solo day out - unwanted company

[FrescoeDay]

I actually know I'm not being unreasonable but my reaction may be out of proportion and I need help wording my response for my desired outcome - solitude.

I'm on a sort of retreat in Italy. Tomorrow I arranged to go on a day trip away from the base to look at some art. I'd arranged for the car to the station, bought my train ticket and was looking forward to it. I told my next door room mate who told someone else who over dinner tonight said he was coming along 'if I didn't mind.' Of course I don't mind him going to the town and looking at the art. If he is here a week it is his opportunity. Of course I don't mind if he catches the same train - although, honestly, I don't want to chat and be friendly and 'on' for an hour plus on the train there (and back?!) Why should I?

I do not want to spend 6 hours going around museums galleries, churches, having lunch, with a stranger. I prefer to look at art alone at my own pace and have my own responses. But over dinner I could hardly say that. The prick (pardon me) cornered me. I am so angry I'm finding it hard to relax. This may be disproportionate. The thing is I am quite able to be cold and freeze people if I feel like it - but I don't want to introduce awkwardness let alone animosity. I am meeting the driver of the retreat tomorrow morning and this other unwanted guest. I don't want to stop him if this is his one chance to go to the town. But I refuse to have my day stolen from me because I end up being polite to this man. I need a healthy middle ground. I am 46. I can't believe I am still being imposed on like this. I don't want to snap but I may.

Thanks for hearing me out. Perspective needed. This has touched a nerve you can tell. I would just never ever do this.

Jesus….a man cannot just impose on a lone woman like this. It’s not ok.
What the hell is wrong with people!

Are you not perhaps in reality a little cross at yourself for not speaking up? It isn't necessarily unreasonable for someone sociable to want to socialise- the guy heard you were going and said he would like to come, if you didn't mind and you said you didn't mind. You could've said then I don't mind you sharing the taxi but I'd like to do the trip alone. What is the retreat for? Personal development related? Push yourself to speak up.

You need to be clear and honest, there is no need to male up bizarre stories it is not a TV movie

No one else is to blame if you can't say no

YADNBU. I had similar when holidaying in Italy. I spent an evening in the city of arrival before travelling into the countryside to a cookery course.I was really looking forward to dinner alone, enjoying the food, people watching, warmer evening air compared to home & a good book. I was sitting outside & a woman approached me, 'oh, are you on your own too, can I join you?'. I wanted to say no, but found myself saying yes. She then talked at me about her relationship difficulties for the entire meal. This & similar experiences have strengthened my resolve to say no when appropriate. Enjoy your day out & the art

Saying no politely assertively and calmly is an essential life skill. Am teaching my teens this. Dd1 had to ring up to decline a trial shift at a local hotel we talked through that she had to do it not turning up was unacceptable.

She was dreading but did it so well polite but firm and clear no mad excuses. A gentle laugh and “nice idea but I will be going on my own this time” ” was all it took to avert this angst.

Your second paragraph here and this You might live here now but you don't seem to have learnt much about the culture here. Just a tip: it's different in your follow-up post are both downright nasty and completely uncalled for. There’s a way to get your point across without resorting to that.

This is a near identical encounter to one I have had just this summer.

Some people cannot fathom that solitude is sometimes needed!

What an unpleasant response from another infamous keyboard warrior.

I think that's a bit harsh.

Women are conditioned to pacify/be kind/agreeable to men. Yes we rail against it but in some circumstances (especially when caught in the headlights surrounded by others) even the strongest of us can find ourselves agreeing to things we don't really fancy doing.

Any of my friends would describe me as "forthright, says what she means" type of person. Yet if I was in a group situation like the OP, especially with people I don't know, and someone said "I'll join you, if you don't mind" I'd probably react in the same way and seethe later!

I was being thoughtful and respectful, trying to support OP in getting what she (rightly) wants without escalating an awkward situation or letting it ruin her day out. I did not appreciate another poster calling me condescending.

But after a decade as a British citizen I'm happy to tell people who want to sneer at immigrants to sod off. The UK isn't some homogenous lump where no one ever has a different view.

I travel solo a lot and sometimes get people wanting to see the sights with me. Both men and women. Not always slimy men, just people who don't know how to do stuff alone.

I sometimes blame my DC. I say I just want time alone away from my hectic family life. Actually my DC are grown but they dont know that and it lets them down easy.

Presumably you’re now at breakfast. In front of others make direct eye contact with him, smile firmly and tell him you’ve thought about him accompanying you. Explain you had intended to be alone and that he’s welcome to copy your plans himself tomorrow.
Maintain eye contact and don’t speak further even if he does. Don’t share the car as it will stress you in case you can’t shake him off.
If you’re concerned you may appear rude, remember you’ll never see these people again.

I think this is the best way around it. And don’t feel bad, I would be exactly the same as you. I would even avoid leaving the office on time so I didn’t have to travel home with coworkers because I was looking forward to reading my book on the train in peace.

I don't think it's thoughtful or respectful to address a load of remarks taking the piss out of Mumsnet when the OP is actually coming onto Mumsnet to get some balanced advice. I don't see how your post was helping the OP deal with an awkward situation at all.

It seems that it's only you who gets to sneer. Rightho.

Some men will impose themselves on women because they feel entitled to women's company and so many women can't say no to men that the men are a bit clueless and don't realise they're imposing.

Some.beleive women genuinely don't feel.comfortable doing things alone and so think they're actually doing you a favour.

Some people (men and women) don't like doing things alone and will just think someone else is looking for company as much as they are.

There are plenty of people who think they're doing you a favour by not letting you spend the day on your own.

You just need to tell him.

What a leap. The OP has said absolutely nothing to suggest the man is difficult or scary.

Blinking heck. Maybe he heard about what you were doing and also likes art. It’s completely reasonable that @FrescoeDay wants the day alone, but the bloke hasn’t assaulted her for goodness sake.

Reasonable preference, but excessive reaction. Just out of interest, would your reaction have been as strong if the woman you originally mentioned it to wanted to come along?

That particular post wasn't actually directed at OP, and I think she's a smart woman and would immediately recognize that. The quote of another poster that I was clearly reacting to is a pretty good giveaway. That particular poster decided to have a go at me instead of just sharing her own view on the actual topic and letting others have a different one... theirs is an approach you apparently share and then some.

I've put a lot of care into composing genuine responses to OP (who has responded in kind) and to other posters who were actually engaging constructively.

The fact he stated he was accompanying you rather than checking with you suggests he isn’t great with normal boundaries. This will mean you need to be more direct with him in order for him to get the hint.

OP, as far as I can see you’re overreacting to something not said — did this guy actually say he was planning to spend the day with you?

Because I’ve been on or taught on several similar-sounding retreats in rural Italy, and it’s very much the norm to lift share to the station to get a train to the nearest city if you want a day off-site. It would be entirely normal for other people to take a lift if someone else had already ordered the car to make a specific train, with absolutely no intention to sit together on the train, far less spend the day together. The driver/taxi is part of the service offered by the retreat. Anywhere I’ve been if it had emerged that two retreatants were both heading to the city for the day, they’d be asked to share the taxi to the station, if possible to coordinate timings to get back later. With zero expectation that they were spending the day together.

This is perfect. Noone should worry about being "rude" to people who are rude to them first- and he was rude, muscling in on your plans without even checking you wanted it.

In the taxi, just say "should we meet back at the train at 5,so that you can share the car home?" Simple. That may be his plan anyway. If he suggests staying together - "no I'd rather do my own thing as planned". Simple

Yes, just (politely) brush him off. You don’t even know the guy. You don’t have to trot around after him all day.

Yes, you are massively unreasonable to not be able to say No in a polite, light hearted but assertive way

The irony.