To ask if its fair that inclusivity has excluded my DC from their hobby?

[DImplesandCheese]

TLDR: ND child is causing my DC to quit much loved hobby as ND child's behaviour is ruining it for them.

Full Story: DC (13) attended a hobby/club and has done for years. 2 years ago a new child joined. The child is ND and their particular behaviours include shouting out, not listening, inappropriate use of kit and refusal to fully participate in activities. DC has complained on and off since this child joined that it is spoiling it. I have encouraged DC to be understanding and supportive, I have spoken with the staff at the club to ask if more support for this child can be put in place. Nothing has changed.

Part of the club involves some unsupervised time and this is DC's favourite part of the club. The last two unsupervised sessions have been completely ruined by this child's behaviour, the group have had to call staff for help to sort it out and therefore their final result for the session has been effected. 2 months ago after the last ones of these sessions I spoke with staff and asked why this child doesn't have a 1 to 1 support/parent staying with them as this is hugely effecting everyone else's enjoyment and I was told that my DC is exaggerating and 'fixating' on this child.

DC came home last night as said he's quitting. This child has wrecked the night's activity again. I spoke to the staff and was told that they 'are an inclusive club and they pride themselves in being open to all' and hinted that DC leaving may well be for the best if he's not happy.

I have 2 ND DC, I get the difficulties, I get that they should have access to clubs and activities, I get that allowances need to be made for their behaviour. I am in no way suggesting the child should be kicked out but surely if you have children leaving because of another child then the support in place for that child isn't right?

AIBU to think that more should be done to support this child correctly so DC can continue to enjoy their hobby and that my DC having to leave is not an acceptable situation?

I bet people would react differently if it was their own adult class, sport or craft, that was consistently disturbed by someone. Most people would stop going and find another one.

I run a hobby group that is attended by a neurodiverse woman who is very loud and quite irritating at times. She takes over, talks a lot and very loudly, and doesn't understand social etiquette.

It's frankly hard work and yes it would be more relaxing and straightforward if she wasn't there, but that's just a really unpleasant and ableist way to be.

I just keep running the session and try to ensure she is included. She is quite disruptive at times and doesn't have a support worker. But it's life. She still has a right to feel involved and included in a community.

If people come and don't like it, that's their choice, they don't have to come back.. but I'm not going to tell someone to leave who wants to be there.

And in reality, the group is very well attended and very few people have actually stopped coming because of her.

I don’t agree that the child needs 1:1. They aren’t displaying behaviours that I would associate with that. What would a 1:1 be able to do to change the outcome. Seems like challenging attention and listening skills to me.

@Easipeelerie

after 2 years of having my hobby ruined because the organisers won't help someone who needs it I'd be upset to huge degree too.

Agree with others that for me a lot of this depends on what the hobby is.

If it's a super competitive football team then inclusivity isn't appropriate (and I doubt this situation would arise as kids are cut ruthlessly if they are not up to scratch)

If it is something like scouts then the ability to work in a group and developing social skills to cope in groups is the main point. Op could ask that her child rotates groups in a regular basis but a group like this won't exclude an ND child because the spaghetti tower didn't get built or whatever,

...And I don't disagree that the child having a 1 to 1 support worker is the optimum solution.

(I actually said exactly that).

But that hasn't happened.

So the options are that OP/ her child try to find other positive solutions to help everyone enjoy themselves, or one child or the other stops attending.

Personally I'd try to exhaust the former option first, and would encourage my child to do the same.

It sounds like a frustrating situation for your child but I don't think they have been 'excluded', they are just no longer happy to take part.

Is there another group locally that DS could go to or try?

It's a difficult situation for everyone really. It's a shame that your son doesn't want to go anymore. It would be absolutely unacceptable to ban the ND child from the group due to their ND.

You say you want support for the child, but perhaps the organisers don't have the additional resources to give. What would you expect it to look like practically? You mention 1:2:1 support but how would this help? Other than the adult constantly shushing them, removing equipment from them, forcing them to take certain routes etc I'm not sure how it would work!

Hobbies are supposed to be fun. Are there other options for him? Different club? Same club, different session?

There's little point expecting the club to fo anything as they've made it clear they're not going to, for whatever reason. So you have to change what you can change. Its not fair, but it's life.

No one is suggesting the child should be asked to leave. But I assume if this lady in your group was throwing things, running around or messing up other people’s projects you would probably work with her to prevent that instead of just letting it happen?

He isn't being excluded though is he, he doesn't enjoy the hobby as much but he hasn't been excluded so YABU.

It sounds like the activity is run by people who won't/can't run it properly. It sounds similar to what can happen in a workplace with a bad manager, yes they have to make adjustments for the ND person but they also have a responsibility for the remaining people too.

So every body else except the organisers should do something to sort out the problem?

The buck stops with them and they should have done something a long time ago.

You say you want support for the child, but perhaps the organisers don't have the additional resources to give.

tbh this is something they should have considered when they took the child on and maybe said "we'll do it for 6 months then review". So the club/hobby needs to be inclusive, but the kids doing the hobby ALL need to get something out of it.

With 2 ND siblings, i think OPs DC really could do with a break, if the DC sees this hobby as the break and the child is disrupting it - that's no help to anyone.

I'd say the club isn't inclusive at all. Inclusive means not only including those who are ND, but supporting them as well. The child isn't supported at all. I would just leave and move on with life - no point in talking to people who won't listen. Find an alternative way to do the hobby, or something similar.

I'd be looking king to find DC a different club. They have to accommodate ND all the time at home so need some respite away from it.

The child isn’t barrelling into other children though.

Perhaps suggest to the leaders that now they know the Nd child for two years, they keep a special eye on the team Nd child is allocated to and assist the team with strategies so the child is included and doesn't disturb (as another poster suggested). If it's possible then kids will quickly learn to use them. If not possible then the leaders can't wash their hands. They need to get a volunteer or relative stays until behaviour improves. Perhaps Nd child could stay for part but not while session. It could be too much stimulation for them

I'd love to hear the club's side of this.

Have any other children felt the need to leave because of this one child's behaviour? Or is it only your DS who finds it intolerable? I would like to know what the staff at the club would say about this, because if this child is so destructive that other kids are leaving I find it difficult to believe that they would be so unconcerned. I do wonder whether there is an element of your child being unusually intolerant, and you reinforcing that; that's just an impression I get from reading your posts.

Actually a few people have suggested the child should leave.

And yes of course I would then work to prevent that, I would also hope that other people in the club would be understanding that someone is part of a community despite the fact that they may have difficulties.

I'm not saying that the club's behaviour is ideal, it sounds like the child needs a 1to1 (as I've said a lot of times now), but the community within a club can also be welcoming and helpful.

Children and young people need to learn that when you live in a society with other people, things do not always run in quite the way you want them to, because other people are part of that society too, and we have to muddle along together and find solutions.

I’d say the club needs to stop doing the unsupervised activities - this kid needs shoervision. can all the frustrated kids go and repeatedly complain to the staff and request supervision each week?

If this is an activity you pay for then I expect you have more leverage than a hobby club run by volunteers.

If they are put in groups can you ask that your DC is put in another group and not with this child? I wouldn't feel awkward about asking that after all our DC need to see us advocating for them.

The staff seem relieved that your ds may be leaving which makes me wonder if he is the only one with a problem. Perhaps he “fixates” on the other child because he has unexpressed but rather more complicated feelings about his ND siblings than you are willing to entertain.

If this is a paid for activity I'd be complaining more formally - is this something you can go an observe yourself to see if it's as bad as your child says?

I’d be well bored of this too. And what a shame, because this hobby sounds interesting! Any alternatives to the particular hobby? Venture scouts, orienteering?