AIBU to give up trying to get toddler in a pram?

[AnnaCBi]

My toddler is intensely wilful and extremely strong. She’s not yet 2, but I physically cannot get her in the pram when she doesn’t want to. I have hired a sleep/ behaviour consultant (originally was for sleep, But her behaviour has got really tricky recently) who simply can’t understand how I cannot get her in. She will be coming to see, but for now she says ‘I’ve never not been able to get a child in a pram in 40 years’. Even with my husband helping we cannot do it. Am I unreasonable for thinking this to be impossible and give up? I try so hard. It is also entirely on her whim as to whether I can change her nappy, it’s so so tricky! When she runs away I cannot pin her down to do it. So should I give up? Am I unreasonable to think I need to just find other ways to leave the house?

@S0livagant

We have locks high up on all of our doors so that we can shut off certain areas of the house if need be.

He's nearly 3 now and I don't need to do that. He knows if he runs off I'll just bring him back every single time. We've been there and done that. So he might sit and have a little huff about it now on occasion but the hard work has already been done in previous battles 😂 He accepts limited choices between 2 or 3 things because he knows "no" isn't an answer.

As I said in a previous post, I make sure he can say no to non-negotiable things. If a toddler can't say no to anything they'll say no to everything. They're looking for some control and autonomy so I make sure to give that and to be fair.

To be honest I think if a toddler is defiant and saying no to every single thing, something is lacking for them. I'd be looking at ways to give them that sense of fairness in their little lives. That way when you mean business they really know it.

I would actually say sleep is more of a necessity than a pushchair @OhMyReallyYouAbsoluteMoose but the point is leaving a child screaming is either harmful or it isn’t. If it’s harmful we shouldn’t do it and if it isn’t then it can be done in other contexts.

I have 3 ch, 1st completely compliant 20+ now and never did anything wrong. The 2nd 15 female & v wilfull, 3rd 20 months (for my sins) has both personality traits. Big age gaps between the 3!

I have found singing a favourite song when acting up helps as a great distraction when refusing nappy changes, car seat, pushchairs etc. The wheels on the bus is a favourite to help mainly me keep my sanity in check and I can sing louder than the screaming noises! Another one I have just found is the Happy Song by Imogen Heap. Whenever tantrums are brewing, I play this on YouTube and instant silence!

It’s a phase, all kids go through the independence phase. My 20 month old goes out in wellies and shorts in the sun, summer hats in the rain - I just roll with it these days. He’s got something on his feet, his heads covered and the appropriate clothing thrown in the changing bag for later.

Just stay calm (easier said than done) hence the singing and dance moves if needed 🙈

You are the parent.
Stop letting the toddler rule the roost.
It isn't a choice so stop letting it be. If you want a well behaved child then this needs to stop now.

'We need to change you, come and lay down'. Take by the hand if necessary.

'It's time to sit in the buggy'. Put child in.

How is a not even 2 year old able to dictate to you what to do? I don't get it and I've looked after many children over the years.

Not sure if it's been suggested, could you try a buggy board? Put her dolly in the pushchair as practice for the new baby. Maybe suggest swapping after a while. Make a gamr of it.

Haha, the choices thing only works with compliant kids, and then their parents think its the magic solution 😂

With my eldest, I decided it was time to start using it (she was 2).
I said do you want choice A or B. She looked me in the eye and said
'I want C'.
I replied, 'you can't have C, your choices are A or B'.
Her: 'those are your choices mummy. I choose C'.

It never worked on her!
Waiting it out didn't work.

Negotiation worked, but there are limits to how much you can and should negotiate with a toddler.

@Babyboomtastic

Haha, the choices thing only works with compliant kids, and then their parents think its the magic solution 😂

My toddler is far from compliant. But I give 2 or 3 choices.

@Poohsticksatdawn
Mine wouldn't have run, just gone and done something else, having completely lost interest in the park at that point. If I wanted to go to the park myself to get out of the house, then it was easier to just take the shoes, and he'd wear them without any fuss once he needed them.

I can really relate to this. My DD is 2 years and it gets harder as they get stronger and more wilful.

I’ve tried a few things and it’s getting a lot better. For example, if she doesn’t get in the pram, or lay herself on the changing mat, or climb into the bath etc… then I say for example ‘can you get in the buggy please’. When she ignores me I’ll say ‘do you want to do it or should mummy do it, if you do it then you can do the straps’. She’ll think about it and then get in. I think it gives her a sense of control allowing her to do some of it herself. But if I force her to do ANYTHING she will arch and wriggle and make it impossible.

on a more difficult day I might have to bribe her with some raisins to get her in the buggy or switch the bubbles on to change her nappy. Very rare that I can’t coax her into the buggy through some means, but I agree it’s impossible if she resists hard enough!
But I’ve never given up. If she thought for a second that she could win then she would resist harder!

Getting her involved, giving her some sense of freedom has really worked for us. 100 times easier now than 20-23 months. But they’re all different, hopefully you find a technique that works.

I wouldn't force an adult in a seat and strap them down so I don't know. Like I said it's hard to know what's ok

Yes we've done that too. Leave with the shoes in my hands and put them on at the park.

But where is he running off to, and to do what? I just bring him back every time or lock the doors. The park was just an example, but if it's something else we have to do then there's no choice in the matter. I've also flung him in the car and dealt with shoes later on, but waiting it out in the hall time after time has resulted in a boy who just gets his shoes on now. Those battles were done before.

Anything like that I see as hard work now for future gain! Like the switch from cot to bed. Sometimes you take them back to bed 50 times until they learn that you're never giving in on this one. Bedtime is bedtime. Well, shoes are shoes. Toothbrushing is toothbrushing. There's no option to wander off disinterested.

To be honest I often think it isn’t so much that the child has been worn down by your iron will, it’s more that they eventually matured out of that behaviour. I don’t think two year olds have the concept of ‘well last time mummy wouldn’t take me to the park!’

I do agree sometimes bad habits need to be broken but (as with the park thing) it only works if it’s somewhere they want to go, and even if it is, sometimes sheer will is more important.

Thanks this gives me hope. My girl is just about to turn 22 months, this all started about 2 months ago.

I don’t usually give up, but I do sometimes avoid. I just had nothing left to give today, I was exhausted. I’d already had to wrestle her shoes onto her in the church vestibule as we couldn’t leave without them on (we walked to playgroup) she took them off twice before I said ‘well that little boy has them on’ and she relented - no idea why. I’d also wrestled 3(!) dirty nappies. Today was just a particularly bad day I think. She’s at a very important developmental stage in terms of communication - she’s just really starting to put very simple sentences together- I’m hoping this is part of her being desperate to communicate her needs!

Some of it definitely doesn't fully click until they're old enough to really get it. But I do think they learn from a very young age who they can run rings around. They're not daft.

Firm isn't enough. You do have to be fair. I would never battle a child into shoes to go to the park if they don't want to, would rather stay at home and play, and we don't need to go out for any reason. But if child is asking to go out, then playing silly beggars with the shoes, then it's "we'll go once you've got your shoes on." I battle that with them now so that I'm not battling it with them in the future. Shoes on heading out and shoes off when we get home is just pure routine the same as toothbrushing morning and night or suncream and hat on in the sunshine.

Get an old school McLaren buggy.

Pick her up, fold her in half and plonk her in. Seriously, works like a dream.

For me, the buggy was a luxury. It meant I wasn't tied to the car like for work and nursery drop offs. It also signaled a little headspace for me when we'd hit it off the house.

I have one DC who is a chronically fussy eater (ARFID) diagnosed and other SEN, but that apart, you should be able to get up and go.

Mention it five and two minutes in advance, then off you go. You'll need to be able to do this when the baby comes. You're not hurting, disrespecting or ignoring your child, this is what parents have to do!!

I should say... so I note that ' common sense' doesn't always apply!

He didn't run off. If I turned something into a battle then he'd walk away. He'd have lost interest in the park so would go and do a jigsaw or look at a book. If I escalated the situation by restaining him in a hallway then it would have resulted in a meltdown.

We had no issues with teeth or going to bed, he'd take himself if he was tired earlier. Only issues with things I thought were necessary but really weren't.

We had no issues with teeth or going to bed, he'd take himself if he was tired earlier. Only issues with things I thought were necessary but really weren't.

Yes I agree with deciding what's necessary and what's not. Which is why I'd never force a child to get shoes on for the park if they don't want to go in the first place. If he wants to go to the park he needs shoes on. He knows that. We have never had bedtime issues either, that was just an example of something that often requires a lot of perseverance and not backing down from the parent.

We did have issues with some things but not anymore because I go the firm but fair route. Toothbrushing I did indeed sit in a room with him until it was done. No wandering off to read a book. He learnt quickly enough that getting it over with for 2 minutes was more fun than sitting staring at me for ages. Medicine was a big drama but, again, we waited it out with a chocolate button on the table. Now he just takes medicine no bother with no reward.

Yes I agree with deciding what's necessary and what's not. Which is why I'd never force a child to get shoes on for the park if they don't want to go in the first place.

In our case he'd want to do something but if it required something he didn't want then it would no longer be worth it to him. Like if someone offered me chocolate then said I had to eat a green olive or a black olive first I'd just say 'no thanks'. He's now an adult and still only wears shoes when strictly necessary!

A reins harness made life with my toddler much more bearable. He had houdini tendencies and could slither out of most forms of harness. Hearing the thunk of a toddler's head on the concrete floor after diving from a Costco trolley is not a sound you want to hear twice, so on trollies I'd clip the back of the reins directly to the trolley to prevent escape and diving out.

On the pram/ buggy and high chair, I used the D rings which was quicker, easier and more secure than the harnesses provided. It also provided a better range of movement so he could lean around and see better while still being safely secured.

There was an awful window when he was 2 and I was heavily pregnant with PGP. I had to stop using the buggy for a while because the pressure of pushing did not agree with my pelvis. I managed to back carry on a carrier longer as it was a counterbalance. Then there was the point when I was on crutches and had to survive a few weeks dependent solely on his negligable walking power and good will... that involved going nowhere further than about 50m from a parent and child space and it still went wrong.

He was the kind of child that if you offer option A or B, he'll choose option T- watching the Thomas DVD for the 5th time on loop that day. I tried waiting it out, but we're talking about the kind of child who'll happily wait for hours until the parents crack, or just scream relentlessly for hours. (He quite fondly remembers the day when he was sitting watching the washing machine during a parent-child standoff. I only did that one the once!

(The diagnoses followed years later...)

Some young children just can't be reasoned with while attempting to live out the normal functions of life.

DS2 was a very civilised child in comparison other than his talent for getting stuck 8ft high up trees.

That's tricky. I definitely insist with my toddler with certain things like that. I know when it's just silly beggars for the sake of it and that he'll have a great time when he's out. He's very driven by things he loves which helps. He wouldn't just wander off in protest, he wants to be outdoors playing.

I had the type that could not be bribed, some can't. Luckily, we were living where it was more acceptable to be barefoot in public so it wasn't such a problem as in the UK with different social norms.

Did I say force them in? I said put them in and wait for them to calm down saying we can't go anywhere until then you can do them up. I've had one sat by the car for 15 minutes until they realised it was car seat or nowhere. But obviously sometimes they do have to go in now then you may have to hold them until they bend not force but not let them get out ....but if your consistent when your not in a rush it really doesn't take that many times of waiting them out. The oh dear darling don't you want to cuddle crap is what drags it on. Yes you give choices when you can but sometimes a child saying no isn't an option none of the situations mentioned have been ones you can say don't matter. This is why there are so many children rattling around cars and running off down the roads....choice being pushchair or reins/hand end of.