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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Son dropped out of college and secretly studied other qualification

200 replies

SharpOliveHam · 24/07/2024 20:00

Son is 23. Very bright. Went to one of the top grammar schools in the UK. Got 100% in one of his maths A levels. But equally he leaves things to the last minute, possibly has ADD. If he’s not interested good luck getting him to do anything.

Son messed up his AS Levels (did well in one subject) and chose to leave his grammar school for the local college.

Son confessed that he messed up AGAIN at college and instead of repeating another year he actually dropped out of college and studied an Access course with a distance learning place.

He went to Edinburgh University! Paid for course with Saturday job money and birthday money. Son confesses to Dh and I he would study at the local town library. We received no letters or phone calls from the college.

I’m pleased he had the tenacity to do this but hurt he couldn’t confide in me. His siblings have been successful with academics - one is studying dentistry and the other is at Oxbridge. So assume pressure was a part of it.

I just wanted to share as I am still trying to process this. He told us he got AAB.

OP posts:
S1lverCandle · 26/07/2024 08:46

maddening · 26/07/2024 08:22

I joined mu degree in Edinburgh in year 2 as the 1st year was equivalent of a foundation which I had covered in England.

But op's son didn't do a foundation year in England, or if he did, the timeline is even weirder.

CautiousLurker · 26/07/2024 09:35

redskydarknight · 26/07/2024 07:48

If 100% of their peers are talking about university Open Days and the narrative at school is that bright children should progress through A Levels to university ... then that's symptomatic of the school that was chosen by the parent. i.e. the parent chose the school because that aligned with their own thinking (as OP has, in sending her child to a "top grammar".

I have a bright DD who has just finished Year 13. Not all her peers are talking about university and some of her friends from Year 11 did not progress through A Levels. DD is intending to go to university (also enocuraged to apply to Oxbridge but made her own decision not to) but the school made it very clear that there were other options, as we have at home. (My oldest did not go to university).

My same age niece goes to a very selective private school. One of the boys in her year group wanted to do a degree apprenticeship but he received zero support from the school in this aim as they were fully focussed in getting students into top universities (in fact, he was asked to complete a UCAS form even though he had no interest in going to uni).

I am guessing that your DD is more in the second type of environment than the first. So you will have to work much harder as a parent to counter the "must go to university" narrative if that's what you think. As a younger child, seeing that his siblings may have gone to university but that wasn't the natural order of things will also have helped with this.

Edited

Well, yes, as soon as you choose a school you are implicitly communicating expectations, aren’t you? But what parent selects a school that doesn’t have good academic outcomes - you don’t chose a school on the basis it’s results are a bit average, do you? Schools are ‘education factories’ so it’s counterintuitive to expect them to sell themselves on anything less than their academic results. Naturally, balanced parents would weight his against sports/extra curricular activities, school ethos etc.

In fact we chose a child centred, arts-orientated, non-selective private school precisely because we think children should find their own path and that this may involve art college, drama school, music school or and not just academic degrees from Russell Groups unis. However it IS a private school (chosen because both our DCs are ASD/ADHD and it is 4miles from us). We’re just boring middle class professionals, the first in our families to go to university but the cohort included the daughters of Oscar winning film directors, several famous emmy/bafta/oscar nominees, along with - I found out recently after my son’s recent Prom after-party - several tech and gaming billionaires.

Every one of those parents also believe in child centred education, creative approaches to learning and encouraged their kids to take their own path… but if you have successful parents in whatever walk of life, the subtext is they value drive and success. It’s natural that young people in this environment internalise this, rather than receive the message that ‘we want you to be happy so let’s talk about what that looks like for you’. I also acknowledge that as parents we clearly failed to underscore that message.

I very much suspect that OP and her son are in a similar position - that she has simply wanted what was best for her son but the message got twisted. A relationship like this can be rebuilt though, which is what we’ve spent the last couple of years doing with our child.

It’s taken several years, lots of college/arts college open days and hundreds of hours of conversations to convince her that we’d be 1000% supportive of doing an animation degree (which almost operates like an apprentice degree as far as I can see). We’ve even looked at apprentice schemes, but those still seem to require a degree! Explaining that you’d be as proud to see their name in the credits of a Cartoon Network/Pixar reel as you would be to see their sibling graduate from med school but - even when you absolutely genuinely mean it - can fall on deaf ears as you are swimming against the tide of all the other stuff.

If I were OP, I’d park the hurt at her son not having been honest and direct about it all and accept that along the way, the school and family culture lead to a misunderstanding that they now have the chance to clear up. He’s done amazingly well and has opened up now. It’s a great opportunity to renegotiate their relationship and to communicate that his happiness is paramount and that her love for him is not contingent on his success.

Gogogo12345 · 26/07/2024 10:40

redskydarknight · 26/07/2024 07:48

If 100% of their peers are talking about university Open Days and the narrative at school is that bright children should progress through A Levels to university ... then that's symptomatic of the school that was chosen by the parent. i.e. the parent chose the school because that aligned with their own thinking (as OP has, in sending her child to a "top grammar".

I have a bright DD who has just finished Year 13. Not all her peers are talking about university and some of her friends from Year 11 did not progress through A Levels. DD is intending to go to university (also enocuraged to apply to Oxbridge but made her own decision not to) but the school made it very clear that there were other options, as we have at home. (My oldest did not go to university).

My same age niece goes to a very selective private school. One of the boys in her year group wanted to do a degree apprenticeship but he received zero support from the school in this aim as they were fully focussed in getting students into top universities (in fact, he was asked to complete a UCAS form even though he had no interest in going to uni).

I am guessing that your DD is more in the second type of environment than the first. So you will have to work much harder as a parent to counter the "must go to university" narrative if that's what you think. As a younger child, seeing that his siblings may have gone to university but that wasn't the natural order of things will also have helped with this.

Edited

Hmm my kids secondary school was very much like this. You do GCSEs then A levels then go to uni. It's kind of trained into the kids from age 11.

And it's a regular comprehensive local school

redskydarknight · 26/07/2024 10:56

Gogogo12345 · 26/07/2024 10:40

Hmm my kids secondary school was very much like this. You do GCSEs then A levels then go to uni. It's kind of trained into the kids from age 11.

And it's a regular comprehensive local school

Odd that a regular local comprehensive school has no one that doesn't do A Levels and go to university ...

of course schools exist where the message is very much "get good GCSEs, get good A Levels, go to university" and the idea that there are any other possible paths is not mentioned.

There is a huge difference between
1.sending a child to such a school and claiming you would be supportive if they wanted to (or had to) do something different (but not actively mentioning this to them)
2.making it obvious to your child at every stage from starting secondary school that this is just one such path and you genuinely would be happy with whatever they choose

Much harder for a child in situation (1) to fight against the prevailing tide

The message I gave my children was that getting good GCSEs offered them more choices and made things easier but not the end of the world if they didn't; that doing A Levels gave them more choices if they wanted to head down certain paths, but other options existed and might be preferable for different future choices, and that the only reasons for going to university were because they loved their subject and wanted to and/or they needed a specific qualification for a future career. And most specifically not because anyone else thought they ought to.

I was brought up in a family like OP's where I was forced down a particularly high academic route because that was expected (and my parents put heavy pressure on me to do this; although they would deny this - but I also experienced the crying when I did less than perfectly). This was more about their need to be seen to have a high achieving child than what was best for me.
MN is full of threads from similar parents. I applaud OP's son for having the courage to break away from what was expected and follow his own path.

bridgetreilly · 26/07/2024 11:05

I think your response needs to be first that you are really, really proud of him. And second that you don’t ever want him to think he can’t tell you what’s going on, because you’ll love him and be proud of him no matter what. That you’re sorry you hadn’t made that clear to him earlier, but you want him to know now.

Gogogo12345 · 26/07/2024 11:41

redskydarknight · 26/07/2024 10:56

Odd that a regular local comprehensive school has no one that doesn't do A Levels and go to university ...

of course schools exist where the message is very much "get good GCSEs, get good A Levels, go to university" and the idea that there are any other possible paths is not mentioned.

There is a huge difference between
1.sending a child to such a school and claiming you would be supportive if they wanted to (or had to) do something different (but not actively mentioning this to them)
2.making it obvious to your child at every stage from starting secondary school that this is just one such path and you genuinely would be happy with whatever they choose

Much harder for a child in situation (1) to fight against the prevailing tide

The message I gave my children was that getting good GCSEs offered them more choices and made things easier but not the end of the world if they didn't; that doing A Levels gave them more choices if they wanted to head down certain paths, but other options existed and might be preferable for different future choices, and that the only reasons for going to university were because they loved their subject and wanted to and/or they needed a specific qualification for a future career. And most specifically not because anyone else thought they ought to.

I was brought up in a family like OP's where I was forced down a particularly high academic route because that was expected (and my parents put heavy pressure on me to do this; although they would deny this - but I also experienced the crying when I did less than perfectly). This was more about their need to be seen to have a high achieving child than what was best for me.
MN is full of threads from similar parents. I applaud OP's son for having the courage to break away from what was expected and follow his own path.

I did not say NO ONE didn't do A levels now did I? I said the ethos was based on that. Merely that is what's pushed onto them from the start and if you plan to leave at 16 and go to college etc then the school don't really give info on that route. Pretty much what you said in your second paragraph

anothervoice · 26/07/2024 12:46

OP - did you not wonder why he never had a piece of paper showing his A-level results on results day - as your two other children would have had?

DId you not wonder why his actual A-level certificates never came through the post? They need scanned copies of these to send to unis for their offer to be confirmed.

I don’t think you do A-levels on an Access Course do you? It’s a different type of qualification

Surely when he left the college, the head would have emailed you? As parents you must have been informed. They have an obligation to do so,

redskydarknight · 26/07/2024 12:59

anothervoice · 26/07/2024 12:46

OP - did you not wonder why he never had a piece of paper showing his A-level results on results day - as your two other children would have had?

DId you not wonder why his actual A-level certificates never came through the post? They need scanned copies of these to send to unis for their offer to be confirmed.

I don’t think you do A-levels on an Access Course do you? It’s a different type of qualification

Surely when he left the college, the head would have emailed you? As parents you must have been informed. They have an obligation to do so,

To be fair, I've never seen either of my children's results slips or their certificates. They told me they got x results and I said "well done". I didn't demand proof.

(And we didn't get certificates through the post; they had to go in to collect them which my DS didn't bother to do until nearly 2 years after he'd actually taken his A Levels).

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 26/07/2024 13:38

Didn't you have reports or parents evenings? We did for ours. With a third child that should surely have raised an alarm?

S1lverCandle · 26/07/2024 13:43

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 26/07/2024 13:38

Didn't you have reports or parents evenings? We did for ours. With a third child that should surely have raised an alarm?

Of course.

This tiger mum who values academic prowess so highly wasn't in the least interested in learning how her son was doing in 6th form. Sounds totally believable.

Gogogo12345 · 26/07/2024 14:12

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 26/07/2024 13:38

Didn't you have reports or parents evenings? We did for ours. With a third child that should surely have raised an alarm?

Not at college you don't.

SharpOliveHam · 26/07/2024 20:34

S1lverCandle · 26/07/2024 13:43

Of course.

This tiger mum who values academic prowess so highly wasn't in the least interested in learning how her son was doing in 6th form. Sounds totally believable.

How am i a tiger mum? Like i said after the age of 14 ish I largely left my kids to it. Even before then it was more “have you done your homework? Yes? Great”. I cant live their lives for them. Especially with three so close in age.

I have a business that takes up a significant amount of time. I trusted my kids (knowing they were in good environments at school) and gave input if and when needed.

The college didn’t have parents’ evening

OP posts:
OhcantthInkofaname · 27/07/2024 02:28

What I see is a person taking control of their future and controlling his own path to complete his education. Good for him. FFS all of you doom and gloom people back off.

In the US we have FERPA, Federal Educational Right to Privacy Act which does not allow parents access to adult (18^) students records without their permission.

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 27/07/2024 09:15

A good 16-18 college does. They even set up a page per student for events and monthly feedback, with a password for both parents and student. My kids went to two different colleges 30 miles apart, and both did parents evenings. Only a shit college would not.

Itisjustmyopinion · 27/07/2024 09:40

SharpOliveHam · 25/07/2024 12:30

Yes the scale of the deception is what is shocking.

This is a ridiculous reaction. If anything he took control of his own life and took his own path. That is something to be admired

If he “deceived” you to do that, then take a look at why. I don’t think it goes any further than your own house and that is something you and your DH should reflect on

Your reaction to his results was to cry? So you took his moment and made it about you. That’s not good parenting and probably why he did what he did

Gogogo12345 · 27/07/2024 14:05

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 27/07/2024 09:15

A good 16-18 college does. They even set up a page per student for events and monthly feedback, with a password for both parents and student. My kids went to two different colleges 30 miles apart, and both did parents evenings. Only a shit college would not.

A 16-18 college maybe But not a college that has students of all age groups -which doesn't make them shit btw

anothervoice · 29/07/2024 06:44

Any college with 16-18 year olds (which I assume this was) has to have contact details of a parent / guardian / next of kin for emergencies. Even if they don’t have parents’ evenings, they will email parents sporadically - eg, if there is a safety issue / open day / something to be aware of.

Gogogo12345 · 29/07/2024 07:57

anothervoice · 29/07/2024 06:44

Any college with 16-18 year olds (which I assume this was) has to have contact details of a parent / guardian / next of kin for emergencies. Even if they don’t have parents’ evenings, they will email parents sporadically - eg, if there is a safety issue / open day / something to be aware of.

Hmm my DS was at a college a couple of years ago. They had my details obv for emergencies but never got contact from them otherwise. The college ag range was from 15- 80

When I was 16 and at college I was working full time hours around it and lived in my own place. Cant imagine why on earth they would be hunting out my parents for a parents evening. Lol

AreThereSomewhereIslands · 29/07/2024 15:25

SharpOliveHam · 24/07/2024 20:43

Actually this is a funny story. One of his siblings looked up the exam schedule and questioned him as to why he was not up late studying. I think he told us he felt prepared and we just believe him. He was always in his computer -

Edited

Sorry if I'm misunderstanding the timeline here, but one of his siblings looked up the A Level exams schedule, and then later OP says that she or her DH would drop him off at the station on the days of each of his A Level exams...in 2020?

...Would that be the same 2020 where we had a pandemic, were in lockdown for months, and educational establishments were closed and exams cancelled? And yet later that same summer the OP's DS still pretended he'd gone into college to collect his exam results? And nobody questioned this?

NoNoNona · 29/07/2024 15:29

So your son sorted himself out, without drama, and has done really well.
Well done to him!
The question is, did he do it to avoid family drama or interference?

AreThereSomewhereIslands · 29/07/2024 15:46

Gogogo12345 · 25/07/2024 13:47

Ok it seems quite simple to me. He would've been born in Aug 2000. Started access course Sept 2019 and finished it summer 2020. Started uni Sept/Oct 2020 just after he turned 20. A 4 year course would've finished May/June 2024. He will be 24 in August ( next month)

...So, @Gogogo12345's timeline must be correct, as @SharpOliveHam states on 25/07/2024 at 12:28 that her DS will be 24 this August.

So he did somehow fake sitting all his A Level exams and collecting his results in person in the middle of a pandemic, with schools closed and exams cancelled - and somehow his high-achieving and engaged parents and siblings failed to notice any inconsistencies in this? ...Come on!

CautiousLurker · 29/07/2024 17:19

AreThereSomewhereIslands · 29/07/2024 15:46

...So, @Gogogo12345's timeline must be correct, as @SharpOliveHam states on 25/07/2024 at 12:28 that her DS will be 24 this August.

So he did somehow fake sitting all his A Level exams and collecting his results in person in the middle of a pandemic, with schools closed and exams cancelled - and somehow his high-achieving and engaged parents and siblings failed to notice any inconsistencies in this? ...Come on!

I think I’ve got it: if b 2000/24yo in 2024; then he would have sat his AS levels at grammar in 2017; failed them second time in 2018; pretended he hadn’t and that he went on study for A Level/A2 exams to be sat in summer 2019. In stead he did a distance learning Access Dip and completed that instead. Pre covid, so no impact.

Applied to U of E during the Access course and went up in Sept 2019, where he was probably subject to lock down.

What I find strange is that every parent I know supporting a teen going through the UCAS apps knws in depth their kids exams/boards etc and has sat with them filling in the online forms (and as one about to do it with my teen, having also done the applications with them for their Access course). They would have attended many of the Open Days and discussed subjects/grade expectations with advisors and tutors marketing the courses. I don’t see how OPs DS would have maintained this mirage without complete indifference of the parents? My teen runs their forms and admin by me, gets me to check the personal statements (which reference, specifically, the subjects - why studied, which bit enjoyed/were challenging etc).

I appreciate OPs son may have been completely closed off about it, but that in itself would have been a flag to something being up, so that when he made his recent confession I would have had a lightbulb moment. Ie It wouldn’t have been so much a surprise, but an ‘ah, that explains it’ moment, where I would have realised I should have known…

Solocup · 29/07/2024 17:24

Don’t you think it might be you that messed up? In that he couldn’t tell you. And now knowing it, your focus is still on his ‘messing up again’ and his secrecy.
I’d be sad that I wasn’t someone he felt that would support him through that. And by how you feel now, he was probably right in how he thought you’d react. He likely feels like the failure compared to his siblings.
I think he showed resilience and determination. Far from messing up. He saw what wasn’t working and found another way.

AreThereSomewhereIslands · 29/07/2024 17:35

CautiousLurker · 29/07/2024 17:19

I think I’ve got it: if b 2000/24yo in 2024; then he would have sat his AS levels at grammar in 2017; failed them second time in 2018; pretended he hadn’t and that he went on study for A Level/A2 exams to be sat in summer 2019. In stead he did a distance learning Access Dip and completed that instead. Pre covid, so no impact.

Applied to U of E during the Access course and went up in Sept 2019, where he was probably subject to lock down.

What I find strange is that every parent I know supporting a teen going through the UCAS apps knws in depth their kids exams/boards etc and has sat with them filling in the online forms (and as one about to do it with my teen, having also done the applications with them for their Access course). They would have attended many of the Open Days and discussed subjects/grade expectations with advisors and tutors marketing the courses. I don’t see how OPs DS would have maintained this mirage without complete indifference of the parents? My teen runs their forms and admin by me, gets me to check the personal statements (which reference, specifically, the subjects - why studied, which bit enjoyed/were challenging etc).

I appreciate OPs son may have been completely closed off about it, but that in itself would have been a flag to something being up, so that when he made his recent confession I would have had a lightbulb moment. Ie It wouldn’t have been so much a surprise, but an ‘ah, that explains it’ moment, where I would have realised I should have known…

...Except, @CautiousLurker, the OP states repeatedly that her DS was born premature in late August, so she and her DH held him back for a year and he only started at a private primary school a few days after he turned 6 years old.

We're back to adding a year onto each of those estimates: sat and failed his AS Levels at grammar in 2018; re-sat his AS Levels at college in 2019 and failed again; turned 19 at the end of August 2019 so was eligible to enrol in an online Access course in September 2019...

CautiousLurker · 29/07/2024 17:52

Ah @AreThereSomewhereIslands I see, so what people are saying is that the pretend A2/A levels were in summer 2020 - and those exams were cancelled, weren’t they so there would NOT have been an on line exam schedule for siblings to look up and take him to as there were no formal exams to sit?

So either OP is fibbing and this is a made up story; or OP was completely uninterested/uninvolved and had absolutely no idea what SHOULD have been going on in her son’s life - something I find utterly impossible to believe unless we are talking about significant parental neglect here. My DD was doing GCSEs at the time, albeit sitting the following year, and I and my parent friend cohort were watching this stuff like hawks - the year group and friends only Whatsapps were awash with it all as many had older children doing A Levels.

It’s not actually about the claimed subterfuge but about the total and utter parental disconnect that this would indicate… in which case, tbh, I’m not surprised he acted alone or has kept it secret until now. Frankly, I’m surprised he’s even bothered to maintain contact after leaving for university, but maybe now he has his first class pass he feels he’s finally good enough. Would love to be a fly on the wall in a family therapy session…

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