Would you stay in the UK if you were me?

[DozensOfRoses]

Looking for honest thoughts: should I stay in the UK, and if you were in my shoes what would you do? I'm late 20s, recently single and in a very decent professional career.

I've been a Londoner for a decade and consider it home, however I struggle to recognise the place I fell in love with. I feel like I work nonstop for a low quality of life and I'm not sure I can see any perks anymore. It just seems everything is in terminal decline here. I thought I would feel some hope with the new government but honestly after the last month it just feels a bit like they've given up too?

The quality of housing and transport is just so bad, it makes everything a pain on a daily basis. I'm lucky to own my own (tiny, mortgaged) one bed apartment within 45 minute commute, the kind of place I'm thrilled to have but anybody outside of London would consider appropriate for a student, not a highly paid professional. I feel like I'd lose the will to live if I had to commute any further, given the cost and regular disruption to commuter services.

I feel like I'm being robbed by utility companies (when I compare what I pay to anyone I know overseas, they are shocked). I can't see anything I get in return for my taxes (work pays for private health insurance and I've given up even trying the NHS doctors). I don't feel safe on the streets of London anymore, this might in part be due to getting older but I've seen so much crime recently and very little interest in doing anything about it. I want to have a family in the next few years but childcare here is shocking and I'm not sure I would be happy with the quality of non fee paying schools in many areas.

When I visit friends abroad I am stunned by the quality of life they have and I feel almost...gaslit? into my low expectations after 10 years in London.

I'm originally from another English-speaking western country and in terms of visas in a very privileged position (would be highly mobile). I work in a very internationalised professional service (think consulting, banking, trading or corporate law) where I can move around a year from now to a role earning from £100-200k (and which would pay the same or more abroad). Obviously moving would be a pain and I would be starting over in terms of my life, but I'm not sure I see a future here anymore. I think the last few years I have been waiting it out to see if things will get better but I'm losing hope.

Honestly: what would you do in my position? Can anyone see things getting better? And those who have decided to make the move, how has it gone?

Yeah I think you're right. I think what's holding me back is a sense of (1) loss at feeling like I've put 10 years into something that is not working like I'd hoped and (2) knowing the move will be painful, leaving behind such amazing friendships and a city that I do still love.

I’m raging that there was nearly 5000 rapes last year

Christ @Nanalisa60 that's a lot! Please share your source for that statistics.

I’d move - agree with what you see in London. Lots of it does now look like anywhere less in UK, a city in decline. Go - you can always come back!

I can kinda relate to your post loosely. I was working in the healthcare sector in Newcastle. I quite my job and the next day moved to wales. Honestly the way of life here is so different. Everyone seems so chill real community feel my rent is pretty cheap my bills are reasonably priced. I’m single and now have a child but honestly moving from there to here was the best thing I ever did. If you have your heart set on leaving the uk do it. Honestly for the first few months it’s hard finding your feet but once you settle in it feels like home

Oh wow, that sounds amazing. I've been to Wales on holidays and it's gorgeous. I wish I was more into the chiller pace of life, I'd move there in a heartbeat (I have some friends who grew up there and said they had a really lovely community and that parts of Wales are pretty diverse). It wouldn't work with my work either but I'll definitely be back for tranquil holidays.

Great to hear that the move worked out for you. I think (hope!) it's one of those things that's a lot of short term pain, but when you are really settled in is worth it

I think I saw something the other day like "one person raped in London every hour" or similar? Ah here it is: apparently it's even worse than the previous poster remembered, it's 8,800 rapes reported in London in 2023...

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxr202eee0no#:~:text=A%20rape%20offence%20is%20reported,offending%20will%20be%20far%20higher.

Reading your posts @DozensOfRoses I think you have decided a move is the right one, whether that is to another country I am not so sure. The reason I say that is you are doing the remainder of the UK a little bit of an injustice, there are plenty of other areas which may fit what you are looking for - there are large cities with as much of a buzz as London, some surrounded by the most amazing countryside which you may come to appreciate.

Personally, keep your flat as others have suggested, but maybe research to staying in the UK, if you find an area and it works great, if not then look to other countries.

The major benefit of being in the UK is you can easily travel to see your London friends and vice versa.

We went to France, but in your situation I would have gone to Switzerland (where we are now). We moved to a rural area and had our dc, it was great when they were little but is devoid of social or cultural anything to speak of, wouldn't live there on my own.

What worked well was that frankly, the standard of living is just higher than it was in London, and we have easy access to London for the bits of it we can't get elsewhere.

The only reason I would go back to the UK is for our dc. I don't miss living there at all, though I still love to visit (and am still horrified at the appalling value for money that everything is there, every time I go).

Actually interesting you say that, I used to love drinking a lot more and my feelings of negativity towards London map on pretty close to when I slowed down! I think a big part of the reason I slowed down thought was cost and safety. I don't know how I used to be able to afford to go out so much, a few big nights bankrupts me now! And one of the joys of getting older is being more safety conscious, although I've also had a lot more bad experiences the last year or two that makes me less willing to navigate my way home drunk. Maybe the alcohol haze was a part of my love of London 😂

I have a few friends actually currently in the process of relocating to Canada, I think it's a bit slower for finding the work they want but quality of life there seems very good. There seem to be some places where you can get the cosmopolitan life but also the healthier outdoors too

I think you should identify a town/city you'd like to live in, whether here or abroad, check it out by spending a couple of weeks holiday there, and set about moving if you're pretty sure you would love it. It's not so much a case of ticking boxes as the feeling you get in a place. You don't seem to like London much at all so no point in staying. Good luck.

I think all your concerns are very valid so I would go . It's not going to get better here anytime soon , especially not for high earners who are in the government's sights for increased squeezing . I relocated to London for work about 20yrs ago , stayed 10yrs and moved out , absolutely no regrets and it must be 10x worse now .

Move now.

One of the things that would makes me extremely nervous about moving to another part of the UK is that my salary would go down a lot (in my sector we would be looking at between 1/3rd and 1/2 of London salary, absolute max) and moving back for work or to another major international city would be almost impossible, as it's the kind of thing only really done at a high level in major cities. It would probably be possible to move to another UK city and then back again if I had a long track record but at the moment that would majorly dent my CV. Basically it would be a one way only move, whereas internationally it would be lateral.

Paradoxically I could walk into an office in HK or Dubai or NY and have more work continuity than in any place in the UK outside of London. Which is not how things should be in the UK, I would definitely agree with that...

Switzerland is beautiful, I have friends there and they earn twice what that role gave them in London but the cost of living is comparable (if not a good bit cheaper). Every time I go there I'm amazed by the transport, cleanliness, how lovely the houses are, how good the food is, the healthy lifestyle too. And so easy for travel to other places too. I can see why you moved!

Go for it
My brother moved to a country within Asia a few years ago to teach in his early 30's. He's travelled around other parts of Asia for cheaper than he would have done in the UK during the school holidays. Learned a new language, made some lovely friends and embraced new cultures alongside his teaching career. He's coming back to the UK at some point next year (keep trying to dissuade him) but how amazing to be free like that?

@DozensOfRoses Try Switzerland as it would seem to fit your requirements, far better than going as far as Canada/Australia. NY will have similar problems to London. Dubai would also be possible but it will be quite a different feel, but you could use it as a "make as much money as possible in a shorter length of time" move!

BTW thanks everyone for your thoughts and for the pushback too, it's very appreciated. I know the tone of this thread is very moany and quite close to the definition of "first world problems" 😂I promise I'm actually a very positive and fun person in real life!

Move! So many exciting places to go and nothing / nobody to tie you down!

I don't think it is moany or a first world problem, it is important for you and there is no point in asking for advice if you try and give the problem with rose tinted glasses on!

Good luck in whatever you choose, the grass is not always greener, but I do think in life you can spend lots of time thinking about doing something and never doing it! Better to have tried and it not worked than not is my motto.

Move to Switzerland or Abu Dhabi

Dependent on location, and premised on push factors.

Leave, assuming you meet entry requirements.

@schloss

Similar to my "you can't regret the things you tried only the things you never had the balls to try"

Thanks so much for this! Luckily I know at least a couple of people in each place I would consider and they also all have big communities from my country, which makes things easier. My feelings at the moment are:

Switzerland: already know it's somewhere I would be happy living and have an insant circle, plus it's not a big move geographically. Easy for work and good for career. Wouldn't make amazing money after living costs but would be considerable improvement on London for that.

Paris: Switzerland but a lower quality of life and some of the same issues as London, would still be a big improvement but probably not a radical enough move. Probably somewhere I'd rather keep for holidays.

Canada: lovely but a big move geographically, also career wise would be slower. Like the sound of the lifestyle in some of the cities.

Australia: again very far, not sure I am into beaches enough to make the most of it.

Dubai: would need to see if I would enjoy but would be best move for me financially and it's not actually very far. Quality of life also very good.

Somewhere in Asia such as Singapore, HK: works super easy for work, far but very cosmopolitan life. However very expensive.

Would be intrigued to hear more about Abu Dhabi, I've not been but have heard it has a bit of a Paris meets Dubai kind of feel? Maybe not as fast as Dubai in terms of work but has a lot of culture?