3yo sent toilet on his own in preschool and he had an accident

[Lockdownmama2021]

My 3yo is potty trained, he has very rarely had accidents with wee and has never ever done a no2 in pants. He started preschool in April, prior to this he was at home with me. And even when he’s watching his fav movie he will tell me when he needs the toilet. Today he told a teacher he needs to go they sent him to the toilets on his own. And when they went to check he was standing there and he had pooped in his pants - when the teacher realised and took his pants down he then did wee which he was clearly holding in. Now I’m so shocked. He has never done that and they were trying to play it down but when I asked why no one went with him they said they usually do but were busy and some of their older kids can go independently and since he knows what to do they thought he can. I mean I feel like the teacher was downplaying their negligence, to me he’s just started preschool he never goes toilet alone at home I always go with him and guide him. I’m just getting a really uneasy feeling about his preschool as well I feel like my boy is very intimidated there and not his happy confident self and since going he’s become timid and quiet. I don’t know if I’m being overprotective or babying him too much. But sending a new kid to the toilets on his own is not right imo. Aibu?

Our nursery had the toilets in the classroom. In an area towards the back. With sinks visible. Toilets were cubicle doors. But all the kids pretty much went on their own unless there was a specific need shared with the staff. So whilst they went on their own the row of cubicles could be seen by the staff. But yes, school nurseries would likely have them going on their own.

They do not offer one to one care!!!!

I’ve worked in nurseries for the least 25 years and we def don’t accompany children to the toilet!! The only way I would do is if we were toilet training

@Pineapplecolada1

It's preschool he's just turned 3, of course they do, my ds wasn't even toilet trained until 3.5
In nursery they are supposed to accompany little ones and offer help until they learn while gently encouraging independence, by the time they are in reception (school age) they should then be confident enough to do it themselves.

I have worked in 3 different early years centres and we only accompany children who are toilet training for the first few weeks until they are showing independence and the ability to get on the toilet, flush toilet and wash hands.

our toilets are just off our rooms, so can see children entering toilets and leaving them too.if we realise someone has been in longer than usual then we pop in to see how they are but we do not accompany every child to the toilet.

Reading your thread title made me think your 3yo slipped and hurt himself when you meant accident but I echo what the majority of the posters here have said already.

Part of preschool is learning to go to the loo independently etc.

It’s not neglect. It’s very normal for a nursery to allow a child who they’ve been told is toilet trained to go to the toilet themselves. Did you think they’d be accompanied at nursery and then all of a sudden have to manage it themselves when they go up to school? It doesn’t work like that. Every child has to have a “first time” of taking themselves to the toilet, maybe it would have been better for your son if that had been at home first?

However - he’s not toilet trained yet. Not properly. If he’ll stand in a toilet and soil himself waiting for someone to prompt and guide him as you’ve said, rather than sorting himself out, then he’s not toilet trained.

You also mentioned that you were annoyed the staff didn’t give you advice on how to approach it with him. Why would you need to be advised on that? Is it possible you’re building this up to be a bigger problem than it is, and your son is picking up on that? Maybe that’s why you’re interpreting him as being “traumatised”.

This toilet thing is a non-issue, but it sounds like you’ve already made up your mind you don’t like this nursery and the workers on the basis of other interactions you’ve had. By all means move your son, but going by your judgment of the toilet thing it sounds like you’d be unfair to do a “juicy google review” and I have a feeling you might find issues wherever you go…

Google it

I have to say that i do find your response a tad over the top OP. 'Negligent'? 'traumatized?'. Unless you relax a little, you run the risk of turning this into a bigger issue for him than it needs be. It's a lesson. The staff weren't negligent, for a temporary lapse in their otherwise high standards. It can't be guaranteed that they accompany all children at all times to the toilet, regardless of what else is going on. Your child is not the only one there and juggling 4 other children is really hard work. Priorities change constantly in an environment like that. Put yourself in their position. There's 1 of them. Perhaps another child was having a melt down or was injured and your son, who is 3 and never had an accident before needs the toilet. Would it not be reasonable of them to send him by himself? Lesson learned. They now know that he's not as independent as they first thought. You now realise that there is some prep work that you can do with your son in terms of helping him being more independent at home and ensuring that his clothes are easy to get on and off.

Your posts come across as rather defensive, which is not helping your cause. Anyone who agrees with you gets rewarded with the praise that they are impartial for siding with you..if people disagree with you, presumably they are not being impartial, therefore you can disregard your opinions.

If you have any cause for complaint, it could be the 'omg' comment, although i doubt that it was intended to chastise your son. It appears to be a momentary exclamation borne from surprise at the situation. She clearly wasn't expecting that. That said, she should be more aware of her language and should be picked up on that in a calm polite manner.

I wouldn't consider leaving 'a juicy review'. That seems like a rather unfair way of handling the situation, especially given the power imbalance here ( i'm guessing that you are older than some of the staff there and earn more than they do. As a customer, you slating them publicly risks 1 of 2 things. Either they feel very humiliated, stressed and it could put their job at risk or 2, you come across as being a bit unreasonable and precious. Neither are good outcomes.

Your best bet is to remain calm, tell your son that she said 'omg' as she was a bit surprised as she had forgotten that you needed a bit more help and then just explain that it's not a problem, but that next time, to not wait and that he can have a go by himself. You can address any other issues in a polite email privately.

I think you’ve summed it up, it wasn’t just an isolated incident.
i have liked a few posts that are calling me unreasonable, when they’re objective and impartial.

I work in a primary school and it's the same school my children go to including my 3 year old who's in nursery. Our school is very much ' children unless
They have additional needs, even starting nursery they have to be toilet trained, comfortable going on their own and know how to wipe/ wash hands after etc' since she's started in Jan she often I'd say every week has an accident ( for her it's not having her pants down low enough so abit gets onto the leggings etc) we pack several spare items weekly so if she does have an accident she can change. We just continue to support her at home with toileting and keep the communication open at school ( which I admit since I work there and am friendly
With her teachers I am at an advantage there!). I think from working with the teachers and seeing how busy they are and also how much effort can take even just taking one child to the toilet they probably have mislead you with that tbh. What happens, for example, if it's outdoor play and a child needs the toilet? If one member of staff leaves to take child then nursery are then in a safeguarding situation by not having the right amount of staff to be outside with the children whilst one is inside with a child at the toilet. Similar with dinner time etc. but I feel this is the nursery's issue here they have offered to you something that's clearly not something they are able to commit to, you have I assume gone and told child' don't worry so and so will be with you' and then when they aren't he will be confused and be waiting bless him. At the least they should have told him he was going on his own today and not having a child with him so he wasn't waiting/ expecting.

I completely understand why you are annoyed though, you want to be able to advocate for your child and hope they are treated right when you aren't with them. Sounds like the nursery needs to work on communication and if you can say again ' so can he have a teacher every time? And if not can you tell me that so I can prepare him for that scenario '

I don't think you are overreacting though op, sending your babies to school is always hard

Reading your update saying that he usually only goes during the group toilet session before snack, makes me think then that they do not actually accompany every individual child to the toilet every single time. They will be too busy to be doing this. He has been accompanied every time because obviously with a larger group of children you definitely wouldn’t send them unsupervised!

I worked in a preschool. We did this before lunch time we would take small groups of children in the bathroom at a time, and just generally supervise with handwashing etc. If a child needs help with anything then they would indicate/ask for that and of course we would help them. But as a default we wouldn’t just accompany every individual child and be pulling their clothes down for them etc.

Sounds like on this occasion he asked to go to the toilet at a different time to the group toilet session, therefore they expected he would be able to just take himself as while supervising in a group they had seen that he appeared competent.

I used to go in and help if a child shouted for me. But other than children that were known to need more support, or ones that were still new to toilet training we didn’t accompany every individual child each time.

I agree that the key worker sounds unprofessional in how she worded things though the omg you’ve pooped could’ve have just been a surprise as she didn’t realise. But yes the deciding to do the wee on the floor comment isn’t great. I feel like if you have gut feelings that the preschool isn’t right for him then take him out and see if you can find a new one that’s a better fit, and in the meantime perhaps start practicing at home him going to the toilet by himself to prepare him for instances where he will need to use the toilet independently, and easy to pull down joggers etc x

Don’t worry op. Mumsnet is incredibly judgemental and if your kis isn’t potty trained as soon as they are born, you’re a shit parent.

Kids are all different. My DS is also 3. He can actually take himself to the toilet, but is still not fully trained, in terms of not always telling us when he needs a wee, and we are still struggling to get him to do a poo in the toilet at all. He does a lot better at nursery and is very stubborn at home. Our nursery is very good with him though.

They’ll all get there, and obv our boys won’t start school until Sept 2025 anyway. I hope you find a resolution with the preschool.

What are the other incidents?

Seriously I’ve said it before, whatever the weather please don’t leave a ‘juicy review’ I know people who have and have been threatened with legal action.’ What happened here is a very minor things with some fault placed with both parties. I’ve worked in a school nursery with the youngest kids being three days before they start in September, and other than break times and lunch when they all go en mass they are expected to go unaccompanied if it’s ad hoc (with the bathroom being where we can see it)

I did say in my big long post my other reasons but this incident is absolutely nothing and as a leader I would apologise about the incident but wouldn’t really be giving this a second thought, or making it into a big issue. Unless it’s a major safeguarding issue then this is a none event!

3 years olds do go the loo on their own in a school nursery and in a preschool. If he needed help he should have said. The staff will check on the child but it is expected the child will say I need my bottom wiping etc.

@Lockdownmama2021 regardless of this incident, I've always found it imperative that I have a good amount of confidence in childcare providers and the setting my DCs were at

Mine are mid and late teens now, but the one time I listened to others like some of these frankly malicious replies here, my DD was injured by a child at nursery. I had spoken to their keyworker a number of times regards my concerns for my DDs safety around this specific child, and been fobbed off.

In the end, the child hit my DD so hard, her head smacked a table as he hit her from behind, he was huge compared to her and she was sitting doing an activity. First he pulled her hair, and when the trainee keyworker(who was meant to be shadowed by someone senior) told him not to do that again, he hit my DD incredibly hard and her forehead smashed into the table. We had to take her to A+E because the lump she had was huge.

When I spoke to the lead of the nursery, her attitude was "well kids will be kids" and that DD was fine so no harm done! I was livid and said I and other parents had red flagged that child, that he was a bully and the size of this kid compared to the rest.

I gave notice to them on that phone call, and when I went to sign paperwork and collect some things of DDs, his equally vile mother made comments to me about DD and it was obvious there was a huge safeguarding issue which nursery should have reported.

I've never not trusted my gut since and actually moved both my DCs from a primary school at one point because once again they were being bullied and school failed to act, after a few months of escalation that was it, de-regged, home schooled for a month and then sent them elsewhere when a place came up- and they thrived there

Trust your instincts, the keyworker words were hurtful, shaming and failed to take responsibility for their part in failing your child. I would be giving notice.

I disagree there. As ops child, did indeed go to the loo on his own

I'm your shoes I'd have said "oh dear, he does still need support at home to go so I suspect he's panicked a bit if he couldn't get his trousers down. Never mind Kirk, don't worry about it". So they know he needs support and you're downplaying it to your son.

Even if they usually go, and ours would normally supervise at that age at least, there are going to be times in nursery when there's a lot going on and teachers have to prioritise. Your kid is sometimes going to not be the priority. A sensible kid who normally goes to the toilet fine himself may have to be trusted to try it alone if there's an issue with ratios or something else going on.
I assume they cleaned him up and he got clean dry clothes to wear?

I think that someone should go with him the first few times he needs the toilet while there. That's not baby'ing, that's helping a child to do it even better when independent. That person could just stand and encourage your child in every step, I suppose your son can pull his pants down, sit on the toilet etc. without any help. I'm sure once your boy is feeling more at ease he will be capable of going alone. I still accompany my grandson (4 y.). Of course he goes alone, but I stay close and fold some laundry and such, ask him if he's done, now flush, pull up your pants, go wash your hands.

3 year olds in OP's nursery don't go to the loo on their own

She never said that.

You are making things up over and over again.

She said he usually went when all of the class go at the same time.

This time he clearly didn't. We don't know if he went successfully other times on different days. Maybe on days he had better trousers on.