Clip-on tie at secondary school

[LongStoryLong]

Hi all, my first time in AIBU 😬 so you know, have at it!

My thing is this: my DC is going into Y7 at a large comprehensive secondary school in our town. It’s a grammar area, so all the children took the 11+ and most will have failed it, which is why they’re not going to the grammar school down the road (I think this is important context).

We went uniform shopping the other day, and I was dismayed to find that it’s ONLY possible to buy a clip-on tie for this school- real ties are not made.

AIBU on several counts really:

1. how common is this? Does anyone else have secondary DC at a school where ONLY clip-on ties are available?

2. I find this demeaning- like they’re saying to the kids, you didn’t make the grade, here, have this baby tie. Is that my prejudice talking?

3. I don’t know how it works in the town, but I worry that this will be used as a way of othering our kids by the grammar kids. Sure, it’s mean, but it’s a physical manifestation of their otherness, and I don’t see why that’s desirable.

FYI, we’ll be new to the school, so I’m not going to kick up a fuss (yet?!) but I just want others’ views so I can temper my own really.

Thank you all!

Out of interest which countries are these and what was your experience of them? It doesn't reflect France, Germany, Switzerland and Denmark which are the countries who's secondary systems I am familiar with, having family there.

They had clip on ties at my DC's secondary .

No idea as to what they had at the other secondary in our town as you can't tell whilst they are on .

The only impact I would say is that because of this, DS didn't learn to tie a tie at school and the few times he needed it as a young adult, I had to do it for him . Then again - as he wasn't the most dexterous child (Velcro shoes needed), I suppose it saved time in the morning and anxiety after PE.

My DS wore velcro shoes in year 7 and 8, and so did quite a lot of other boys, he never had any comments or bullying. He also had trainers with elastic laces for PE.

Then don't put it in the dryer..

Clip on ties in secondary schools are very common. I’ve never taught in a secondary that doesn’t have them. It’s related to health and safety and also makes it easier for children with disabilities to access the uniform - plus it stops the students making ridiculously big knots with their ties (like we did in the 80s!). It’s really not a big deal and I think you’re massively overthinking.

Why do you need to wear a tie in school? Well you don't but it does seem a bit of an obsession in the UK,although I thought more schools were ditching them.

OP on your more reasonable concerns about how your DD will settle in the new school. Since she will be going to this school then it may be best to see how things go for a while. If you have any concerns about her, raise them with the pastoral support eg form tutor, head of year and they may well be able to 'keep an eye' or deal with specifics. How the school helps and encourages her is the main point and you may be pleasantly surprised.

I had a tie as part of my uniform at secondary school. It wasn't clip on, and part of the school rule was about it being done up properly of course, and about how long the tie had to be (so of course that meant teachers had to spend time policing this which I'm sure they'd rather not have had to do). A clip on one would have been so much easier.

But as a general point I think ties are a stupid part of a school uniform. There's a primary school near us that puts the reception children in ties ffs.

We had clip on ties as well as normal ties at our comp school more than 40 yrs ago. Most of us tied them in huge knots hanging halfway down our shirt placket. 😂

I prefer uniforms to be minimalist with no ties or stupid blazers either and luckily, they have neither at the school my DC attend.

I work for a school uniform company, the type of tie is usually requested by the school. Clip on ties are great for safety and to ensure the length hits requirement at all times.

Yes to your comments on ties!

And also yes to the rest of it. Everyone says it’s a wonderful school. The staff seem to like working there, and other parents say it’s so supportive and really wants the best for every child. On my part, I have no experience of such a big school. And I have been dismayed so far by the focus of staff on uniform policy, the children looking smart etc - things I don’t care about at all. Hopefully once she’s started the other stuff - supportiveness etc - will come to the fore.

Clip on ties have been compulsory at my DD's school for years and it's not a rough school with behaviour problems where the pupils are likely to be strangling each other on a daily basis - though of course teenagers do mess around and do stupid things from time to time in every school. It is however a school with a fairly strict uniform policy and the change was brought in to ensure conformity. There's a thread ongoing at the moment about trends you remember from your school days and there are loads of posts about ties being done with huge knots, tiny knots, tucked in different ways etc. You can't do that with a clip on tie.
I think you are reading too much into it OP. Plenty of sought after schools use clip on ties. I have a feeling that my nephew and niece's very expensive independent has them in fact - either that or they have super struct tie tying rules as they look identical on their school photos!
I can see that you're disappointed that your DD isn't going to the grammar school and that's understandable but try not to look for problems. A clip on tie not a sign of inferiority, or an indicator that the school is a dangerous place, it really is standard uniform at many, many places. The pupils probably won't like them, but you know what, kids at schools with regular ties probably don't like them either, or their blazers, or regulation school shirts etc. It really isn't an issue unless you make it one. It seems unlikely to me that the grammar school kids will make an issue of it either, but if they do, then maybe it's not such a great place anyway?? Try to find some positives in your DD's new school. It may not be your plan A but that doesn't mean she can't thrive there. I hope the transition goes smoothly.

Having only clip on ties has been the case in lots of places for absolutely ages. It means that kids don't try to strangle one another, and in other customer facing environments, angry people don't try it. Plus it looks smart and children with dyspraxia can have a well tied tie. You really are over thinking this.

It's quite common. It stops 'fashionable' ways of tying the ties. There is only one way to wear them if they're clip-on. Not too short / long / not enough / too many stripes showing etc.

This.
I’m so over all arguments for school uniform, as most workplaces, excluding those with uniforms, are much more relaxed.

There is no need for our children to swelter in blazers in the summer, and our school forbids coats covering them on school grounds in winter, or they did.

If they want uniforms, have non branded, unbadged affordable options or the argument that it stops poorer children being discriminated against falls apart

The poorer children will undoubtedly be the ones with the designer accessories anyway.

The teachers often wear unsuitable clothing, yet the children are there in their polyester suits, come hail or shine. In their uncomfortable shoes “as if they were attending a wedding “ according to the description for the boys shoes.

It was great to see Spanish students getting off their school bus, in t shirts, jeans and colourful rucksacks one year. Relaxed and comfortable.

This isn't your first post, though, is it?

Under a different user name, you posted two threads in the early hours of the morning in different sections of the site, about ten minutes apart, both asking questions about your teenage 'sons' and what sort of shirts and ties they should be wear, one at school at one at work.

Whatever your fetish is, take it elsewhere.

My son's grammar school had clip on ties. 🤷🏻‍♀️

It is health and safety/prevention. I feel you've more to worry about than a tie, it's the toilets I'd be concerned with 😳! It's the real world! Nothing or no body is safe, it's how you prepare your child for this jump. Cause the outside world, ain't to be taken lightly... So hold on tight!

This is not about grammar vs comp. All the schools have clip on ties where I live.

My son has autism and dyspraxia and goes to a large secondary school and it’s been bloody awful, to be honest. He’s academically flying and has made a few friends, but with a group of academic kids in the 5th year, 3 years above him.

Sadly, he’s been bullied constantly from the first year he was there and even by kids who were his buddies in primary school. However, I have been ‘that parent’ with the school and will continue to make a noise if things don’t improve this year. (3rd year).

We’re rural and our next nearest secondary school is a 30 min drive away so I’m reluctant to move him as there’s no guarantee it will be any better there. ☹️
We are also considering home schooling if there’s no improvement.

Unfortunately, we didn’t know about the bullying for several months as DS was very reluctant to say anything for fear of retribution.

@LongStoryLong Please be vigilant and look out for signs of unhappiness. I really regret not realising just how bad things were getting for him and took his quiet behaviour as normal teen angst.😢

Total non issue OP. Clip one are much safer, smarter and easier for kids. ( although better if they did away with them all together)

As a science teacher, I prefer clip on ties. It's surprisingly easy to get things caught or tangled in a busy lab. My staff lanyard is quick release for the same reason. Even sensible kids can trap a tie in a draw/door and get a nasty yank on the neck.

Fwiw I would prefer no ties at all and we usually take them off for practical work.

😂😂

My DS went to a grammar school about 15 years ago - they had normal
ties, and the boys used to 'peanut' each other - pull each others ties right so the knot was almost impossible to undo.

Grammar schools have idiotic behaviour too..

They have normal and clip on at my children's school. Pretty much all the children go for standard ties. No strangulation incidents yet.....

By fair the weirdest post in a while.

😂😂😂 oh wow, definitely not me, I was fast asleep all night! I guess a tie fetish is probably not THAT unusual though.