Don't vote reform

[Crispynoodle]

Obviously I can't tell you who to vote for but then there is this:

news.sky.com/story/second-reform-candidate-quits-and-backs-tories-over-racism-and-misogyny-13162247

Thats easy. 'Leftie'.

I know. Her parents were Italians who fled Italy because of Mussolini.
My late father hated Le Pen senior because he was a torturer in the Algerian war of Independence. My father was a conscript in the same regiment. He also abhorred racism.
I am hoping that all the parties unite against these fascists in the second round. Farage is of the same ilk and an hypocrite to boot, having tried to obtain a German passport a few weeks after the Brexit referendum. Two of his children enjoy the freedom of movement (thanks to their German passport) denied to so many. I guess getting a blue passport ( made in Europe) was worth it.

Overtly racist? She was suspended for saying “It is true that many types of white people with points of difference, such as redheads, can experience this prejudice. But they are not all their lives subject to racism”. Which let’s face it is a fairly innocuous comment.

There is a world of difference between saying that, and saying black people should be shot.

Ha! I suppose the further right you travel you end up meeting the left anyway.

Let's hope France does the right thing. I'll be thinking of you all during this time.

PelicanPopcorn
Migration is fundamentally relieving pressure on public services because a very large portion is going into the NHS and care sector. Migrants are majority working age so use less free education, healthcare, pensions and pay more taxes than the general population. UK has a falling birthrate and increased older population - this again is increasing pressure on public services. These are just facts.

People are not concerned about the people that come here through legal and official channels. They are concerned about the illegal immigration, the boats, the people that destroy their papers and therefore their criminal history, on the way. The hoardes of men - where are the women and children? - that are taking over villages and whole areas.

To confuse the two now is just willfull obtusiveness, and it is not racist to be concerned about this.

Look at Switzerland.

Their policies are far right policies.

So allowing people to earn £20k before they pay tax is far right? Not wanting to interfere in peoples lives (i.e having a small state) is far right?

You could go through every parties manifesto and come up with something which someone would deem, far right, far left, racist etc.

Too many people make find their opinions from soundbites and by following the majority "correct" opinion.

On this, or another thread, I have said I asked every local candidate the same set of questions, then went and discussed any concerns or further clarification I needed, before making an informed choice as to who I woud vote for on Thursday. There are 3 parties locally who I will choose from, one of which is Reform. My decision will predominantly lie with their responses to local issues and at the moment they all slightly differ in their approaches.

What I do know is on Thursday if I decide Reform is the party I vote for it is not because I am stupid, thick and a racist, but because I have done myy homework to what they will bring as a local MP inconjunction with their manifesto for the population country wide.

I have to question though, how many people who vote will have completed the same process? Many sadly not.

Aww go out and vote Reform. There aren't enough of you to make a difference but it does helpfully split the Tory vote.

Can I just thank you - all my posts are probably overly long winded and trying to be in a reasonable tone so as to not call people names or insult them, but then along comes your post which I so wish I could have posted!! Said everything very well!

I always hear about these ‘hoards of single male immigrants’ coming over but as someone who lives in a high immigration area, I’ve yet to see it. It seems to be one of these lines thrown out, that those staunchly against refugee immigration won’t be happy until they see another picture of a drowned toddler on a beach to show it’s not just the men coming over on boats…

Sex vs gender is a whole other policy. I’m not voting Labour because of it but Reform is a whole other side of reducing women’s right. That again is another conflation, what women’s rights are actually about and it goes well beyond transgender ideology.

@MrsAllYours I don't think many people who vote reform are racists but of course, like momentum and labour, racists and extremists attach themselves.

The difference between many labour voters is that they really don't get the whole trans thing unfortunately. So they are sleep walking into it all.

@LostTheMarble to be fair it’s massively noticeable where I live (all the men that have arrived). I personally don’t care a jot about immigration but it’s honestly very noticeable. I often get stopped a few times out and about by men looking for directions to the home office and there are crowds of men always milling about in certain areas (cafe Nero, certain hotels and service centres. This is new over the past few years.

Farage is just a figurehead. You're right that my objection is to the far right views and not to any particular individual.

To clarify, it isn't the case that I can't accept that some people have right wing views. I do accept it. Sadly, it is a fact that some people hold such views, and I have to accept it, whether I like it or not.

What I don't have to do is respect such views or the people who hold them. I accept that they have a legal right within a democracy to hold those views, but that doesn't mean that I have to pretend that their views are worthy of respect. I absolutely think far right voters are wrong and lacking in morals, and I make no apology for that - I despise racists and everything that they stand for. But I absolutely accept that such people exist and that the rest of us have to put up with them.

So from your post would you accept that people can hold the same views about far left? I would probably think you do, however there are too many people who think any left political views are good, but any right views are wrong when imo that is incorrect.

Ironic username.

Yup.

Reform probably are the only party that could deliver on excluding transwomen from all of women's single sex spaces (due to their commitment to leaving the European Convention on Human Rights).

But is giving up our cornerstone human rights protections and the Equality Act (which Reform want to repeal) a price that anyone wants to pay?

Well if you wanted a postal vote you are less likely to be voting now, since a lot weren't sent out in time...

Reform's proposed tax policies...apart from being completely unaffordable are actually incredibly regressive. Designed to overwhelmingly benefit the highest earners while offering very little for the lowest earners. Yes, I'd say that that's pretty right wing as tax policies go.

I'm a higher earner so would do very nicely under their tax regime thank you, but I prefer a more progressive approach.

https://news.sky.com/story/reform-uks-tax-plans-disproportionately-benefit-high-earners-analysis-shows-13156776

Why do you think we as a country are incapable of creating our own rights bill?

Just because we would leave the ECHR etc doesn't mean there will be no rights or that they will be worse than before 🙄

We'd probably be better off.

Ms. Abbott is a superb constituency MP and will easily be re-elected.

I think that it’s more important that people actually get out and vote, rather than who they vote for.

We've always had nutty protest parties such as Reform, Greens, Raving loonies etc but it’s important to vote. They never win much. Each to their own.👍

Why are you prepared to vote for an openly racist, bigoted and misogynistic Party?
A Party whose leader thinks that Andrew Tate is a good egg?