To ask how to negotiate Christmas with exwife

[mistletoeandwine86]

I’ve been with my partner for 2 years and we both have 2 children each from our previous marriages.
This year it is my turn to have my children for Christmas week then they go to my ex husband’s place for the second week of the holidays. The plan was to have Christmas all together the 6 of us for the week starting the 23rd, then they would go back to their mum and then my partner and I have booked a mini break just the 2 of us over new year.
Except now partners ex has thrown a spanner in the works and said we cannot have the children then. She wants partner to have them the following week so she can work and hit the roof when my partner said we weren’t around.
I feel like the ex wife just uses my partner for childcare but he isn’t allowed special days like Christmas. My partner has never had the children for Christmas week, they have always been with their mum and my partner has just seen gone to see them on Christmas morning or has had them on Boxing Day etc but they’ve never woken up at his house on Christmas morning.
My partner is unwilling to fight it but I am so upset because we had it all planned out.
AIBU and how can we negotiate with her?

I appreciate that Christmas is a bit different but we can’t break up the week because of our plans the following week. So it’ll just end up with him not seeing the children at all other than his usual EOW. Sigh.

After that update I wish I could vote YABU a second time. Good grief.

Alternating Christmas eve & day between the parents is perfectly reasonable if agreed in advance.

But that's not what happened. You and your partner booked a holiday and then expected his kids and their mother to just say "oh sure, we'll prioritize your couples trip and plan everyone's Christmas around that." And when their mom didn't give you exactly what you demanded your response is to shrug and say "whelp we're going on holiday so the kids just won't see their dad for Christmas at all." It's all stunningly self-involved and speaks volumes about your partner's attitude towards fatherhood if he goes along with it.

Op, you still seem to have missed the point that at Christmas, children and what they want come first and your desire for a bit of winter sun is completely irrelevant.

Your dp clearly isn't that fussed about seeing his DCs or about the holiday, so you could go on your own, go with someone else, or reschedule it, having had the sense and good manners to consult everyone first. It isn't all about you.

I'm a single mum and my ex never wanted DS on Christmas Day because he also couldn't be bothered with all the extras. I would never have relied on ex's latest woman to provide a decent Christmas for my child, he would have hated it..

she says it’s unfair that she won’t be able to see them over Christmas week at all.

Of course it’s not fair. When she’s had the kids for Christmas he has still been able to see them in the run up and on the day. To suddenly do the whole week without the other parent involved at all isn’t fair on the kids.
You clearly only want this set up because you want to go on holiday child free. And it’s funny you say you deserve child free time when he only has them every other weekend. Mate, your bf gets plenty of child free time.

His poor children🙁 you’ve been together just 2 years and you want to reorganise Christmas for him and his ex-wife?!

He has to fight it . He is just as entitled to spend Xmas switch his kids as the mum is .
No Xmas no childcare. .

Some mothers just like to make sure that they have new year free to party. .

or plan the children’s Christmas holidays around their child-free mini breaks with no regard for the fact the children would prefer to be elsewhere…

I just rtfp and I came back to edit .

It was said that the mum has the kids every Xmas when actually this is all a nee set up.

Doesn’t seem like it was all agreed to either. .
Just assumed and now the mum has disagreed .
I would be too .

I do believe Xmas should be year on year off.
That way it’s fair for parents and especially children . As that’s what’s matters most.

She is right, it us unfair that she won't see the DC over the Xmas week.

Are you completely unable to read? The father has been able to spend Christmas with his kids every year, it’s the mother he’s proposing to not see the kids for the whole of Christmas week … and exactly so he can party on a child free couples holiday over NY.

I’d say you are as unable to read as I am .

Read above !

Your comment is completely irrelevant to the situation here.

All I'd say reading your OP

• please stop talking and thinking in terms of "fighting".
• as said above, your DHs ex isn't using him for childcare. These are his children your talking about!!
• your DH needs to engage with his children and ask them what they'd like to do, and ensure he's very clear with them that he wants the best for them and he will work with whatever they choose. This approach means they don't say what they think he wants to hear, because children very often want to please the parent asking the question, rather than actually giving their choice.
• please stop demonising your DHs ex and remember that once upon a time they had a relationship, she hasn't suddenly turned into the devil incarnate.
• give your DH a big hug for being kind and not wanting the fight his ex for the children over Christmas. He sounds very sensible and wants to keep the peace, which is not a bad thing to want to do, especially as Christmas can become a pointless and needless battleground if you let it become so.

@mistletoeandwine86 From your posts it sounds like you made no arrangement about Christmas with his ex wife, went ahead and booked your holiday, and are now annoyed that she won't fall into line.

Sorry but the time to try and negotiate with her was before you booked your holiday, not afterwards.

She hasn't gone back on what was previously agreed. She hasn't done anything wrong.

So she's the main carer for the dc, your proposing she doesn't see them at all christmas week even though you think the dc will want to see their mam. She facilities your ex seeing his dc christmas morning and boxing day but your completely trying to remove her christmas week to spend on her own then dumping the dc back for your mini trip over ny. Your massively unreasonable and have your own self interests here. You need a partner without kids. You have no intentions of putting them first. Very selfish behaviour.

Yes this is a good idea. Could your kids dad have them over Christmas and you have them all the second week?

Before you decided on all these plans did you (or primarily your partner) consider speaking with the ex? Saying she had thrown a spanner in The works is completely incorrect - you didn’t discuss it with her just told her, no wonder she wouldn’t be open to it (alongside all the other reasons).

the language you use and the behaviour you are writing about given this is a newish relationship doesn’t put you in a good light.

How about you invite her to yours for Christmas day, like she did with your husband previously - and see if you can brainstorm with her something for the 3/4 days she'll need cover the following week (assuming she won't be working on 1 January)?

My husband had a two year old when we got together and subsequently married. His ex partner moved over 200 miles away to be nearer to her family after the split. He understood her need to be nearer them. He also never in 18 years of parenting ever had his son on Christmas Day, not even for the morning. We always had to make the journey on Boxing Day to collect his son. He had a very friendly relationship with his ex which has endured over the years but she never once budged on the Christmas Day thing. My husband just accepted it. His son moved in with us when he turned 18 and now we see him all the time. It’s lovely.

I think it’s just a day, maybe look at it like that. Not sure how you could get her to change her mind. It was difficult but we had no option but to go with the flow in order to keep things as amicable as they were and continued to be.

it sounds from your posts as if you booked your break away without first checking that everyone had agreed on Christmas arrangements.

if that’s the case then you took a risk

Surely Christmas holidays are totally different to other holidays. You can’t expect the same. I would hate to not see my kids on the lead up to Christmas. Surely you can do a couple of days on and a couple of days off and negotiate the main Xmas eve/day Boxing Day? Might be a blag but me and my ex work it so we both see them Xmas eve/day. We just split the days. Kids absolutely love it

The children should be put first. You have acknowledged that they would prefer to spend Christmas with their mother.

I think it’s unusual to split Christmas into whole weeks like this. Most people split it over the main days. I have two friends in a similar situation to you, and they alternate between having DC Xmas Eve until 5pm Christmas Day, then 5pm Xmas Day and Boxing Day.

Far less contentious.

It doesn't seem unreasonable for him to have the kids for one Christmas. Why can't she visit on the morning of, as he has?

And she should be responsible for finding childcare on days she needs to work. (That's what MN always says when it's the man who needs to work on his days with the kids.)

The point seems to be that the op dh hasn’t even discussed this with the mother until they’d booked the holiday. They’d decided to have the kids Christmas week with no discussion with the mother. If this was just dropped on me and I was expected to not see my kids the whole of Christmas week I’d be saying no too!

@BetterWithPockets And she should be responsible for finding childcare on days she needs to work. (That's what MN always says when it's the man who needs to work on his days with the kids.)

In this case it sounds like the ex wife has had years of accommodating the fathers work post split since they have had no fixed schedule due to his shift work.

I'm a stepmother and think you're being incredibly unreasonable.
It's all about what you want.
The fact that you haven't asked the kids or their Mum before you've gone and made all these arrangements is staggering. Your DP is a bit of an idiot in thinking this would all be tickety boo too.