To think the Khelif issue is now raising more big questions in sport

[FishersGate]

Biological men should not be fighting women how is this even happening ?? Two 'women' failed eligibility tests by the IBA. Yet the IOC deem them suitable it's mind boggling

Your statements are factually incorrect and paint you in poor light. Anyone over the age of 40 will remember cases of white athletes being tested and excluded from competitions, sometimes unfairly (thinking about complete insensitivity to androgens disorders and bans that were lifted on appeal).

The IOC said the IBA was discredited in 2021 (there's also misinformation going around that it's because they're Russian). They refuse to say what testing they did or what the results are. People are assuming, because it was the IBA policy to require women to be XX.. And there is a lot of social media misinformation calling them men.

An XX/XY definition sounds simple but it is not. What happens to women who turn out to be 46,XY with CAIS, or Swyer syndrome? They have absolutely no advantage over someone who is 46,XX. It's also really tricky for people who come from countries or areas with less developed health systems as they are really likely to genuinely not know.

This really does seem to be a DSD issue and I don't think it's at all helpful to mix it with trans issues; saying trans activists do it doesn't make it good.

Its unfortunate but she has a advantage due to her male DNA, and its not fair or safe for who fights against her.

Maybe if she was in a different sport? but direct combat...no.

DNA alone does not give you an advantage.

The public has been lied to for so long about this issue in female sport. It's corruption and collusion, mostly over money but in recent years also a load of activism by those who saw DSDs as a wedge issue to get any man who wants it into female sport.

It's women who lose out, are cheated or injured because of it and these women always receive the least amount of sympathy because apparently for some reason we must be kind to sport cheats. Only those who cheat women though - everyone comes down hard on cheating in men's sports.

I'm under 40 and I knew about it! But it takes a bit more research, rather than being able to piously parrot talking points from social media that are only interested in the non-whiteness of the competitors with Y chromosomes, and ignore all the women who they beat and whose places they take who aren't white.

Oh please. That's very different from calling somebody transgender. We don't know the details of this case, but Caster Semenya, for instance, is indisputably male based on his specific DSD involving functioning internal testes. The fact that media reports are still delicately glossing around this and talking about "elevated testosterone (it's not - it's in rhe normal male range) is another matter.

And this.

Whatever Khelif was called at birth he/she has a male musculature and features. He/she's also been banned from boxing in a competition before. There is lots of discussion in the media which it's hard to make sense of. Obviously athletes deserve privacy but conjecture is understandable.

So now having “male features” becomes part of the criteria for exclusion?

If that naturally high level of testosterone is due to a person having testes, they don't belong in women's sports.

They don't have 'naturally higher testosterone'. The have normal range testosterone for men because they are male.

Whilst it is a shame that those males with DSD’s who have been socialised as female cannot compete women’s safety must come before biological males feelings

Do you not remember the whole Caster Semenya debacle? Ran as a woman but turned out to have a DSD?

Careful, c*s is considered offensive and you can get banned for using it.

Her and Imane's cases are entirely seperate,

No. Not entirely. What links them is the belief that they both have 'Y' chromosomes but want to compete in a sport reserved for those with 'XX' chromosomes.

That's the issue.

You're trying to obfuscate it.

I will quote another poster.

"There is no such thing as a healthy woman with “naturally high testosterone” that falls within the male range.

This tweet helps explain what the ranges are for men and women and it is very clear that there is no overlap in healthy individuals (women with cancerous tumours can have levels in the very low male range)."

x.com/hoovlet/status/1819017510005407984?s=46&t=vZsKCHJJ4lL6NrAoNyJFww

You can say it as slowly as you like, won't make it any less shit an argument. What's disingenuous is ignoring all the black and brown women who are affected by the likes of Semenya and Imane in women's sports. Because all women in sports are, and that includes the ones who aren't white whether you bother paying attention to them or not.

absolutely. But only those cis women who don’t conform to their assumptions/ ideals of femininity (see “has male features”) . As
you say these women who come under such vitriolic fire are almost always women of colour,

You can say it as slowly as you like, but the increased testosterone levels are down to that pesky xy chromosome.