solo day out - unwanted company

[FrescoeDay]

I actually know I'm not being unreasonable but my reaction may be out of proportion and I need help wording my response for my desired outcome - solitude.

I'm on a sort of retreat in Italy. Tomorrow I arranged to go on a day trip away from the base to look at some art. I'd arranged for the car to the station, bought my train ticket and was looking forward to it. I told my next door room mate who told someone else who over dinner tonight said he was coming along 'if I didn't mind.' Of course I don't mind him going to the town and looking at the art. If he is here a week it is his opportunity. Of course I don't mind if he catches the same train - although, honestly, I don't want to chat and be friendly and 'on' for an hour plus on the train there (and back?!) Why should I?

I do not want to spend 6 hours going around museums galleries, churches, having lunch, with a stranger. I prefer to look at art alone at my own pace and have my own responses. But over dinner I could hardly say that. The prick (pardon me) cornered me. I am so angry I'm finding it hard to relax. This may be disproportionate. The thing is I am quite able to be cold and freeze people if I feel like it - but I don't want to introduce awkwardness let alone animosity. I am meeting the driver of the retreat tomorrow morning and this other unwanted guest. I don't want to stop him if this is his one chance to go to the town. But I refuse to have my day stolen from me because I end up being polite to this man. I need a healthy middle ground. I am 46. I can't believe I am still being imposed on like this. I don't want to snap but I may.

Thanks for hearing me out. Perspective needed. This has touched a nerve you can tell. I would just never ever do this.

How many women's horrible encounters begin with the words "I didn't want to be rude" or "I politely.....".

Be rude, if you need to. He was rude by inviting himself along. Fuck being polite. Don't think of it as rude or impolite. Think of it as blunt and assertive.

Just tell him you have plans that don't include him. Don't tell him you will be alone either. Say nothing about that. You could be meeting someone else for all he knows. It's none of his sodding business.

I've recently had to undertake a course of cognitive behavioural therapy, due to past trauma, that turned into a massive lesson on not being a people pleaser and how to be assertive. There was a large portion on being blunt and assertive, which can be perceived by others as rude and impolite.

Really sorry but I read posts like this on mumsnet and I think ffs have people got nothing really to worry about . Like seriously you called him prick the guy just asked if he could tag along why all the god dam hate so much argg from you. Just say not being funny but I need solitude which is why I am doing this retreat maybe he was looking for friendships but you can say I am not on here to find friends and just do you. But come on why can't folks bloody communicate anymore

Well said @Daltonbear1

That is so annoying. He shouldn't have done that. He maybe is awkwardly trying to make friends with you. I think when you get there you should just say, okay, what time will we meet back up for the taxi. And if he says he wants to walk about with you just say, oh I thought you just wanted to share a lift. I would like to spend time alone today. It will be awkward, but it's his fault not yours. I hate when people step on our boundaries because we feel like we have to be polite

Yes cos heaven forbid anyone try to make friends christ almighty it's such a sin. What the hell is wrong with people nowadays such empty vessels

When you're in the car on the way to the station I would ask him how long he needs to do what he planned to in town so that you can coordinate being back at the same time to be picked up by the driver. If he says he thought you were spending the day together just look quite surprised and say you think there has been a misunderstanding, you were planning and looking forward to a day alone.

When you get to the station just say you'll see him back there for pick up, you hope he has a nice day and then just walk off and find a seat on the train on your own.

You have really worked this up to be something it didn’t need to be!!
As I have got older (I’m not old but you know what I mean) I don’t really have issue with being straight down the line with people that need it. Not rude just clear cut. It’s best for everyone in the long run. Then we all know where we stand.

I think the fact it's going to be very hot tomorrow is a great excuse to change your plans.

If he also decides to rearrange, there's the opportunity to spell it out to him.

I agree totally with @MaterCogitaVera

It just reminds me of being at a pub and a group of men acting like there was something wrong with me and asking if I was depressed because I wasn't interested in talking to them. It just seems pushy. I'm the type to holiday alone and I would hate the presumption and imposition

🙄🙄🙄

He's not a prick and he isn't imposing on you. He asked if you didn't mind and that was your opportunity to say, well I'm happy to share the car to the train station to save you money but I've got my own itinerary and plans to do stuff on my own.

Saying he cornered you makes you sound feeble that you can't state your own mind.

You need to speak to him again and say, oh about the trip into town I didn't make it clear that I have my own plans once we are there but I don't mind sharing the car to the train station. I want the day to myself.

It just reminds me of being at a pub and a group of men acting like there was something wrong with me and asking if I was depressed because I wasn't interested in talking to them. It just seems pushy. I'm the type to holiday alone and I would hate the presumption and imposition

But there's a difference between a group of men pestering a lone woman, asking what's wrong with them, and refusing to take a polite no versus one person asking another politely once if they mind company. Those guys in your memory were being pushy jerks.

I tend to need and enjoy alone time, so I look at a person sitting alone with a book or whatever and think "oh that looks nice" while looking at bunch of people in a loud, shouty group downing drinks and shudder a bit, thinking about how overwhelmed I would feel. But that's me projecting my own preferences onto others, thinking how I would feel in that situation. Extroverts tend to do the same with their own preference, seeing people in a group having fun making noise and thinking "that looks fun, I'd love to join in" and seeing the person in the corner quietly people watching and think "oh they look lonely I should be friendly." Because if that extrovert were in a corner people watching, they would likely feel lonely. For every person who wants to go wander through museums by themselves all day (hello, that's me) there's one who wishes they had someone else to go wander with and talk about the art. We can't expect others, especially strangers, to anticipate our personal preferences. But we can (and should) expect them to respect our preferences once we actually communicate them.

People like what? They're far from town, op has arranged a car into town. Asking if he can share the car doesn't make him the mysogonistic bastard some people are implying. She smiled and said yes. For all of knows he could be thinking "gosh, I hope she doesn't expect me to hang around all day! I just didn't want to get the driver to do the same journey twice.

Op I'd go with the "so it makes sense to get back to the car at the same time, I was thinking X"

It may be a lot of angst over nothing

Normal people would say “oh I hear you’re heading to X tomorrow, I was thinking of doing that, I’d love to hear about it when you get back”, leaving the door open for you to say “oh why don’t you tag along?” or equally “great, I’ll tell you about it tomorrow at dinner”
This is normal social etiquette where you show you’re interested but don't foist yourself.
Foisters can do one.

That’s unnecessarily harsh and snide. Women get cornered into things all the time and are socialized to be nice and accommodating and non-confrontational to get out emotionally or physically unscathed. She’s allowed to feel angry.

Even the effort to have to assert boundaries is an effort you shouldn’t need to make - especially on a retreat FGS.

So yes, tell him and don’t feel you have to lie about it. I fancied a quiet day alone.

He just caught you off guard and you responded in the moment in public.

Its great that you are attending to your real feelings and are focused on sorting it out.

I would drop him a text ahead to say you plans are to spend the day alone but happy to sharethe taxi - this gives him the opportunity to not go if he had assumed he could spend all day with you.

For what its worth I think he has pushed boundaries and there is likley another agenda at play - but all we have to do is be assertive politely asap.

“When you're in the car on the way to the station I would ask him how long he needs to do what he planned to in town so that you can coordinate being back at the same time to be picked up by the driver. If he says he thought you were spending the day together just look quite surprised and say you think there has been a misunderstanding, you were planning and looking forward to a day alone.”

I came on to suggest pretty much the same tactic as this.” ^^

This!
I like to explore alone and a stranger lagging along would be galling.

I think the best thing is to open the conversation strongly “ so, John, what are your plans for your day? It’s so good to be able to go off on your own and have the whole day to yourself isn’t it. If we meet up on the train coming back you can tell me about your town name experience.” Emphasis on your.

If he asks what your plans are be a bit evasive “ I have things in mind, but actually I am going to go with how I feel. That’s the wonderful thing when you don’t have to fit in with other peoples plans.”

I am furious for you.
I think, while in theory you know perfectly well that you will be able to get out of traipsing about with him - and you will - I think you are angry because you sense that he might not care that much about the art itself necessarily and is looking for an excursion to tag along with, because he is more comfortable with company, and he has made his comfort your problem.

I hate this with the fire of a thousand burning suns. Don't sit with him on the train. Address this before you get on the train - if it's hot and you decide to postpone, he might too! in which case - or in any case - say in the car, or before you get in the car, "I am going to be spending the whole day alone, so please excuse me when I go and sit by myself on the train" or however you want to phrase it.

I have a horrible feeling he might not go on his own, which, obviously, is revolting, but all the same it would be nice to give him a heads up so he knows what he is (not) getting.

Say you need a day of contemplation alone. If he pushes, tell him what you said here, that you want to look at the art at your own pace in solitude.

Thursday - clement - sounds lovely!

I am surprised at the posts saying he did nothing wrong. He invited himself on your solo day out, placing you in the position of publicly being the "bad guy" if you said in response, in front of the others, "Yes, actually, I do mind." He put you on the spot, in public. He didn't phrase it in a considerate way - so clearly he is not considering your preferences and desires and comfortability at all. I hope you can elude him and whatever is game is, and enjoy your pleasant solo day.

He invited himself on your solo day out, placing you in the position of publicly being the "bad guy" if you said in response, in front of the others, "Yes, actually, I do mind." He put you on the spot, in public.

Sometimes this is people being jerks. But more often it's because that person prefers a more direct communication style and would themselves feel totally fine responding to a similar request with "actually I was looking forward to a day by myself," so they're just treating others as they would like to be treated. They're not thinking about OP feeling awkward or like the "bad guy" because there's absolutely no reason for her to feel that way in their mind.

Other posters have talked about how they want people to dangle hints and hope the person picks them up and invites them, and for them that's being polite. That sort of dancing around things expecting people to read between the lines is absolutely exhausting to me, not polite or considerate. Neither approach is inherently right or wrong, we're just all different and have to find a way to rub along together without always assuming our own discomfort means someone else has wronged us.

It wasn't a request though - this person informed OP he was coming along with her, tagging an "if you don't mind" on by the sounds of things, which didn't sound like it was actually meant as a question.