Van life request to shower

[Uoyeb]

I have a long-standing friend who is a bit unconventional. He’s never really stuck at any job, is a bit of an artist, always low on cash. He tends to live in short term rentals, often studios or rooms in shared houses. It wouldn’t be a life for me but he seems happy and content with it, so be it.

Rents are increasing and and he recent came into a small inheritance, so he’s decided to buy a van to live in. He’ll fit it out similar to a small camper, sleep / live in the van, and then use toilet facilities that are open to the public, and showers at friends or cheap leisure centres or service stations that have that facility.

He’s asked whether, on the odd occasion, he could use our shower if he’s in the area and there’s nowhere else local to go. I’m not sure how to respond.

How would you respond?

He should be buying a van big enough to have bathroom facilities. If he wants to live a nomadic lifestyle, then fine, but he should plan properly and not rely on others to help him out.

If it was a short term proposal, it wouldn't be so bad, but it sounds as if this is going to be his lifestyle for ever.

As others have said, you need a fixed address to access services, so he needs to think about that.

If a good friend really wants to live a certain lifestyle, and has properly considered all the issues and planned what he's going to do, and one of the barriers to living this lifestyle would be overcome by me agreeing to let them come and shower/wash up etc one night every 2 months or so, I'd agree.

If it was dependent on them parking up for a month or two and wanting daily access to my bathroom then I wouldn't.

I think it's important he can be realistic, and specific, about what he is actually asking. It's all a bit vague, in which case I'd assume 'worst-case scenario' at the lack of information that would help me determine it.

I would say 'Sure, as long as it's convenient, don't just show upon my doorstep'

I do not really see a problem, for me - as long as it is occasional and i would assume that if a friend, they would be coming round to see me anyway

Actually I’ve just thought of a way it could potentially work.

Does he do or can he do painting and decorating or handyman, gardening work? I’d suggest that when he comes over and drops in he does eg put up shelves or something like that. Does shopping need to be done (heavy items)? Then it’s not just one way traffic with him relying on the charity of friends.

@Gonnagetgoingreturnsagain

'The only thing is though, it’s fine if he can actually find and afford leisure centres or use public showers. What if he can’t? There’s a reason why long distance lorry drivers have homes with bathrooms.

OP says he never sticks with a job.
Perhaps if he did he could afford a shower.

I think he’ll be fine in the summer but I’m not sure how he’s going to cope in the winter when it drops very cold

He wont. I give it until the winter and then this crazy plan will fail spectacularly. It was bitterly cold last winter for many months and even with our central heating on, I was still cold at night. He hasn't thought this through at all. Its all very well being nomadic and not wanting to live a conventional life- thats absolutely fine if you are fully independent and fully prepared, but then dont sponge off people who are in a conventional life to make up for your lack of future planning.

You cant have it both ways. As a PP has said, the fact he is always "low on cash" and has used his inheritance to buy a van without a basic toilet or shower is a strong indicator that he actually isnt self sufficient, isnt prepared, hasn't thought this through and it will end in disaster.

I suspect he'll turn up in the winter asking to stay at yours because he cant cope with the cold. If you have any issues with asserting your boundaries you need to shut this down now otherwise you'll end up with a rent free lodger come November.

As a young couple my parents didn't have a bath - so they had a rota of friends they would visit. They talk very fondly of that time in their lives - they would sometimes take wine and cook dinner for people as a thank you and they are still friends with their bath-hosts!

@wizarddry What? £5 you'd be trying to PROFIT from a friend having a shower? Wow. Just wow

Why should a friend using a shower every now & then, be responsible for the fitting of the bathroom?!

I've had a camper van with a loo/shower compartment for years and it's far more complicated than that. Trying to have a hot shower in a tiny cupboard in a small motorhome is tricky, uses a lot of gas and leaves the whole loo compartment wet — which in a British winter is a horrible thing to have to deal with. You wipe it down and then you have wet cloths/ towels to deal with in a tiny space and 6C drizzle outside... Soon everything in the van is damp. You then have to be able to refill your water tank with water (needs a tap and a hose) and find somewhere to empty the waste water tank with all your shower water — you're not supposed to just empty your soapy water onto wherever you're parked.

Chemical loos involved potentially toxic chemicals. You have to find a proper disposal site — and most of them are on campsites and you have to pay to camp. Paying to camp is what the OP's friend is trying to avoid.

Having a van with a loo and shower really isn't the answer for someone in his position.

There's also the question of why he never stays in shares for long - does he piss them off through such things as (and these are from DP's experience of people he thought were great until they actually moved in and mine from a couple of people who 'just needed a couple of weeks to find somewhere permanent because the last place didn't work out/ended/wasn't renewed')

Being an alcoholic
Being an aggressive drunk
Using heroin
Stealing
Helping himself to everybody else's food/toiletries/washing powder/etc
Not cleaning either his room so it stunk or anything in the shared areas, so never doing washing up, emptying the bin, leaving food rotting in the fridge
Always having money for fags/beer/spliff but always skint when the rent/council tax/electric/etc was due 'I'll pay you back next week' but then borrowing more
Moving in a girlfriend/mate to share the room but never the costs
Claiming that the dust/dirt/shit over the toilet pan didn't bother them, so if somebody wanted to clean it was their decision
Loud music at 4am
Louder sex in random places involving some riskier or not entirely safe practices
Getting into fights when out drunk/using and then coming back bloodied and wailing
Body odour. Oh, the body odour, especially when the bacteria and fungus was incubating in a four foot high and eight foot wide pile of unwashed clothes filling the spaces in the room that weren't occupied by half eaten pizzas, kebabs and burger boxes.
Bullying other members of the houseshare
Being racist/misogynistic/homophobic/Anti-Semitic/Islamophobic

Well he has to look into the pros and cons of having a shower/toilet in his van. If he was to do it that is.

Who's doing his washing?

Well he has to look into the pros and cons of having a shower/toilet in his van. If he was to do it that is.

C'mon, he's not the kind of person who's going to do that. If you saw Nomadland you'll have noticed that the nomads booked into campsites from time to time in order to use the facilities.

@horseyhorsey17

You'd be surprised what you can fit in.

They had a bed a fold down table with built in sofa chairs opposit, small kitchen area with hob and sink (sink had a board over it for worktop space) and a heated shower.

It was a bit of a wet room scenario, so the shower was over the loo.

They didn't even have one of those giant Sprinter vans either.

They were a couple so that would do well for a single man.

I'd love to holiday in one but I'd need a blooming bus so the three kids could fit in with us! 😂

Having a shower and loo in the van if you are living it in full time is not recommended, unless it is a massive one. The advice on forums to people living in vans full time, is not to do this. There are too many problems with it.
Very different if you just have a holiday van though.

I researched travellers and even they have a separate building (or maybe van?) for this. Presumably because of the issues involved.

There were 2 close friends of DP’s who’d come to stay with us from Australia (different people).

One was a woman who’d come with her DP and use DM’s house as a base whilst she went off around London. She could be moody though. Had no DC but worked in a well paying job for years and then bought cheaply Aboriginal art that increased in value. She’s now too old to travel.

The other was a man who won a round the world trip for his travel writing so he stayed with us for 2-3 months after that finished. Would complain a lot and loudly and parents had to politely say his stay was over. He’s now back in Oz and retired. No kids either.

The third person (very nice) was wealthy but always stayed in a local hotel, and then saw us.

I do think blurred lines can be crossed when “friends” even close ones stay.

A couple of the first woman’s friends never had her to stay as she was too much. Despite her being godparents to one of them who had 2 DC.

I’d reply with boundaries first..

”yes of course, 2x a week is fine by me”

or something along those lines.

Why should a friend using a shower every now & then, be responsible for the fitting of the bathroom?!

I’m not saying he “should”. I’m just saying that that is the real cost of it. It’s like people who don’t drive and expect lifts from others and proudly proclaim that they offer petrol money. Obviously this is fine as an arrangement if both parties are happy, but the person getting the lifts is not actually covering the costs. That’s why taxis are so expensive.

Yes, it's not about him actually paying to use the bathroom, it's about the fact that he is opting out of either buying his own property and installing a bathroom or renting somewhere with a bathroom.
OP has costs associated with her bathroom beyond just water and electricity. He is opting out of providing himself with a bathroom and choosing to have showers at friends' homes so that he does not have to pay towards his own bathroom. That's cheeky fucker territory.
He can pay to use a gym or leisure centre if he wants to live on the road.

As for the whole "we can tell what you vote" based on answers to this thread - are people implying Tory voters would tell him to jog on and the nice, cuddly, friendly labour voters would have him there using their bathroom?
I'm lifelong labour and quite far left really and I wouldn't be having him there. He's opted out of "the system". He's not in that position because of ill fortune - unemployed through no fault of his own (eg. the many people made redundant over the years due to industries closing); ill-health (mental or physical); spousal abuse; spiralling drug addiction etc.
He could work and he could rent his own home (possibly even buy if the inheritance is enough) but he doesn't want to and that's fair enough as long as he isn't taking money from tax payers which should be going to those genuinely in need. But he also doesn't get to base his life plan on scrounging showers/laundry and who knows what off other people.

As for the whole "we can tell what you vote" based on answers to this thread - are people implying Tory voters would tell him to jog on and the nice, cuddly, friendly labour voters would have him there using their bathroom?
I'm lifelong labour and quite far left really and I wouldn't be having him there. He's opted out of "the system". He's not in that position because of ill fortune - unemployed through no fault of his own (eg. the many people made redundant over the years due to industries closing); ill-health (mental or physical); spousal abuse; spiralling drug addiction etc.
He could work and he could rent his own home (possibly even buy if the inheritance is enough) but he doesn't want to and that's fair enough as long as he isn't taking money from tax payers which should be going to those genuinely in need. But he also doesn't get to base his life plan on scrounging showers/laundry and who knows what off other people

Yup. I am a life long labour supporter and I also said no. Never voted Tory in my life.

I think it's incredibly naive to take one issue such as this and make sweeping generalisations. I'd even say that was quite a right wing approach to do so 😂

In any event, I think I’m going to say yes but put very clear expectations around how often and arrangements

100% Reasonable, setting boundaries 👍

I couldn’t cope with this. I’d offer to cook for him but not shower. I realise I’m a bit odd!

Add in the costs of him using your toiletries and washing your towel/his towel everytime, having to clean the bathroom, even if he does it, it'll be your bathroom cleaner.

I reckon that will all add up to close to a fiver a shower.

Then count on him wanting this shower mid morning. If your working ooh then he'll need a key, if your wfh, it might not be the best timing.

It would be a no from me.