Expecting 73 year old mother to travel to visit us?

[Frazzledmum77]

My 73 year old mum has been giving out signals for a few years now that she doesn’t want to make the train journey to see us (about 4 hours including tube across London). Today I invited her to come for a few days next week and she said sorry no, she really doesn’t like the travelling and could I please come to her instead? I gently explained no, the kids need me here. She had 3 kids herself so I’m really surprised she even suggested it tbh, it’s not something she would ever have done in my position, except in emergencies. I’m the primary caregiver and I can’t just swan off to stay with my mother in the middle of the week! I get that she has some form of travel anxiety and I know this is common. But she still manages to take flights to see family overseas, as recently as a couple of weeks ago. Part of it is definitely that she’s not so keen on DH and sadly also seems to have little time for my kids, she seems much happier when she’s just with me, and she can talk at me for hours about whatever she likes. Im feeling a bit bruised, this isn’t the first time this issue has come up, but it’s the first time it’s been a definite “no”. We’ll see a lot less of her if she’s not prepared to travel, her house is tiny and we can’t stay with her as a family. Not sure whether to fight this or just accept it?

Is it the tube across London? I'm 70 and drive/meet up with friends/take trains but recently went to London and I found the tube a bit overwhelming. The crowds pushing and I had to use two tubes. I honestly felt like it was the first time I felt like "a little old lady." I'm not nervous about travel generally so if she has some anxiety that might be the issue.

Could you meet her in London and do the last stage of the journey with her? Might not be reasonable as I obviously have no idea how far that is.

Doing it all the time makes the difference, if the OPs mother has some anxiety and doesn't do it "all the time" it will seem very different. My husband used to work in London and lived there Monday to Friday, I'd often go and stay and it was no issue. Now I go years without going to London and it seems much more of an issue.

Public transport can be an absolute pig for many reasons.

Walking to the bus stop.
Standing around waiting for a bus.
People shoving their way in front of you to get on the bus.
Standing on the bus trying to not get sent flying.
Getting through people who just won't move so you can get off the bus.
Making your way through crowds of people, crossing multiple pavements and roads to get to the train station.
Getting through the barriers at the train station.
Walking down (or up) loads of steps to get to the platform - lifts and escalators are frequently out of action or are in completely different directions to where the passenger flow is directed.
Standing around waiting for the train.
People shoving in front to get onto the train.
Lifting oneself and luggage onto the train.
Standing on the train (often whilst other people's massive cases have seats and aisles to themselves)
Getting down off the train onto the platform with luggage.
Going up or down steps from the platform with luggage (see earlier comment about lifts and escalators).
Getting through barriers with luggage and people shoving in front.
Finding way to tube station that may or may not be easily accessible.
Waiting on platform.
Getting on tube with luggage and no seats.
Getting off at correct station with luggage. Platforms frequently have massive bloody leaps down from the train.
Making way out of tube station, lifts or escalators not guaranteed, weird, confusing routes not well signposted.
Possibly having to find another part of the same tube station for an ongoing tube or travelling to the connecting rail station.
Repeating attempt to find correct part of rail station, steps,platforms, trains.
Getting off again.
Making way out to buses.
Catching buses.
Walking to destination.

Add to that extra difficulties, such as

Cancellations
Weather
Large crowds
Unfamiliarity with area

and age/health related ones, such as

Back pain
Hip/knee pain
Shoulder pain
Lack of peripheral vision (maybe eyesight is deteriorating) making it hard to see directions/signs/adjusting to the people barging their way in front or judge the leap down from the train onto the platform with luggage.
Hearing issues making it hard to hear announcements or know quite what's going on
Being conscious of being smaller and less agile than the people around
Stiffness in joints meaning sitting/standing/walking quickly and securely is unpleasant
Lack of toileting facilities
Just being tired and weaker physically

Compared to a cab to an airport, pretty much level surface all the way, assistance more available (rail assist is far more unreliable when you're actually reliant upon it, as any search of X/Twitter will demonstrate), a guaranteed seat for the majority of the journey and absolute priority transport services?

I know which one is more tolerable - and it's not the one that gets her to your front door.

My mum struggles with trains but can fly with assistance. Have you organised assistance for trains?

Sometimes it's just the thought of having to set off and deal with the tube or trains that would put a person off having to use either. I'm not sure how close your mum is to a train station that she can get on and you can meet that train at your nearest station, but if she didn't have to do the tube bit, she might be more open to travelling by train to see you.
Could you arrange and pay for a taxi to collect her from her house and drop her to the train station perhaps? Might that be an option? She would pay for the train ticket but you would pay for the taxi.

Just a suggestion.

I'm in a similar situation OP, except my DM has always been very reluctant to travel - doesn't like to drive too far, and won't take public transport unless it's a very short straightforward journey. Nothing to do with age although she is now near 80 it's always been like this. All through my 20s, 30s, 40s, I sucked it up and did the 2 hour journey to see her. She then moved further away (4 hours drive, longer on public transport, including 2 tubes across London to switch trains). And still expected me to do the travelling. Which I did for the first couple of years.

But now I'm a bit older myself, I have a back problem that makes long journeys uncomfortable amd carrying luggage difficult, menopause has left me less confident than I used to be about driving long distances and I generally have less energy and more commitments than when I was younger.

I've offered to meet halfway and various other ideas, but been refused. So we basically don't see each other. It is what it is; I know she's upset about it, but she still won't make the effort. The only options from her perspective are that I do the travelling to her, or she has suggested that my DH could do the 8 hour round trip twice to pick her up and take her back! Which I am not asking him to do.

Going across London on the tube with a suitcase isn't much fun for anyone at any age, least of all when you're in your 70's. She could get knocked over, feel very anxious & uneasy etc. Flying is completely different - presumably she gets taxi or lift to airport, then only has to negotiate airport stuff & have a scooter take her if necessary. Why can't you arrange to meet her off her train in London & then do the tube & the rest of the journey with her? Your children need to see their Grandma and your Mum needs to see you too. Surely you can get childcare for a day to go & help your Mum so that she can visit. It sounds rather selfish to me.

Your children need to see their Grandma

well, Grandma doesn’t see it that way. See the op.

“and sadly also seems to have little time for my kids, she seems much happier when she’s just with me, and she can talk at me for hours about whatever she likes. “

I am 74. Until my DH died this year I drove north for 3 hours to our second home every 3/4 weeks. I am going to drive to Derby on Monday to dog-sit for my DD who is going on a work trip to the US - her partner is out all day and their dog has anxiety issues, which I hope he does not pass on to my dog! I am planning to drive to Newark in July (if I get a space) for a book sale. Your DM obv does not want to see you with DCs and DH. It means visiting her, probably, but do so reluctantly and on your terms only i.e. when you are free. She is being manipulative.

This. Absolutely.

Remember that things change you say she still flies - but does she really? when did she last fly? is she planning to again? Sooner or later she'll probably stop wanting to do that alone.

If you can afford it or she can (even if saving up means fewer trips) is paying for a private car an option? (sort of executive transport type cars - they are usually cheaper for long distance if pre-booked in advance than a taxi for a looong way)

Would you go if it was a 4 hour journey on several trains and multiple tubes with overnight bags?

Driving to Derby doesn't mean much without knowing how long the journey is. You could be in a near by village and it is under ten miles for all we know.

I'm 70 and happily do a 5 hour journey to visit one of my kids, I still don't enjoy the train journey to London followed by a tube changes and another train.

You are being very judgemental.

I never said multiple tubes. One tube, Hammersmith and City, KX to Paddington. Both stations accessible, one small wheelie case. A journey taken many times before.

I always pay for everything. Unless she chooses taxi across London instead of tube which she has previously but didn’t like that either because of their driving style (too fast/risky/route not as expected). For the same reason she wouldn’t want a private car transfer.

Yes it takes the same amount of time by car. Especially if you stop for a wee. Or two. And if there is traffic, which is just as unpredictable as the trains.

I do realise that eventually she won’t feel or be able to make the journey. I just don’t see a genuine reason to stop now. But fair enough, all points on travel difficulty absolutely taken on board. There is of course a certain amount of stress in travelling as we age.

I’m ignoring the posts attempting to make me feel guilty about what time I may or may not have left (honestly!!!) and about how I should be spending hours on the road ferrying her around. I’m sure that time will have to come. I just don’t agree that time is now.

So sorry for your loss.

That route can be very busy paddington is a lot of walking especially if you're on the wrong platform. And is rammed with people going to/from Heathrow with numerous cases. For many the whole tube thing is just too much and she does sound very anxious.
I wouldn't ignore it and assume she has years left my kids lost all 4 of their grandparents in 2 years the oldest one just made 70 and was working 2 months earlier. It's never nice facing up to our parents aging and brings up our own mortality but it does sound like she's aging more than you realise.

One tube, Hammersmith and City, KX to Paddington.

I do that journey to visit a friend in Devon and she does it in reverse to come here to Cambridgeshire. It’s a long and confusing walk from the tube to the platform. We both hate the London leg of the journey.

My MIL is similar age and does similar journey when visiting us. We can tell it is taking more out of her in the last year than it has in the past. She used to be really fit and healthy but is beginning to get some health conditions in the last couple of years. Luckily having previously been fit it hasn’t hit her as hard as it could but does still impact her. I know there will come a time when she won’t manage the journey, and it might be sooner than we originally thought it would be

Could you speak to some taxi firms, see if any can offer a reassuring driver who doesn't drive too fast etc.

The bit about the route made me smile. I am not the world's best driver and I refuse to let DF dictate routes to me as he barks out turns at the very last minute. I was driving them out for lunch and he started suddenly shouting loudly at me and I almost crashed the car. Turns out the sat nav route was not his preferred one, but it got us there and he grudgingly admitted it was about the same length of time as his route.

When some visitors came over they were horrified I wouldn't let 90 year old DF sit in the front, but I'm not putting myself and all my passengers in danger by allowing him to shout and unnerve me.

I guess what I am trying to say is do what you can, but you're a person too.

I did it one year and found after walking what felt like miles the lift was off, the escalators were off and after doing all that, there was another bloody set of steps. And the previous Penzance service was cancelled, so there were no reservations, meaning I spent 5 hours sitting on the floor by the toilet as the aisles were so blocked (as were seats) with cases that the guard couldn't get along to tell passengers to move them.

Pig of a journey.

OP has offered to have a weekend break in London with her mum. For which she would presumably meet her off the train at KX and then go together to a hotel. DM doesn’t want to do this.

I think the fundamental issue OP has is that her DM’s “solution” is for OP to do exactly as she wants ie come up on her own to visit. It’s possible DBro could bring DM halfway in the car and OP could meet her there. Or that DM could do that halfway in a private hire taxi. All sorts of things are possible, but DM is assuming that the one that suits her best is the one that should happen.

I am sympathetic because DM is the same, mindset wise.

She will not adopt anything internet related despite email having been around since she was in her late 50s, say. If I want to speak to her on the phone, it has to be around her commitments of cleaner, carer etc - but she will complain if she phones during the work day and I don’t have time to talk etc

This made me smile. A lot. Very relatable!

Please could everyone stop the guilt trip lectures. Lost DF at 62 suddenly (and before everyone starts saying that’s why DM is anxious, they had separated 10 years previously). Lost FIL at 61, same year. DM is the only remaining grandparent for DBro’s kids. I’m not living in a bubble untouched by mortality, ‘elderly’ or otherwise. I’ve lost 2 good friends these past 3 years. Either of us could get bad news we weren’t expecting. Or we might both live into our 90s. That doesn’t mean I should feel guilty about not prioritising solo time with DM over other things I consider more important (and which she definitely doesn’t) such as my DCs/career/family time. If we were living closer then that would be different because it would be easy to pop in for a cuppa. But that’s not the case (something else I don’t think I should feel guilty about, after all, DM chose to live in an entirely different country to her family!)

That doesn’t mean I should feel guilty about not prioritising solo time with DM over other things I consider more important (and which she definitely doesn’t) such as my DCs/career/family time. If we were living closer then that would be different because it would be easy to pop in for a cuppa. But that’s not the case (something else I don’t think I should feel guilty about, after all, DM chose to live in an entirely different country to her family!)

absolutley right not to feel guilty - and anyway, DBro is up there for the “pop in” visits!