other extremes like loss/grief/high stress.

I.e. in regular, healthy relationships, both happy and fairly young, do you owe sex to your partner? I'm not talking every day, or even every other day.

How many times does 'I'm tired' or 'I'm not in the mood' fly before you just get pissed off with never being approached for intimacy, straight up rejected, and made to feel like a sex pest for wanting physical contact with your life partner?

I hope no one insinuates I am referring to being forced to have sex/rape, because that just isn't the case. I would never force anyone to do anything they don't want to, especially intercourse, but I can't help but shake the feeling that OK we might not all be ravenous for sex all the time, but even if you can't really be arsed, do you see sex as sort of a duty to your partner?

I don't see sex as a duty, I see it as something I really enjoy physically and emotionally. Within the context of our relationship, if we both don't enthusiastically want it it doesn't happen. Neither of us owe the other our body.

The question I've seen around is where's the tolerance threshold for mums with kids.

Virtually every few days in here we see a man saying he doesn't get sex, and he's met with not enough housework, she's had a child, she's tired, etc.

So a woman has a child, sex disappears for the weeks or months after, how long after that (assuming he's doing his 'fair share'), is fair of him to say "sex has practically disappeared, this is not what I signed up for"?

There was a really weird thread where a woman talked about all women having duty sex as though it was just an accepted part of life. One poster even said that it was universal.

When I pointed out that I'd never had duty sex and certainly didn't know anyone who did, I was called a man and told I was trolling.

There's a massive difference between 1. not really being in the mood, go ahead with it cos your partner wants to and then soon getting into the mood a bit and enjoying the sex you have (even if its not mindblowing). Then 2. Not being in the mood and gritting your teeth through shite sex wishing for it to be over.

In my opinion 1 is fine and part of the normal relationship compromises people make for a happy relationship, but 2 is not OK!

@2weanornot2wean - He could be depressed, or there could be any number of other health-related reasons that are making him anxious and avoidant about it.

I think it is a problem that he won't talk about it. I don't know whether it's possible to separate "talking about it to understand it" from "talking about it to fix it", so that you can at least talk about it to understand what is going on and why, but without the pressure of fixing it.

If he’s at the stage where he rolls his eyes and his body tenses up when you try to initiate, speaking from experience, and gently, you may want to consider whether it’s possible that you have been coercive, OP. You’ve confirmed you don’t sulk if he says no, but what DO you do? What’s your response to that? Your thread title tells us that you believe that your husband has a “duty” to have sex with you. That is a coercive mindset, and a belief that coercive partners often have in common.

I think the universal thing is that the only rule worth a damn is that you have to be able to talk to each other and listen to each other, to want to understand each other. Then you should be able to work out a solution, compromise or conclude that the relationship has run its course.

Trying to establish a "rule" is a way of avoiding talking about it, of not understanding the specifics of what's happening for the people in the relationship.

We've created this as a society i believe. It's very normal for women to lose their libido, and access to internet porn has normalised sex on tap.
Sex probably was on tap when we lived in nomadic tribes. Humans weren't expected to be monogamous. So i see it that society has evolved quickly - nuclear families, outsourcing care, isolation, the notion of till death us do part, etc. And yet as mammals, we haven't evolved to keep up.

I go to bed and sort myself out 90% of the time. I really try hard not to let him see it get to me but sometimes it does upset me, I can't lie! Being rejected by someone who is meant to love and want to have that kind of physical and emotional relationship with you over and over again can wear you down. Perhaps I need to change my mindset. Perhaps I should just accept that the person who does not want sex will always "win" in the battle of wills (as I suppose is right, I know no one should have sex against their will/be raped OBVIOUSLY), although I'm sure someone will insinuate I'm a rapist with that wording too. I have never ever forced him to have sex. I don't think it's so wrong that being rejected continuously by my life partner upsets me.

Feel the need to caveat that by saying I absolutely do not try to initiate every day or every other day. Sometimes I don't want to have sex, I understand it now and then, but not always. I'm not a monster and I know that pestering him will not get me anywhere anyway. I feel sick thinking that whenever we do have sex now he doesn't really want to and is just going through the motions. To be honest, that hadn't occurred to me at all.

@2weanornot2wean
I'm where you are, and it's a difficult topic on MN, because people WILL jump on it saying sex without 'enthusiasm' is r@pe. I think there's a grey area, like visiting the in-laws, where you might not enjoy it, but you do it for your partner because you love them. This comment is often rebutted here with "it's ick/disgusting, etc, I could never have sex with someone if I knew they weren't 100%, and were doing it out of obligation". I'd imagine the majority of bjs aren't done with 'absolute' enthusiasm, they're not exactly fun for the woman! Plus (I've raised this elsewhere), a recent poll on MN said 2/3 women would have sex for 250k with a stranger, so that also adds an element of willing quid pro quo.

As I said, I'm where you are. 'Alone time' is a poor substitute, but it tides you over. Hopefully the rest of the relationship is good enough that it mitigates the deficiency here.

Do you seriously think that women should have sex even though they don't want to because it's their 'duty' to their husband/partner?

'Close Your Eyes and Think of England' they used to call it in the olden days.

These days, it's called 'rape'.

You’re making some helpful observations here. It’s certainly important to question why you want sex with a reluctant or unwilling partner. You believe the relationship otherwise is healthy - does he? Have you talked about that? Have you discussed intimacy - the kind that is unrelated to sex? If your husband loves you, his “no” to sex isn’t a rejection of you, it’s a rejection of the act. Sometimes that’s temporary, other times it isn’t. If it makes you as unhappy as you seem however, it is likely time to consider whether the marriage should continue.

You can reverse the genders in that one too. But when its the woman in a sexless relationship who has an affair its not "oh not surprising" that is the reaction. Its "how could she" Because there is still double standards and misogyny when it comes to women and sex. Im currently reading Want. The book of sexual fantasies compiled by Gilllian Anderson. She has written the foreword for each chapter and she talks about women keeping quiet about their needs due to the shame still felt by women when it comes to their needs. And so far i have come across some fantasies in the book that have been submitted by women in sexless marriages. Also have read and watched interviews Gillian has done promoting the book and she said she was surprised and disappointed that nothing much has changed for women in this regard since Nancy Fridays book My Secret Garden was released 51 years ago!

I hate feeling like a predator, and that's how he makes me feel. He rolls his eyes or I can feel his body tense up when I suggest going to bed early that night.

Christ, this is so sad! 😢 I just want to give you a hug. I can feel how much he has broken your spirit in your post. OP you don't realise this, but he is being so CRUEL to you. He is breaking your spirit and it's a form of emotional neglect.

Please, you need to talk to him, because the more you post, the more of a neglectful, cold, cruel bastard he sounds like. This is your normal, so you don't see it. But I can tell you from the outside looking in, to me that is a form of emotional abuse (go look it up, it is. A therapist will tell you this, too, I promise you!). You need to give him an ultimatum, to at least stir him to not breaking your spirit with his rejection of you and rolling eyes, tensing up as if he finds you repulsive. It doesn't mean you have to go through with it. But please believe me, this is a form of emotional neglect. At very least, if not emotional abuse. Google it. Ring up a therapist. It is. You don't know unless it's pointed out to you. PLEASE give him some type of ultimatum. No matter what your intention. You don't need to live with this level of disrespect. Nor should you.

The main thing we know from observing the sexual behaviour of other animals is that it is incredibly diverse, so I think that there's no way of knowing what it was like for humans in prehistory.

Just as an example, it's perfectly possible that the natural state of things for humans is bisexuality, and the higher sex drive of men would have been expressed among themselves as a way of bonding men together to reduce conflict from competition over women.

But that's no more than a plausible guess.

Being rejected by someone who is meant to love and want to have that kind of physical and emotional relationship with you over and over again can wear you down.

Of course it does! What you are feeling is a natural feeling of being neglected and abused.

Perhaps I need to change my mindset.

Woah, honey no, no, no! Stop! You are not the one who needs to 'change your mindset'. See, this shows how much he has broken your spirit. He has made you believe you are a fault for wanting basic love and affection. You are not at fault here, you have not done anything wrong. Don't you see that? He's a pig. Sorry, but he is. And if he won't get a jolt or shock from an ultimatum, then that's proof he never truly loved you. If he is afraid of losing you, he will be spurred into action.

@CrochetForLife
"he is being so CRUEL to you. He is breaking your spirit and it's a form of emotional neglect."
"You need to give him an ultimatum, to at least stir him to not breaking your spirit with his rejection of you and rolling eyes, tensing up as if he finds you repulsive. "But please believe me, this is a form of emotional neglect. At very least, if not emotional abuse."

I am curious, why it is emotional abuse if a man does it to a woman, but he's a sex pest if a woman does it to a man?

Imagine a man coming in here saying his wife doesn't have sex with him. Sure, many would say 'counselling', but an overwhelming number will say not enough housework, sex pest, you're not a cum bucket, or similar. Imagine how the forum would react if a man came in here believing he's being abused because his wife isn't having sex with him.

Absolutely. We don't know. Ive been musing on all this throughout the thread. I think it's a minefield with no one right answer

I recognise some of these things with DH. There are no right and wrong answers, only how you feel about it. If you can live with it then it's absolutely fine. If you feel that you want to end the relationship and try to find someone with a similar sex drive to yourself that's also fine.

It's the rolling of the eyes, and the recoiling from her that is shows the contempt and cruelty.

Not merely the lack of sex. His response to her in the way he rejects her.

Maybe he's just not particularly into sex @2weanornot2wean - lots of people genuinely aren't that bothered about it either way.

Either way, you really only have two choices. Accept the status quo where you carry on having sex every few weeks, or leave.

FINALLY! Someone questioning why the other partner wont leave!!!!!

It's hardly rocket science. They're getting everything they want in the relationship.

This advice is probably completely misguided and wrong as it was given to me by my toxic, narcissistic, awful mother. She used to say "If he's not having sex with you, he's having sex with someone else". What she meant was "have sex whenever he wants, so he doesn't seek it elsewhere". So yes, I have definitely had duty sex, but my DH is pretty great in the sack, so I warm up and get into it after a bit..

probably because i was the one who didn't want it, and also the one who ended the marriage to get away from the constant harassment from the one who did. (amongst other issues with his shitty behaviour)