To ask if anyone else on MN is not anti-trans?

[Lilieee]

I'm not interested in someone 'debunking the trans agenda' or how no one on here is like that, all I'm interested in is if any pro-trans Mumsnetters could pop up so I don't feel alone

To be fair, I don't think there's a problem with someone referring to herself as a "cis woman" if she's female and she genuinely believes that she has a woman gender identity.

It's imposing the label on others who do not believe in gender identity that is the issue.

I was about to say just that..

FFS,

We are WOMEN.

Transwomen are......... transwomen.

I don't want to encounter people with penises - aka MEN - in Ladies' lavatories, changing rooms, et cetera.

That's it. I don't care about any of the rest of it. You do you, live and let live, please yourselves.

HamBagelNoCheese · Today 02:19

This always interests me.

Where do you draw the line? What about trans men? (Rhetorical Qs btw(

Should my transfemale colleague, who has been taking female hormones for 10 years, who has natural breasts and has vaginoplasty surgery use male toilets in the absence of a neutral space?
Yes. He’s male. Why should males get to define womanhood and femaleness? The very fact that a small number of males have managed to force their way into female spaces, against the wishes of large numbers of females, arguably the majority of females, makes it clear who the males are and who the females are. Males retain power against females, even when they claim to be female.

My transmale brother is 6ft tall, muscular, tattooed, bearded, has had top surgery but not bottom. Should he use female toilets?
No, but only because she’s gone to such extreme lengths to hide her femaleness and testosterone is such a powerful masculiniser. Females who identify as males, who are still identifiable as females, are welcome in female toilets.

What specifically?

So a transwoman, who has had gender reassignment surgery, has no testes or penis, hasn't gone to "extreme lengths"?

What about from a legal perspective? Both people in my example have all legal documents (passport, birth certificate etc.) in the gender of which they identify.

Your incorrect use of pronouns is also offensive. You don't get to decide how someone identifies themselves. Basic respect doesn't cost anything.

No idea what I am but I don't think they are jumping out from under the bed and creeping out of the fridge nor is my first waking thought 'where's my device I have to find an article to post before I have breakfast then I can stamp my foot and say they are out to get me'

Also I am what I was born nearly 50 years ago and have managed this long without a label so I am not starting one now

I don't think many people on mumsnet are anti trans.

the majority (including me) seem to be anti biological men taking over hard fought for women's spaces and taking away much needed academic and sporting opportunities and accolades from women. also anti TRAs trying to calls apples oranges and children below the age of consent having life limiting interventions.

most of us would be polite, kind and friendly to any trans individual we met.

Mumsnet is very anti trans and I can’t believe some of the posts I come across

Your incorrect use of pronouns is also offensive. You don't get to decide how someone identifies themselves.

At the same time, they don't get to decide how I identify them. They don't get to order me to lie about what I perceive. Basic respect doesn't cost anything.

Examples?

I expect you will find that almost everyone on Mumsnet is "pro trans"

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣.

OP - present 🤚. Trans ally cis female mumsnetter. Thank you for this thread 🙏🏻🙏🏻

I'm pro trans.
I believe very much that all trans people should be able to live free from oppression and discrimination.

As such I would stand shoulder to shoulder with any trans woman fighting to be safe in men's spaces, or campaigning for third spaces.

I don't, however, believe male-born people should share single sex spaces with women.

Sex is real, and it matters, which is why we have single sex provisions in the first place.

As such I would stand shoulder to shoulder with any trans woman fighting to be safe in men's spaces

words fail me.

Who gets to decide/define what constitutes "anti trans"?

If you say, "I just don’t believe women’s spaces should be used by men," are you anti men?

yep, I would estimate about 95% of them.

At the same time, they don't get to decide how I identify them. They don't get to order me to lie about what I perceive. Basic respect doesn't cost anything.

😂

Anyway, it's late. I should probably get some sleep before I spend another 10 hour day at work supporting people who are marginalised and discriminated against to such a degree that they try to end their own life.

Be kind 💜🤍💙

Excuse me?

I don't want biological males in women's spaces.

Transwomen's safety is a separate issue

I have no issue with genuine trans women sharing women's spaces but I guess there's room for exploitation.

Some of the stuff I read on here shocks me. It's definitely anti trans in my opinion.

I have two daughters if it makes any difference. My younger cousin is a trans man. I suspect he may be ND but hasn't been diagnosed.

the phrase ‘Cis woman’ means that you are the oppressor in the trans hierarchy.
If you call yourself Cis then you must submit to:
Transwomen in women’s sport/ changing rooms
Yranswomen in women’s prisons and other spaces
Transwomen in women’s jobs - Rape crisis centre/ police woman allowed to strip search women, women’s officer, etc.etc.

In this world view transwomen are centred - transwomen are women but biological women are only allowed to be called Cis- a sub category.

I just can’t understand why we can’t distinguish between an individual who wakes up in the morning and self-IDs for the sake of it, and someone who has taken hormones for years and possibly had surgery?

I feel so daft.

I don't think I've ever seen any "anti trans" posts on Mumsnet and if there are, they get deleted pretty quickly.

I am a trans ally and mother of a trans woman

@Lilieee looks like you've already had your thread hijacked...
another trans ally here (and baffled as to why so many people are obsessed with toilets - I feel like the underlying assumption from a lot of people on here is that people voluntarily are trans to go perve on women in bathrooms 🙄)
Also disgusted at how the 'trans issue' has become a dog-whistle distraction for politics.
Also a cis woman

Anti trans what? Do you mean people?

Single sex spaces are safer for women & girls; humans can't change sex so I don't want Suzie/Eddie Izzard or any other "transwomen " in the changing room /toilets/hospital ward with me or my daughters.
There is no evidence that claiming a feminine identity makes men less of a threat to women - on the contrary the MOJ data suggest such men are MORE of a threat.

I'm pro women & pro reality
I don't wish bad things for people who say they're trans so not anti trans.

I don't believe in God /the doctrine of the Catholic Church & don't wish bad things for Catholic- I don't think anyone thinks that makes me anti-Catholic