Dil trying to ruin my relationship with my dd

[worldlyweather]

When my son met his now wife he was still living at home as was my dd.
Dil used to spend a lot of time at our house with ds but admittedly my dd didn't take to her straight away and while my dd didn't realise she was here dd came in mocking her and she overheard.
Ds and dil then moved to their own house and have since married and had a child, I didn't go to the wedding as dd was excluded.

Dil wants nothing to do with my dd and ds has backed her decision, this means our dd has never even met her nephew and misses her brother and is utterly heartbroken by all this.
I haven't met him either as I have been instructed not to come with my dd but have decided not to exclude her knowing this is so hurtful and have explained my reasons to ds and dil.
I have tried to get my ds to put things right with his sister but he's not interested and is refusing to see me at my home because she might be there and I will not turn her away because they don't want to be friendly.
Ds says I should be on their side as dd did wrong and I shouldn't protect her but I feel this is an overreaction and needs to be addressed, while I agree that she was perhaps unkind she didn't deserve to be cut off.

The family have been invited to visit but again this is to be with the exclusion of my dd who is devastated and so far we've stayed away until she's included, unfortunately this doesn't look like it's ever going to happen and I miss my son and I'm missing out on my first grandchild.
They have never made any ultimatum but it feels like there's an invisible ultimatum that if I want a part in their life it's to be at the exclusion of dd or I lose the relationship with them altogether.
I feel in an impossible position as in my mind I'm standing by my dd over dil but my son sees it that I'm standing by my dd over him and that I'm choosing not to see them by choosing her.

I agree with your son, you are refusing to see your own grandchild because you're insisting on coming with your daughter instead of on your own! She did wrong to your DIL and clearly offended her! So why don't you see your daughter straight, tell her to give a SINCERE apology, maybe in a letter/card, and admit she was wrong, maybe then you can get your family back together? Very sad your grandson has missed out on seeing family because you can't seem to see what the real problem is here!

If you actually want to fix this, and regardless of whether you think your DS has overeacted, you and your DD need to offer a wholehearted, non-defensive apology for her remarks and your behaviour since. I suggest hand-written letters
from DD to DiL and you to DS.

Don’t make it conditional on seeing them again.

If you do that, there is decent chance it will mend the rift.

if your DD refuses to apologise, she has made her own bed, and you should build your own relationship with your son without her.

Did your daughter apologise? Sounds like she needs to make amends.

*I have tried to get my ds to put things right with his sister but he's not interested and is refusing to see me at my home because she might be there8

Why is it up to him? Why are you minimizing your DDs behaviour? Has she ever apologised and explained herself to DiL. Why are you focusing on this poor woman who has been the target of nasty behaviour? You sound very invested in seeing DiL as the problem, but the real issue is your DDs bad behaviour and your excusing of it. Do you also not like DiL? That would be my assumption if I were here and heard someone mocking me to you. To be frank, it does not sound like either of you deserve contact with their child - they don't owe you anything and you and DD have both behaved badly.

You are saying this is so hurtful to your daughter? How about your son when you didn’t go to the wedding to spare your daughter’s feelings.
what on earth did your daughter say to mock her s’n’law that has lasted this long and been this toxic?

Your son isn't asking you to choose at all. He's an adult, you need to respect his decision about his relationship with his sister and stop being weird by requiring him to treat you and your DD as a package deal.
It doesn't sound like your DD has made any effort to fix things, and if you want to try to influence your children you'd be better off encouraging her to do that.
It's awful that you missed your son's wedding and aren't making any effort to see your grandchild. Both you and DD need to take responsibility for your behaviour and work on being the kind of people who your son actively wants in his own life and his child's life.
There's nuance depending on what your DD actually said to/about your DIL and how she's acted since, but not that much nuance because what you've done to your son is so hurtful and you don't show any sign of acknowledging his feelings.

There are some things in life that I wouldn’t forgive.

Walking in and hearing someone speak badly about me? I could forgive that with a genuine apology and a change in behaviour going forward.

Choosing to not attend my wedding? Choosing to not meet my child? Choosing my SIL over my DH (when SIL is unquestionably in the wrong)? I don’t think I would forgive that.

I don’t know what you hope to achieve though. You’re the one who is missing out. Their lives are going on without you and you’re missing all the happy, exciting moments. If you’re not careful it will get past the point of return, where it’s been so long since you’ve been part of their lives that it becomes the norm and doesn’t seem worth the effort of trying to bring you back into their life.

Your dd 'didn't take to her' and 'may have been unkind'? You are very much minimising your dd's actions to her future sil. I'm not surprised your dil wants nothing to do with her sil. Especially if she hasn't properly genuinely apologised. Even if she has it will be hard to forgive.
You on the other hand, have entirely free choice about seeing your son and grandchild. Why are you sticking up so strongly for our Dd when she was in the wrong?

You're as bad as your DD. This is down to you two, not the DIL you want to blame. I'd have told your DD where to go if I found her being two faced, mocking me behind my back. You then compounded it you supported DD. What did you think was going to happen?

Echoing others, without the background, I have to say I am in agreement with your DS and DIL. They aren't excluding you, you're excluding yourself.

What did your DD say? How old is she? Did she apologise?

Without this info there is little point in posting @worldlyweather

There is a lot of information missing here for people to be able to advise. How old was DD when this happened and what did she say? Did she apologise when she was caught out? I appreciate you're in a difficult situation here between your children but there seems to be a stubborn refusal to deal with the situation and try and sort it out. Instead you're backing your DD at the expense of your son and have missed his wedding and meeting your grandchild. That is pretty hurtful. He is right to support his wife but that is unless you come back and say that DIL was abusive to DD too. What a bloody mess. I think you need to expand on the situation here so that you get the right feedback.

You’re leaving a lot of stuff out here. Crucial information.
How old is everyone involved? Especially your DD.
What was she mocking? I would feel differently depending on what it is. Mocking anyone is mean, but mocking someone for a bad haircut or ugly shirt is different from mocking someone based on something they can’t change. Accent, religion, race is very different.
The fact these things are left out and the vagueness of this post is suspect imo.

“I have tried to get my ds to put things right with his sister ”. Your DS doesn’t need to put anything right. It’s your DD who has been rude and bullying towards DIL. She has caused the situation with DS.

You choose sides. You have caused the break down of your relationship with DS. You need to say sorry for your behaviour, never mention DD again to DS and hope you can salvage some thing of a relationship with DS and DIL.

I think your DIL and your DS are behaving appallingly. However, I would still see them separately as your relationship with your GC is at stake and at the end of the day it sounds like you getting in the middle won’t help. Only DD and DS can sort this out-
you have tried. Set a boundary that you will not exclude your DD and you will not hear anything bad spoken about her. But also get on with having a separate relationship with their family.

I really don't understand. this has been going on for at least a few years here? Surely, at the TIME, your DD should have apologised unreservedly and completely and the whole problem would have disappeared?

I can only assume therefore that there's loads more to this. Did DD apologise? Did you think that her comments were okay and valid? If she did apologise, why did DIL and DS continue to be so anti-DD? was it the tip of the iceberg? And why on earth did you decide to boycott their wedding?

You have been absolutely awful. Your DS and DIL didn't cut you out. You chose to walk away and choose a side.

You didn't have to choose either side, you could have had an independent relationship with both sides.

Dd was 24 at the time 4 years ago, 4 years this has been going on!
Dd hasn't apologised but she didn't deliberately say it for her to hear, she was just pretending to be her and having a laugh with it as she didn't particularly take to her she thought only we could see/hear.
It's different if it's to deliberately offend but surely in your own home to your own parents it's not her fault she was there and saw/heard.
Also she's not had a chance to apologise if she's not welcome and how can I see her excluded by from her own family?

Now seen update

Ok well DD definitely needs to apologise.

Depends whether the daughter has apologised and asked for forgiveness.

Aaah, so you're THAT parent. The one who says, "yes, my child hurt your child but she didn't mean to and actually, your child shouldn't have been in the way anyway".

I have no doubt whatsoever now that this is the tip of the iceberg.

Also, for the record, if DS makses fun of one of DD's friends, even though that friend is NOT HERE, or vice versa, we tell the relevant child to stop. Because it's unkind and unncessary.

A 24yo should know that mockery hurts. Until you accept your daughter wasin the wrong, you won't be able to move past this

I can see why you feel you're between a rock and a hard place. Things would improve if your daughter was willing to make a genuine apology so what is her view of this breakdown in her relationship with her brother? Equally important, what is your son's usual approach to apologies, has he never made a mistake and been forgiven?

Your update is exactly why you have this problem. Your dil deserved an apology and it could have been sent by text if they haven’t been in the same room since. Your dd should have apologised and gone out of her way to make amends immediately.

Your son is right that you are choosing your rude daughter over him and his child.