Contributions from (pensioner) MIL to household

[PaterPower]

My MIL has been living with my partner (her DD) and I for about 18 months.

When she first moved in, we set contributions at £400pm. She was still in the process of selling her property and had ongoing bills, so fair enough. She agreed at the time that her contribution would go up once the sale completed. That happened about 2 months ago.

We reminded her on Friday about the promise to up what she was paying. She’s declared that she “doesn’t agree” that she should, mainly based on my DP’s DD (her granddaughter, early 20s) paying less. We’re not charging my DSD much because she’s trying to save a deposit and she’s not on a massive salary (but does work FT).

My MIL’s £400 goes a long way. We cook for her, change her bed linen, provide support on admin tasks, take her to her (many) medical appointments, shopping trips when she wants to go out and it covers all her food, electricity, our additional heating costs etc - basically everything.

She has mobility issues and can no longer cook anything more than a microwave meal (and even that only with some help). She helps load and put the laundry on and she will help with loading and unloading the dishwasher on occasion. She’ll occasionally wipe down the kitchen tops. I don’t begrudge what she does and doesn’t do, just adding it for context.

Her regular income from various pensions is good - she’s not scraping around for money, particularly now that 99% of her monthly outgoings stopped with the sale of her property.

AIBU for asking for an increase in her payment to £600 pm?

I gthink the cost she'd pay without you is actually irrelevant. What's relevant is a) what she can afford to pay and b) what is reasonable for you to be compensated for the cost of having her with you.

So, assuming she has at least a decent pension and/or assets, then yes, £400 is ridiculous and it's reasonable for you and your DP to feel frustrated that she is adding quite a lot of financial, emotional and practical burden to you, without any sort of compensation. For example, if she was paying £700 ,the time you're spending taking her to appointments etc is time that perhaps you'd usually be doing cleaning or other chores which could now be outsourced to make life easier for everyone.

Id be getting in some brochures for local care homes

Do you know what her income is and whether she can afford to pay you more? it sounds like she could be claiming attendance allowance - is she? If so then you or your wife could potentially claim carer's allowance.

What does it actually cost you to have her living with you?

If she has been diagnosed with dementia she is no longer understanding the value of money. Tbh the best thing would be to look at supported living accommodation for her where they would provide a certain amount of care hours a day. Or if you feel she is getting beyond that stage look in to nursing homes.
Yes, it comes at a cost as she will have to self fund from the proceeds of her sold property. Possibly is this the reason you have not gone down this route already?

I would avoid trying to buy in retirement sheltered / assisted living if you can
1- they are only good for that are moderately independent and don’t have complex needs

if there is serious care needs like dementia/ Alzheimer’s then a lot of the help goes out the window and some places have asked people to leave

someone posted about this a few months ago

They are a bitch to sell - and you often have to sell at huge loss

you will have to pay service charges / maintenance charges council tax while trying to sell somethin that only a tiny percent of the population want

My MIL pays £1000 a month to live with my BIL. She did not sell her house but rents it out and part of the money comes from this. Along with a state pension she gets a teachers pension (not a full pension).

They do a lot for her cooking, cleaning, clothes washing, taking her to appointments, etc. They never leave my MIL in the house on her own for more than two hours, so it is quite restrictive. My BIL is retired so that helps. She has limited mobility so my BIL has also adapted their home (stair lift, ramps, etc).

My MIL is happy to pay this amount and thinks it is fair.

Bearing in mind my dad was paying £1,050 a week for his care in 2012 I would say she is getting a good deal!

I agree re increase. Whilst ur partner does not like confrontation I thjnk this must vone from.her sbd not u. She will cast u as the villain, she is unlikely to do this with her daughter.

What has your MIL done with the money from the sale of her house ? Invested / saved prudently would give her extra income. Surely she can pay you out of that ?

My df has a 30 minute carer everyday to chk he's OK and help with medication.
That alone is £450 per month.

Your mil is totally unreasonable.

The only fair thing to do is split the actual costs by 4, accounting for each adult in the home, and she pays her 1/4. Have a look at PIP, if she is in a position where she needs more and more care, she can claim somewhere around the £90 per week mark, which will cover your extra expenses. Ideally do this before her dementia deteriorates. You can't charge extra for doing her admin, helping her etc, her son should do that anyway.
Edited to add - make sure someone close gets power of attorney - not to get her money, but to make sure her affairs are looked after. It might be better if this was a relative outside of the home, so that you don't have a conflict of interests.

Tell her you understand the objection and you’ll charge DSD the same. If she’s OK with that, follow the advice about putting money aside.

If she still objects, then that’s not the real issue. Tell her that it’s fair enough that she doesn’t want to pay any more and she can live elsewhere. You’ll help her find somewhere.

Honestly, your DP should be doing this, not you.

We have, but not recently and it probably is overdue again.

As I commented upthread, when she came to live with us she was asleep 18 hours a day on average. We honestly thought she had about 6 months to live, she was in a hell of state physically. That changed, largely because we’ve fed and looked after her properly and got her medications changed.

But, as she’s got physically better, she
a) can’t remember how bad she’d got and
b) thinks she could live independently.

The reality is that she couldn’t. Not without a lot of expensive third party support. But she doesn’t / hasn’t acknowledged that.

I’ll talk to DP again tonight and suggest we have a more in depth conversation

Her PIP payment means carer’s allowance isn’t an option (they take one off the other, from what we’ve read).

Another thing to remember, with you saying she hadn't been expected to have much longer to live, your dh will probably get the inheritance from the sale of her home? So unless she is actually costing you more than the £400, you could leave it, knowing you'll get the inheritance in the long run anyway. I'm not trying to be cold, just pragmatic.

TBH, the initial decision was just along the lines of “shit, she can’t continue living like this” (because she wasn’t able to look after herself properly), rather than any sort of analysis / deep discussion of the costs.

The dementia diagnosis was later (probably about 8 months ago or so). We didn’t get to that immediately because there was so much else going on with her physically.

Some of the problem is she has no memory whatsoever of the state she was in at that time. It’s literally a complete blank to her.

It's important that if she is still quite well your partner looks into getting power of attorney for finances and/or for health. They are two separate things now. If her dementia progresses and POA isnt in place it can take months for the court of protection to go through to get access to her money. This is important if she ends up needing a residential care placement. The POA for health is nice to have but if your partner is next of kin she should be consulted about her mothers care if her dementia worsens.
edited for typos

OP, I suggest you have a proper benefits check.PIP is paid to the person who has the disability. It is non-means tested and is not taken into account in the calculation of other benefits. Carers Allowance is paid to the person who is caring. It is taken into account if the Carer is receiving other benefits for example universal credit or state pension and in that case there would be a reduction of the carers benefits/pension. What age is your MIL? PIP is not normally awarded to someone over pension age.
I would also strongly advise your MIL applying for attendance allowance. It is also non-means tested. Our family have been in a similar situation and my in law insisted on pay ing much much more than your MIL does now because they understood it was much less than they would have been paying for Carers.

My DP and her sister have POA. My MIL is getting, with PIP, State pension and a couple of private ones, over 2K per month. Plus there’s the house proceeds generating interest now. She’s no longer paying council tax, utilities, food bills, insurance or pretty much anything else. Her only regular outgoing is a mobile phone contract (and the £400).

We did look at attendance allowance but I think we concluded it wasn’t an option. I can’t remember why not, but both DP and I work FT (nights and WFH respectively) so it may have been because on paper we’re working too many hours, whereas the reality is that we both provide care for her around our jobs (like many thousands of others do - I’m not saying we’re anything special in that regard).

So her 2 daughters have POA ?

They have control of her money so surely they can pay a reasonable sum to your household?

She’s had PIP for many years due to ongoing health issues. She did get the extra bit that allowed her to get a car on Motability, but they withdrew that after a (dodgy as hell) assessment and appeal. That was a few years ago, but she still gets upset that they took it off her.

Frankly it was probably a blessing, as she’d be a danger to life on the roads on the very few days she’d still be physically capable of driving.

It doesn’t work like that. She still has mental capacity. You can’t (or shouldn’t) take over finances when she’s still able to make her own decisions.

This is really tricky. Is the money to contribute to the mortgage or what is the situation? I’m not sure I would take money for a mortgage, or not much. If I was renting then absolutely, or if I was losing money in some way, ie not taking a lodger. I would take a contribution to bills. This might just be me though. I don’t like the way the GM argues about it because of SD, if you asked and she can afford it she definitely should pay…

I pay £110 a week for DS in a private house at uni. This includes bills, but not insurance, so add about another £5 a week for that. Add 1/4 of council tax so about £70 a week.

So, with my rough calculations based on a (very) affordable town I am on £550 ish a month.

Add on food at about £150 a month, petrol for car and I think you’d comfortably be on £780. Then start on caring costs….. I think it’s fair to say that she’s onto a winner on £600/ month.

OP, I realise you have a lot on your plate but I’m going to repeat it.. you really need a proper benefits assessment check. I think you have carers allowance and attendance allowance all mixed up. Carers Allowance which the carer applies for, will not be available to you if you both Work and earn over the threshold of about £150. Attendance Allowance is non-means tested and is applied for by, and paid to, the person being cared for. They then use that money to pay for Care.
You really really need a proper benefits check. I know it doesn’t address the wider issues ( I believe your mother-in-law should be contributing substantially more) but it would be a health. Best wishes