What on earth is my mother doing??

[Hummingbird75]

For context I am an the adult child of an abusive father, the kind MN would always say LTB.

My father would tell us regularly he hated children, and couldn't stand us and spent most of my childhood hitting and abusing me physically and mentally. Being told he did not love me was far worse than anything he did with his fists as a child. It was devastating. He barely spoke to me when he wasn't losing his temper.

He abused my mother for years in a controlling way but stopped physically assaulting her when he started taking his temper out on us. My mother always said she would leave him, and she had many options to do so, but never did. I grew up desperate for his love and approval initially, to be even noticed enough for him to talk to me. It never happened.

Once I reached adulthood, I realised my 'normal' childhood was not normal at all, and over the years my father and I have been low contact. I remained close to my mother, mainly because he didn't want to be around us anyway beyond keeping my mother happy. My father and I settled on a very superficial relationship that was entirely empty of all meaning.

Once I had dc and he became abusive towards them (making my dc cry calling them fat and being unkind about their appearance when they were young) I went completely no contact with the help and support of MN at the time. To protect my dc. This has been the case for over six years or so. We just keep in contact with my mother which makes things very awkward at times. My mother says she is happy to stay now with him, they have worked out their differences, it suits her to stay with him, at her age.

Last year my father became very, very ill. I supported my mother, but did not contact him. I still choose to keep my children safe, and away from him. It was very hard and sad at the time. My mother said he is getting old we need to 'make up', so I gave him a choice. If my father agreed to be nice to us and not say anything harmful I will restart contact given his age and ill health.
My father refused outright on the phone - he said no and actually laughed at me. He should be able to say what he likes to us, and he will not agree to anything of the sort. I was only asking for him to promise to be kind, nothing more. I was hardly asking for the world.

There was no way I was going to restart contact with him basically telling me he would continue to abuse me/us (as he has always done)

Since then my mother has completely stopped calling. She seemingly will not forgive me for stopping contact and ruining her illusion of a 'happy family'. She has not visited my house in over five years, and refuses to meet me other than from her house (which is very triggering now for me being there, I sometimes have panic attacks when I am outside because I am still so afraid of my father) unless I collect her a few times a year I would never see her. I had a serious illness at the beginning of this year that could have been a terminal diagnosis, she did not even call me then or offer any support whatsoever. I was so hurt by her total indifference. She really did not seem to care.

What she does every day, is send me a WA message saying she loves me to the 'moon and back' and variations of very over the top love messages which feel very insincere and sickly.

I don't FEEL remotely loved by her.

The messages and words feel completely empty to me. I don't know why she sends them, and I have no idea how to respond to her. I asked her to please stop because they were upsetting me, but she carries on anyway. The same message on repeat every single day of undying love, but she never calls or asks how we are in the messages. I am expected to do all of the calling and all of the visiting still regardless of my health. These 'issues' seem irrelevant to her. She sometimes talks about the weather but nothing else, ever. It feels really pointless. I have tried to engage with her properly and she then retreats into silent treatment and this can last for months at a time.

I am so confused.

What is happening here? Why is she sending these messages to me?

It feels like she has cut me off to all intents and purposes, and her daily text hurts me because it seems like she is saying she loves me, but it doesn't feel like she loves or cares about me at all.

I have no idea what I should do about this now.

What am I missing about this situation?

I'm sorry your mother got back with such a hurtful message. To me it just reveals her true colours more strongly. Can you take this latest message as confirmation that she brings nothing good to your life and does not wish you well (sorry!), and step away from her completely. That is the happy ending - cutting the abuse out of your life and focussing on the future with your DC. Reconciling with the abusers is not the happy ending.

My thought about finding your own peace with it, is maybe write a long letter to them saying everything you wish you could say, then put it in an envelope and put it away in a drawer. Don't send it. Someone suggested this to me once when I was going through something really difficult and I found it cathartic. x

Also - another point of view in relation to you trying to save her is that she doesn't actually want to be saved. You've mentioned that she has a lot of control over your father, which clearly suits her so I'd try to view it that you tried, she didn't want to be saved, so rather than it ending up making you both terribly unhappy, you walked away and let her get on with her stuff.

Just a different viewpoint on the situation.

Your most recent post is so great, OP - if you can look at gently but firmly closing the door on your mother's presence in your life, then I think you'll be surprised by just how wonderful your life will be without her in it.

DARVO

Honestly that is the thing to hold on to. I was abused by my father and I was determined that it would stop with me. I made sure it didn't happen to my siblings and I made sure it didn't happen to my DC.
We break the cycle. You have broken the cycle. You are f**king strong and you made that happen.

It feels more healthy to say enough is enough this is not helping anyone. Thank you. I can't live a lie. She can't live with the truth. So we are always going to arrive here at stalemate.

Maybe the idea of anything being indefinite or forever IS too much at this very moment, that is very insightful of you to know that. Just pressing pause on all of this horribleness is not unreasonable. I can see how I go, and maybe in the meantime the therapy will support me in finding a way to accept what feels unacceptable.

I am banging my head against a brick wall, that is exactly it.
I don't think she cares that much tbh, it occurs to me I am the only one here trying. It really is time to stop.

I know I am not perfect either, and I have probably wanted to be 'heard' for too long when no one really wants to hear it. In my own way howling into the wind for one of them to care, to listen, to hear me. The door felt closed a long time ago if I am honest, and now it is time for me to stop trying, stop banging my head and walk away. I don't feel as bad as I thought I would now it is done. I think I am losing the illusion of a mother, not one that actually exists in my world today.

Well done @Hummingbird75 You have so much to be proud of. As you say, you have your happy ending and a vision of a happy future.

I agree. There are many threads on here laying out that abused women are not enablers - they are worn down and brainwashed.

It sounds as though this mother is the same.🤷‍♀️

This 'mother' who literally stood by and watched her child be emotionally, physically and sexually abused from a young age?
Acknowledges that it happened but tells op she needs to forget about it because it upsets her picture in her head of her perfect family?

@AutumnFroglets Fuck that shit.

I couldn't disagree more.

The mother has been a participant in her children's abuse and still is.

Yeah OP it sounds like your mother has a lot of narcissistic traits. She probably had a traumatic childhood in one way or another that started it all. She then married an abusive man so was again a victim herself, but making the world think it was a happy marriage was probably the most important thing (due to her rock bottom self esteem).

She then watched the abuse pass on to you, she was absolved while your brother was more protected as the 'higher value' (for whatever misguided reason) child. Maybe because your father slightly preferred him, or internalised misogyny, or because he was more malleable and more willing to pretend that everything was fine.

What you've had your whole life is 'you will be loved if you play my game' and she was your heroine because she could say 'that's enough' at times. And those bread crumbs were more than your father ever gave you. That wasn't love, there was no empathy, she just knew she couldn't let things go too far for risk of someone finding out the truth about her happy family. Now she is trying to manipulate you back into the game with the constant love bombing because firstly she won't like to feel rejection from you and secondly because how would she explain it if you weren't at the funeral? How would she keep the happy family facade up then?

You feel no love because there is no love, there never was. Oh she could make you feel like there was if it suited her, many narcissists can be very charming and come across as lovely people. But it's all a performance dependent on you playing by their rules - and they will cut you out without a second thought if you're not fulfilling that role.

She's a victim and she had no control over the narcissism, it would have been a survival thing - but you need to see her for what she is IMO. When your father dies you may become very useful to her again and it might feel like she really loves you and everything is good (back to the performance again). Or she might blame and resent you, rewrite your whole history making everything your fault (she probably already has to some extent) and never speak to you again.

You need to have very low expectations and look after yourself OP. You need to recognise this for what it is and protect yourself. This is someone who hasn't been able to make themselves happy their whole life, all they have to cling onto is their superficial facade. She can't give you what you really want.

It is often said that the enabler is worse than the abuser. It is because they are insidious. On the surface, when compared to the abuser, they come across as the better or safer person. Sometimes, they can seem like another victim of the abuser. They may have started as the victim, but at some point they became a volunteer and then another abuser. They usually don’t abuse you directly, but serve you up to the abuser. This way, you are still abused, but they appear innocent.

I see a lot of similarities between your mother and mine. The abuse I experienced was different from yours, but the fundamentals are the same. Your mother may have started as a victim of your father, but at some point, she morphed into an abuser. She should have moved heaven and earth to protect her children. Instead, she used them as meat shields. At some point, she started to get something out of you being abused. Personally, my mother seemed to enjoy seeing my confidence destroyed. Her narrative was that since I didn’t want to settle for a series of crap husbands and wanted to further my education so I could have a well paying career, then I was stuck up, thought too highly of myself and needed to be brought down.

Your mother gets something out of abusing you by proxy. You don’t need to figure out what, you just need to protect yourself and your children. Your mother installed buttons in you. She would do something, you would respond, get abused and then she would reward you with a minimal amount of affection. She expected this cycle to continue with your children. She enjoys this cycle.

You broke that cycle. Not only did you remove yourself from the cycle of abuse, you broke it by protecting your children. Those daily messages are pure manipulation. They are meant to push the buttons she installed to get you and your children back in the cycle. She didn’t count on you loving your children more than yourself and protecting them, because she is selfish and loves herself more than her children.

If you aren’t ready to cut off, take an indefinite time out. Realize that you are creating your happy ending. You broke the cycle of generational abuse by protecting your children and getting therapy. You are teaching your children how to have healthy relationships and to not accept abuse. You are starting to see through the manipulation. The longer you are away from it, the more peace and happiness you will feel.

The facade was always more important. I can't understand it myself, why a pretend life is better than the well being of your actual children. Or the superficial is the only level that they can operate on, when a more meaningful relationship is on offer.

The constant deflection is really annoying. Every time I say you are hurting me, she immediately turns it around to her and says I am the one hurting her because I am drawing attention to something she would rather not talk about.

I looked up DAVRO and that was enlightening -

Deny, attack, reverse victim & offender

Some researchers indicate that it is a common manipulation strategy of psychological abusers

It is precisely what she does whenever you merely raise the prospect that things are far from ideal, and you are feeling hurt or upset. Instead of asking about it, talking it through, consider what can be done if anything - she becomes instantly extremely animated and aggressive and does the whole DAVRO thing.

It is like she only knows two lanes in life. The victim mentality - her favourite place, where everyone has to feel sorry for her and she can revel in the poor me. Or the lane of anger when she is challenged or questioned, she goes on the attack trying to defend and deflect her position. There is no lane of self reflection, consideration or personal responsibility at all. It is completely missing.

I don't know about you, but when my dc say you have upset me Mum with x,y and z. I immediately listen, ask for more details, look at what has happened, as objectively as possible decide if they have a point or not, and talk it through.

If I feel it was something I have done wrong, I apologise to them and learn from it. I sometimes make mistakes. I sometimes mess up, and as long as I can put it right with an apology or some repair action there is usually no harm done. This part is entirely missing and never happens with my mother or father. The part where we look at ourselves and our own behaviour. There is zero capacity to do that.

It is like she only knows two lanes in life. The victim mentality - her favourite place, where everyone has to feel sorry for her and she can revel in the poor me. Or the lane of anger when she is challenged or questioned, she goes on the attack trying to defend and deflect her position. There is no lane of self reflection, consideration or personal responsibility at all. It is completely missing.

Also sums my mother up...and it's because it's true. My mother is a narc, comes from the fact that she was one of the last children of 9, born when her mother was in her early 40s. My grandmother was also Catholic, my mother was born in 1941, so fair to say she wasn't exactly a welcome addition to a already large family.

However, years of therapy has made me realise that is not my problem. That background may explain why my mother is like she is, but she had no 'right', if you like, to 'take it out' on myself and my brothers - which is exactly what she did. One of my mother's favourite sayings is 'I had to suffer that, why shouldn't you'. The idea that she should want BETTER for her children is a totally foreign concept to my mother. And god help us if we did do/have it better than her...she makes no effort to conceal her anger or jealousy. Being the only girl also meant I really got it in spades, especially when I made it clear from a very young age that I didn't want children.

I don't think she loves you very much. Maybe a bit but not enough. I don't think she's capable of loving anyone very much.

OP, you sounds completely enmeshed with this behaviour. I really do think you need to return to therapy and disengage, if not for your own sake, then for your kids.

Oh that sounds horrendous. Why are you there if you don't mind me asking?

a) Trauma bonding
b) Upbringing - raised as a handmaid, raised to be loyal to family
c) Love. He's my dad, even so.
d) Because I'm a good person, like most people.

My dad died this afternoon. I hope I didn't let him down. I can't believe he's not there. One of the hard parts of being 'that child' is that you never get the love you want (need) from either parent. But there are one or two positive moments I can hold in my thoughts.

I think there is true unconditional love and there is love.

i love chocolate, can’t wait to get my teeth in a bar, chew it up and swallow. As soon as it served my purpose I forget about it.

I love my children and would do everything in the world to protect them and don’t expect anymore back than I give.

LurkingInTheDark
I think there is true unconditional love and there is love.
i love chocolate, can’t wait to get my teeth in a bar, chew it up and swallow. As soon as it served my purpose I forget about it.
I love my children and would do everything in the world to protect them and don’t expect anymore back than I give.

This is great!

Please remember always how well you have done to be modelling this very sensible approach to healthy relationships with the very poor start and very poor examples that you had in your own childhood. You are breaking the cycle of abuse and you are being a good parent to your own children. This is genuinely wonderful, given how your own parents have behaved. Every time you wonder if you are doing OK, remember how well you have coped and how strong you have been and how much you are doing for your own children that wasn't done for you. You're a superstar.

Your mother neglected you. She may not have been malicious, she may have been controlled and abused herself, but ultimately, the consequences for you were the same. She did not protect you from your father, and is still not doing so. Confronting this fact might be so uncomfortable/shameful/distressing for her that denial is the only way to continue. By sending you gushing messages, she can tell herself that she has really tried and that you are the one who is choosing to be distant, when in reality, she is still neglecting you by not standing up for you or aiding you when you are ill.

I make no judgements of her as a person, because sometimes people fail us tremendously without being bad people in general, and other times, they are outright callous. Regardless, she is hurting you, despite your best efforts, and as painful as it is, she probably won't ever accept this and truly change because to do so would overwhelm her with grief and shame about how she has spent your life and hers.

Sorry OP, it sounds so painful.

Bless you x I have no answers, but please get professional counselling, not just MN advice. It will help you know this is none of your fault and you are worthy of love.

I am struggling to identify what is acceptable and what isn't (I have been conditioned to put up with almost anything)

I said to my mother that I can't get over what my father has done, and that the on going abuse in our family is very distressing. This was a way to put some distance between us, and to explain I was struggling and why ( I know I was advised to just block and delete, but I could not do that. I felt it needed a short explanation) My view was to send that message and leave it

My mothers response included calling me names and insults below:

Spiteful
Hurtful
Selfish
Bullying
Overly critical
Judgemental
Making her depressed
Making her anxious

She made sarcastic comments about my 'wonderful' children. My 'wonderful' dh and my 'wonderful' life which felt very below the belt.

And I should 'enjoy my days'.... which felt really threatening.

There was literally a diatribe last night of messages from her, and some of them were very personal and very unkind (too outing to post)

I have written her insults down here, because I am so hurt to read them, and to ask you if calling me these things after I have told her I am feeling hurt by my father's abuse and can't get past it, is this abuse from my mother to react in this way to my message?

I can't really get over her response tbh. It has shocked me. It feels like she is a completely different person. I know I am supposed to be choosing my reaction to her, and I am calmly looking at these messages now and just thinking WTH is this. Who is she?
She seems to only be able to paint the worst possible picture of me and even outrightly lie about who I actually am. It feels like a character assassination and it is not even my character. Like she has made up this version of me and is now trying to tell me this is who I am, and this is why there is a problem. Obviously she is gas lighting me, but to such a degree I am questioning my own self.

I have now decided to truly cut contact, I have had actually had enough now. I can not understand why she has turned on me so much.

Yup time to drop that rope. Veering between saccharine sweetness or horrible diatribes? Nope nope nope, time for a change