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AIBU?

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Disorder in Leeds

709 replies

OrangeFurever · 18/07/2024 21:53

Anyone watching the public disorder in Leeds? Bloody disgusting behaviour. Animals. AIBU to wish police had so many more resources to bring consequences to these absolute excuses for humanity?

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17
Carebearsonmybed · 19/07/2024 08:28

xtinabale55 · 19/07/2024 07:57

Was brought up in a midlands town quite similar to this and trust me when I say for some awful people living in these areas this is a way of life, it's just how they are, any excuse to stand around chatting abs crap, flexing to the gang about how hard they are setting fire to a bus, those kids would've been removed of course for their safety, you can't understand how children being removed for their safety would cause this, bc these people don't think and behave like most normal people this is why they're there in the first place! Anyone with half a brain has fought their way out of there or some families have to live amongst it in fear never knowing if they'll be attacked, assaulted or burgled. Most were feral children to begin with kicked out and left out all day, not educated at all about respect and no school education but the school education is abs rubbish in these places as also, when children can't behave in class and it's the majority of the class how do the teachers manage that, you call in the parents they're likely drunks, drug dealers or well known criminals that will target you if you come down on their kids. It's an institution of gang land it stems from poverty and overpopulated areas, feel so sorry for the kids. They grow up gaining a sense of belonging within a gang, friends are their family and escape out of violent or broken homes, or they're just kicked out all day and have nowhere else to go, know bc I grew up in an area like this, what happens is in time sadly the majority do only what they see others have done before, a lot of girls are pregnant from 15+, they get a council house and their own place, a lot of them struggle with the demands of parenting being so young and become depressed or take to drugs and the cycle continues, most of the lads end up mixed in to drugs or get by living with parents on paper but are claiming benefits, or they steal cars or have underhand jobs to pay the bills and many end up in mental health facilities due to drug problems and many end up dead due to drugs. It's an awful place to live and it's many many places sadly. Me and my partner grew up in a place like this and we got out young, it was a battle, we had no decent education, it was a steep steep learning curve for us and we have had no one support us at all, family look down on you when you try to do better for yourself this is the mentality of people that live in these places and some go as low to try and sponge off you when it suits them! It's rotten to the core. Out of all the people we knew growing up with most of the girls I knew were pregnant from 15-16+, one became a prostitute to feed her drug addict partners addiction, her cousin became addictive to drugs and in and out of rehab, their mother kicked them out all day sadly she know struggles massively with her MH, most of the lads are drug addicts, quite a few died of drug related issues, a girl I knew also died of drugs. We were looked down on when we moved away and we had to cut ourselves off, we have ended up friendless for quite some yrs which was very hard it was abs the right decision you don't need friends like that! But oc it takes time to build friendships much time to build trust, seeing these people be out a lot with lots of others seemingly having a great time whilst you felt it was for the best to walk away and leave them all behind and have no one to socialise with except eachother has been hard but we hope our child will never be subject to that life bc where does it lead, it leads to living next to drug dealers, noise all night every night, drug addiction, gang peer pressure, fear, early death and short lives and never ever seeing a life out of that tiny mindset and town, it's sad for the kids bc it's those kids that become the adults that's make it that way bc of a lack of adult support in the first place and a lack of education they're like grown up kids really that are just floating about in life aimlessly uneducated, a lot don't see it how me and my partner did they just don't they're sort of blind to it and it's very hard to change once they pass a certain age and that can be as young as 14-15.

People who've never been to/worked in/lived in these areas have no clue at all.

It's another world from the MC bubble of millions.

Purpleyellow98 · 19/07/2024 08:28

Kjbruce · 19/07/2024 08:16

The media are so ridiculous. Not one report has mentioned that this trouble is caused by the Asian community.

Actually if you know Harehills you'd know it has a very large Roma community, and the initially incidents were reportedly involving a family of that background. Even when you watch the videos you can see the difference in ethnicities, unless of course you assume everyone with brown skin is asian. Also Asia is a massive continent, so ridiculous to say 'asian community' anyway.

Bluebell247 · 19/07/2024 08:30

I am friends with 4 families living in Harehills, some live very close to where this all kicked off. They are all middle class, English (not all white because - surprise! - not all English are).

They have lovely neighbours and there's a good community feel.

There are absolutely people who live there who are awful, as evidenced by the disorder, but it is actually a fairly safe place which I'm happy to walk around. The problems tend to be internally focussed - eg drug rivals falling out.

It's really unfair to tar the whole area because of the behaviour of a small group.

Scarletrunner · 19/07/2024 08:31

Once the benefit system pays for people's housing then how are they ever to move from an area to improve their job opportunities etc There is a downside to having a generous benefit system. If you earn more won't your benefits be cut. it's a downward path.

Bluebell247 · 19/07/2024 08:33

To follow up I'd never ever walk around Gipton or Seacroft by myself. All white areas. Harehills is much safer.

Chickenuggetsticks · 19/07/2024 08:34

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I’m going to be honest there are definitely people who don’t want to integrate or join the rest of society in this century. But equally there are loads of people who are ethnic minorities who are watching this disgusted. It’s is just wrong to assume that ethnic minorities don’t integrate or aren’t productive members of society. Flat wrong. Most of us take the view that this is our home and we want it to be nice.

I’m no fan of Mothin Ali but it looks like he was trying to help calm things rather than joining a riot. He mainly looked aghast imo.

OlgaBracley · 19/07/2024 08:36

My mother is Italian. My father is Italian. All their parents were Italian and their parents before them going back to as far as anyone can recall.
I was born in England. My blood is Italian. I do not feel English. I define myself as Italian born in England.

My older sisters were born in Italy-are they Italian and I, their full blooded sister, English. of course not.

It is the same for my Irish friend. Born here from centuries of Irish people-she would not like to be defined as English.

You will find it is the same for many, if not most British Muslims. They define themselves by the country of the blood they carry and anyone who thinks otherwise is living in La La land.

The Duke of Wellington is correct. Cliff Richard doesn't define himself as British Indian and no-one expects him to!

marshmallowmix · 19/07/2024 08:40

This reply has been deleted

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I know the area and it’s always been rough but people don’t riot like this. Look at the videos to see its people who have been imported from poorer countries mainly . This is stuff you’d see in other countries not the U.K. the pics and videos are clear…time for a crackdown.

SS were doing there job . I despair at the state of this country.

Chickenuggetsticks · 19/07/2024 08:41

OlgaBracley · 19/07/2024 08:36

My mother is Italian. My father is Italian. All their parents were Italian and their parents before them going back to as far as anyone can recall.
I was born in England. My blood is Italian. I do not feel English. I define myself as Italian born in England.

My older sisters were born in Italy-are they Italian and I, their full blooded sister, English. of course not.

It is the same for my Irish friend. Born here from centuries of Irish people-she would not like to be defined as English.

You will find it is the same for many, if not most British Muslims. They define themselves by the country of the blood they carry and anyone who thinks otherwise is living in La La land.

The Duke of Wellington is correct. Cliff Richard doesn't define himself as British Indian and no-one expects him to!

People can be two things at once, they can hold the culture they grew up with very dear whilst also holding the place they grew up very dear too. I only mention my ethnicity along with my nationality when someone has that look on their face that suggests they are trying to place my ethnicity. I don’t really mind tbh, I have the same reflex myself.

How do you think mixed race people cope? Most of the mixed race people in my family are comfortable with their identity.

NasiDagang · 19/07/2024 08:59

ShouldhavebeencalledAppollo · 19/07/2024 06:19

Harehills is pretty much a No go area. Yes poverty, disenfranchisement etc go into it.

But many attempts have been made to by charities and councils to improve the area. All of which fail because of the people. There’s many lovely people there. But there is a large minority of shit heads.

It’s not surprising they kicked off over children, who were being neglected, being removed. This large minority don’t give a shit that children deserve better. It’s their area and they believe the law has no place there. It doesn’t matter to these shit heads that the kids deserve more. That their attitude just breeds more children who carry on acting this way. They even fit from it being this way and want it to continue.

They don’t care about community. They care about maintaining the status quo that lets them be shitheads. They don’t want better for their own kids or other peoples. Because their kids being better make them feel their kids are rejecting their way of living and shows them for what they are.

You have explained things clearly. Well done!

strawberrysalsa · 19/07/2024 09:08

really interesting to read comments from people who don't live in the area and are reacting to posts on various forms of media.

The incident happened pretty much at the end of my street and it definitely wasn't a 'riot'...there was a stupid amount of police in the area and all the people you can see were locals wandering down to see what was happening...the police helicopter and drone were deafening.

There was no damage to any of the local shops or any private property. No one was injured.

As a foster carer for 20 years I can say Social Services are sometimes ....trying to find a polite way to say utterly useless (before I get called on this I have also known some fantastic social workers)....so I'm taking the news of them removing a child for neglect with a pinch of salt.

Harehills is a mixed area with lots of poverty and generations of neglect from all Government and council services...but I've lived here 30 years and for all the problems its a lovely place to live with lovely people.

ClaribelLowLieth · 19/07/2024 09:14

OlgaBracley · 19/07/2024 08:36

My mother is Italian. My father is Italian. All their parents were Italian and their parents before them going back to as far as anyone can recall.
I was born in England. My blood is Italian. I do not feel English. I define myself as Italian born in England.

My older sisters were born in Italy-are they Italian and I, their full blooded sister, English. of course not.

It is the same for my Irish friend. Born here from centuries of Irish people-she would not like to be defined as English.

You will find it is the same for many, if not most British Muslims. They define themselves by the country of the blood they carry and anyone who thinks otherwise is living in La La land.

The Duke of Wellington is correct. Cliff Richard doesn't define himself as British Indian and no-one expects him to!

I'm just curious if Italians consider you Italian or maybe British Italian?

(This isn't a criticism or anything! I'm just interested)

NasiDagang · 19/07/2024 09:21

Kjbruce · 19/07/2024 08:15

The media are so ridiculous. Not one report has mentioned that this trouble is caused by the Asian community.

You are right, the media is ridiculous! Not one report has mentioned that white middle class teenagers has been beating up the disabled and the elderly people in my community. White kids can be thugs as well! Not just 'Asians' as you put it.

changedusernameforthis1 · 19/07/2024 09:27

This is near where I live - thankfully not close enough to be living in the area but we could see the smoke from our house.
Harehills has been getting worse for years now. About 4 years ago we took the DC to a nearby fireworks display and had fireworks thrown at the car as a riot just broke out suddenly. It was terrifying to drive through.

xtinabale55 · 19/07/2024 09:32

@mimblewimble yes predominantly white, this is how I believe it turned out how it did, a lot of the families living there came from a neighbouring much rougher estate, a council estate formed after ww2, my family on mothers side was large, 8 siblings in total it was app encouraged after ww2, it was explained to me they were given a home as their ages meant after coming out of ww2 that had no money from work as were in the war, so houses were given out, large families were encouraged, they were all mostly devout catholics! Contraception was not favoured, I recall my mother talking about this being the issue, most families from there were big! Poor being post war famiiies, my line was farming this was no more after moving in to the suburbs near the towns. So we're taking 50-60s in to the 70-80s, council estate culture began with the estate community centres where everyone knows everyone else and everyone pretty much does what everyone else does. They spilled in to the closer town suburbs and bc their parents in the 50s then couldn't cope with so many kids they all left home fairly young knowing they'd get a council property if deemed homeless and those people are now in their late 50 to 60s and some of their kids my generation are doing the same.

With regards to other cultures, that area filled up with council and housing association families from all very similar backgrounds, it became in time as bad as the council estate their families came from, then what happens it becomes a poor run down area where the council put anyone else with no money in to like immigrants etc, they were there but when I was there most kept to themselves particularly Polish or Eastern Europeans and many did work. There was a large Pakistani community just outside of that town but again kept to themselves & out of the local culture i was a part of but there was racial issues mainly in my view kicked off by the white community, this bred a hatred on both sides, I took no part in that but was targeted by young Pakistani lads walking home from town from work but they were so young and I understood why they were sadly how they were, a lot of that now has died out, there were mixes of people from black race also but only very few and most again kept to themselves, but there were more from this race that would occ become involved with the white community gangs but back then the issue was mostly white. I've not lived there for a while now but I see a lot more diversity and a lot of the original problem people are much older now I think as time has passed those people and that gang culture has changed bc I don't think many had kids themselves that followers in their footsteps, many didn't have children or any that did have had very different characters of children or moved out of the area. It's interesting to see some of their children are clearly total opposite characters of the kids I grew up with, they were like their parents and then there were so many and this is how it can easily snowball in generations.

think unless you live there and understand the culture and why it appears how it does its easy to blame other ethnic minorities back then this wasn't stemming from foreigners it was the white culture post war, Asians and black people mostly kept to themselves.

But...when I look at the Leeds photos of this incident I do see many different ethnicities possibly European, Asian perhaps, of course in turn culture changes it is possible that some Asian children may have adopted some of the less favourable original British ways of life's in poorer areas and this is why you now see this with people of non white colour also.

But crux of it is that poor area, poor upbringings, children allowed to run riot and feral choosing their own life paths badly with no guidance and it all comes from poor uneducated areas and nowadays is of all colour

OlgaBracley · 19/07/2024 09:40

ClaribelLowLieth · 19/07/2024 09:14

I'm just curious if Italians consider you Italian or maybe British Italian?

(This isn't a criticism or anything! I'm just interested)

Italian. My mother would have exploded if someone called me English!

ShouldhavebeencalledAppollo · 19/07/2024 09:40

This isn’t the first time there’s been riots in harehills. They don’t act as a catalyst to make things better.

It’s got worse since 2001. Of course there’s areas that are nicer than others. But as a whole the area has a lot of crime. Especially violent crime.

Dealing with it from within, as someone suggested isn’t working. And a lot of money and resources have gone into the area to try and improve things and cut down on anti social behaviour

Runbunny · 19/07/2024 09:47

Kjbruce · 19/07/2024 08:15

The media are so ridiculous. Not one report has mentioned that this trouble is caused by the Asian community.

I don't think it was caused by "Asians"?

You're right, the media is carefully avoiding mentioning the ethnicity of those involved, but it wasn't Asian (what does that mean anyway?)

motherofbabydragon · 19/07/2024 09:47

@OlgaBracley as a mixed child too i have a question. what about outside of the family like if you asked an italian who lived in Italy would they still see you as Italian.

it might be very different to my experience but my mum is from east asia, i am half east asian but i do pass as white european if i am being completely fair. I know that to anyone other then my dm i do not count as asian or asian enough. it was certainly made clear to me when i went to an international school there growing up. at the same time being raised by my mum and her side of the family i was fluent in the language and my tastes and interests were i guess more influenced by my asian side. this meant i truly did not feel i belonged to either group. i was either oh the white girl that is friendly with us or oh the friend that happens to be odd and not fully fit in

xtinabale55 · 19/07/2024 09:52

@Carebearsonmybed you need to have lived in it to undertand it entirely agree, I have a lot of empathy for homeless for this reason, many end up this way bc they've had to leave homes due to abuse of all types! My own mother left home at 15 after her mum died of cancer when she was just 11 her dad became physically abusive, last of 7 siblings all left and she was on her own, she lived with friends and in a pub and it became so hard for her she tried to kill herself, she didn't succeed & I think got pregant at just 21 to have a safe roof over her head it's awful and so sad. But what happens to men in these situations, when a boy leaves home at 16 due to abuse can't find a place to live or it runs out and they can't cope they can't get pregnant to get a place, they end up homeless or on drugs, it's not that easy it really isn't for anyone to just say just get a job it's not! They leave with abs fuck all but pain and heartbreak and emptiness and no one around them to help them through life, work in itself when your uneducated is low paid and oftentimes awfully stressful and difficult you have to deal with soem vile people I know bc every job I've had and I've had many being brave enough to leave seeking a decent manager but in lower paid work they don't exist, it's easier I think for many in this life to just live how they do they in some ways feel an unrealistic sense of belonging they never had growing up it's that or struggle in other ways. I left and me and my partner have had to fight tooth and nail to get out of that life, I've been bullied in a couple of jobs for being simply hard working and keeping to my bloody self! I've had to leave at the worst times and my partners had to help support me, I wanted to be a nurse but I couldn't bc I have a child and my husbands job is our lifeline I have to work around him and my child, I was told by large local hospital recruitment manager that I would struggle with the shifts the have they don't have anything for mothers! I want to better myself, have a job that fulfills me helping people, give something back to the community I don't want to be tied to my dead end office job with the local council with a Hitler bully of a boss bc she knows I am trapped and this is the best I can get! We have no decent family either side of us to help me to do that work I know in my heart I should be doing.

Sometimes I sit here and wonder if it'd been easier or better if I'd just lived fast had my kids much younger than I was able to having to work harder to save money to be able to support ourselves and keep the bills paid, I would have been given a house, money to pay for the bills, never been bullied at work I countless jobs bc of my work ethic and quietness, I don't make mistakes bc some ar quite happy to drag you through dirt to get you sacked it's vile it's been so hard, jjsy so I could afford to live in a street where I can sleep at night more soundly and amongst people my child can play with others kids I don't have to worry about being abused or eventually being turned on to drugs or early teen pregnancy, we've gone through this for our child, clearly not many people are willing to make that hard choice. Despite how damned hard it's been I'm proud so proud of us both of battling our way to where we are, it's something so close to me and is with me everyday the emotional scars of it all, my mother was vile, dad wanted me only to not have to pay maintenance, step dad turns out to be a leach, user and total loser, his daughter hates me, I lost my btother who I loved dearly when he was only just turned 21 as went to France to get away from my father who forced his opinions on his then girlfriend about having an abortion he was devastated and fell to his death in southern France we don't know we will never know if it was an accident or suicide.

Overall it's sad for people who end up like so many do but I can totally understand why, I don't excuse their behaviour but some are just not switched on enough to either know any better, or choose the easier route and some don't have the capability educationally or acadmecially and for those I feel sorry for too, it must be so hard, my husband got us out of their discovering he was gifted in maths which was a god send! I am talented with helping people but service role hours are not suited to working families particularly mothers with husbands who work long hrs, more part time shifts with more flexibility need to be created! We wonder why we have a nursing recruitment problem times have got to change!!!

xtinabale55 · 19/07/2024 10:02

@NasiDagang I was looked down on by my family when I got out of there and practically ignored, I met a distant one once never again who said Kim get the finest bone china out this ones from a town outside of here! I said what I don't choose to live in a shit hole like u and u forget I was raised drinking out go jam jars a jam jar will do I'm not stuck yo my own arse you ideot bc I chose a better way of life but not mention it I'll take the China cup! Does my head in ideots, he was also so racist such an abs ignorant ideot! What would he do if he realised one day he was born in a war torn country and had kids future lives weighing on his mind every single nihht unable to sleep with worry! Course he wouldn't just stay there and try to do better for his family! Fukin pisses me off that stupid white mentality of abs zero consideration for anyone else's situation! These people on all honestly and I'm white myself are bone bloody idle and just like to talk shit all day and it's easier to pull the racism card when it's their own employers and government that are screwing them over allowing people who come here to be paid less and gain more work due to their unscrupulous ways of making money! They need to blame the sodding government! They weren't doing their job properly managing employers, like national wage age bands it's a joke if person A is 18 and can wait tables and so can person B who is 40+ they're doing exact same job why pay one less than the other! This is being reformed also it makes no sense, so long as you can do the job it shoot matter what age you are abs joke, if the issues is it isn't allowing younger people to enter employment then the gov should make it mandatory that all employers take on a set % of youth workers, it's not that hard is it!

I blame the inept government for. A lot of these issues, people really need to wake up and sit and really think about why we're in the mess that we are and you'll find your answers!

Makethisrainstop · 19/07/2024 10:08

NowIam35 · 18/07/2024 21:58

Apparently a child was injured and social services took them away to safety. That's only what I've read on social media though.

That's what we do in this country . If children are left alone and are injured they are taken into care . We don't riot over it . That's how we do things in the UK it's horrible for the kids and the parents but it's not racism . When you live in a different country their rules are their rules . Things are done differently in other countries.

berthaofcalcutta · 19/07/2024 10:15

OhHelloMiss · 18/07/2024 22:30

Overspill of anger from losing the Euro game

You are absolutely mad if you think rioting England football team fans would have got the same gentle hands treatment as the crowds last night did.

Username056 · 19/07/2024 10:16

Again just what I’ve read/seen on social media. A Roma family. Children were removed due to an injury to a sibling that happened a while ago. Child taken to hospital and then I guess the incident/injury was reported to social services and the process towards removal began. I saw one video with a crowd already gathering and children being removed by police.

TheThingIsYeah · 19/07/2024 10:24

berthaofcalcutta · 19/07/2024 10:15

You are absolutely mad if you think rioting England football team fans would have got the same gentle hands treatment as the crowds last night did.

Exactly.

You'd think the police would have learned from the London riots in 2011 of what happens when you go into "community" mode.

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