I think mum threatened toddler, she doesn't, AIBU?

[Originalusername89]

I was busy doing something that required both hands.

Baby started crying in her pram, toddler went over and started stroking her head but then this changed to hitting her (toddler has form for this when tired plus overwhelm of baby crying. I genuinely don't think it's malicious, more strange toddler impulse, we are working on it, it's improved, and we always physically separate them if this happens, it's not ok to hit etc etc)

Before I could get there my mum tried to diffuse the situation by telling her to stop and then I heard her say 'do you need to see what that feels like?'

At this point I just dropped what I was doing came over, took my toddler (baby strapped in buggy to easier to remover toddler) and told my mum not to threaten her.

Mum said 'i wasn't threatening her'

I said 'the only way to show her what that feels like is if you were prepared to hit her, which is a threat'

She said 'its not a threat I was teaching her lesson'

I think, even if my mum knows she would never actually hit her, as far as the two year old is concerned her grandmother was prepared to hit her.

For context we have a difficult relationship, my mum can't see things from anyone elses point of view, will never apologise or acknowledge what she could have done differently, will defend her actions until she's blue in the face - so she won't see this from the toddlers point of view only hers which is 'i was never going to actually hit her so it's ok' - and she won't see this from my point of view but will accuse me of overreacting. So I'm not bringing it back up with her.

YANBU: it was a threat and it's not ok to threaten a small child with physical punishment

YABU: It wasn't a threat/you're over reacting

PS. not looking for advice on the hitting please, just did my mum threaten toddler or didn't she?

This thread is weird. "Do you need to see what that feels like" is clearly a threat like "Do you need a smacked bottom" is a threat. Everything else people are saying might be (probably is) true: that the OP should've prevented the hitting or stopped it sooner, that it was clumsy wording and unintentional, that the toddler won't have understood it as a threat, that it's unimportant compared to the hitting, that OP unnecessarily alienated her DM when she was helping, that OP isn't protecting her helpless baby enough, or all of the other stuff. But it's so obviously an indirect threat, if you just judge it by the standards of normal conversational English you've heard all your life. It doesn't undermine any of the other points to accept that, intentional or not, that phrasing implies a threat to show the toddler what it feels like to be hit.

I haven’t voted because you are BOTH being unreasonable.

I think it did sound like a threat, but doesn’t matter as I don’t think a 2 year old would understand that tbh. Language is a bit too complex there.

Consequences need to be simple, firm and whenever possible, immediate.

eg if you hit baby sibling, no tv, no treats, this toy goes away or whatever is appropriate for your child. And a very firm NO.

The issue here is that neither of you are dealing with it properly. I know you said you don’t want advice on it, but it is linked to your original question.

Gentle parenting and a wolly "don't do that darling" isn't going to help when your toddler really whacks and hurts the baby.

Your mums response to my mind was spot on.

And it sounds like you can't turn your back, your toddler knew you couldn't stop them in that moment, so needs pretty firm boundaries.

I worry that you seem more concerned about your toddler "feeling threatened" and don't seem to be horrified that your completely defenceless newborn baby is regularly hit by a much bigger, scarier person for them.

How can you write that this happens regularly ("the toddler has form for it") without a hint of shame, and then on the next breath rant against your DM protecting your newborn baby? Is a supposed "threat" worse than a baby actually being assaulted? The baby must feel terrified!

How old is your toddler?

Toddler needs to be firmly told no and heavily supervised near baby in the meantime.

Clumsy wording maybe, but gran did nothing wrong.

Not the best turn of phrase, and there is a threat in there. How harmful it is, is based on your child's experience of physical punishment and if granny is scary .,Possibly it doesn't matter in the scheme of things if you know that actually she wouldn't hit him and he wasn't scared he would be. But you need to stop his hitting of the baby PDQ. Move on from the comment which as an empty threat is ineffectual anyway.

Ps if your immobile baby ends up with bruises you could find yourself under scrutiny and saying your toddler did it in a casual way won't be the best response.

Another bloody 'gentle parent' 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️ God help you OP when your 'gently parented' child starts school...they're in for a world of hurt!

You were able to drop what you were doing when you didn't like what your mother was doing but not when your toddler was hitting your baby. I think your priorities are wrong.

The baby should not be placed in a position where their sibling can hit them again - there is no excuse for them to be hit knowing the toddler is a hitter! that would be pretty poor parenting!

Maybe it is a threat. But maybe the toddler needs the threat of something stronger than "we're working on it" in order to stop her physically hurting a baby.

@Originalusername89 you knew your toddler was hitting your baby and didn't immediately stop what you were doing to go to her. You waited until your mother said something to then stop what you were doing and have a go at your mother.

You are really focussing on the wrong thing here. You are so blinkered by your strained relationship with your mother that you can't recognise the real problem. People might say you are both wrong. In this situation you are the one who is more wrong.

Do you ever see an occasion where you would shout at your toddler in order to stop her doing something dangerous?

If she was about to run out onto the road in front of a car?
If she was about to put her hand on a burning hob?

Sometimes it is necessary to raise your voice and give your child a fright. It is not going to scar them for life occasionally being scolded. You are doing her, and more importantly your baby, no favours by being wishy washy about this. Even your reaction to this incident was to move the baby out of the way not actually deal with the toddler directly.

You need to change your approach. No more "working on it". Just deal with it.

The issue with your mother is a side distraction. Deal with the real issue.

Most posts on here saying it wasn’t a threat but could have been worded better!! Well she should apologise and acknowledge she could have worded it better. It was threat, whether your toddler understood that or not is not clear or relevant. I wouldn’t end the relationship with your mum over it personally but if it’s final straw then only you can decide that.

Maybe it is a threat. But maybe the toddler needs the threat of something stronger than "we're working on it" in order to stop her physically hurting a baby.

Oh I definitely agree that OP is focussing on the wrong thing, and there needs to be some much more proactive prevention and much firmer management of the behaviour.

But I think that, since what was said was so obviously (to me, at least) an example of a common form of threat, the message is more likely to get through if that's acknowledged, but set aside as probably unimportant. If I was OP, all the posts saying "of course it's not a threat, it's the same as saying how would you like it" would just make me feel like doubling down on why it's a threat, rather than engaging with the parts saying that other things are far more important.

Agree with the pp who said you are viewing it from your toddlers side- them feeling frustrated at the crying baby etc.

You need to think about baby’s feelings, shock, pain etc. also you need to think about toddlers processing. Baby is irritating me, mummy is busy, I hit baby, mummy comes and gives me attention, baby is left, I win precious resources, ie mummy’s time. it worked, so it will happen again.

Wheras poor baby, who sounds like they were already crying is learning, if I am in pain, discomfort, hungry and I cry for help I will get hurt. Then I will be abandoned by my main care giver, whilst the person who hurt me is given attention. Only all of this will
be going on preverbally for them, and as a result will be very difficult to unpick later.

Go to baby, comfort baby, let toddler hear and see you soothing the focus or their rage acknowledging that it hurt. Then turn to your toddler and very firmly in face and voice say “no hitting”. Continue to smooth baby then spend some quality time with the both of them to repair the rift.

It's a bit disingenuous to ask posters to only comment on your mother and not on the situation that caused your mother to say what she said.

Also, depending on how old your toddler is they won't have actually understood the language anyway so your toddler would have not felt any threat. Whereas your baby absolutely felt physically hurt.

The fact that you are trying to ignore the behaviour that caused your mother to react while trying to paint your mother as a villain means you are on a path to setting your daughter up to go through life behaving as she pleases while you blame these around her for not reacting "gently" enough to her.

Nip this in the bud or in a few years you might actually be wishing you took your mother's advice and were sterner. You are the boss in your house. Not a toddler. You are the one who needs to show that when you say "No" or "stop" that the child knows without any doubt that that means "No" or "Stop". Otherwise you're just wasting your time.

We don’t always word things perfectly in heat of moment. Granny sees baby about to be hit by toddler (again) which is a danger like running in road.
Rather than picking mum up in her words not being spot on you need to look at why toddler was able to hit baby again.
A previous poster mentioned putting toddler in playpen. Other option is putting baby in a carrycot pram that toddler can’t reach in.
You are the parent. You need to be steps ahead. So stop toddler having access to the baby or if not possible be much more vigilant - why let toddler stroke baby unless you are right there and all attention on them when you know baby is likely to be hit.

Think the op has flounced as she got told she was wrong. Didn’t like it one bit.

At two years old removing the child followed up with a brisk firm NO will serve better than any thinking exercise far beyond the capability of a two year old

Her Mum is protecting the BABY'S boundaries.

I find it interesting that you only dropped what you were doing when your mother spoke to your Toddler not when the toddler started hitting the baby. You may need to look at your priorities.

You saw it as a threat, which is all that counts. You don't need your mother's validation in order to believe this. She's supposed to respect your boundaries even if she doesn't agree.

No.Any responsible adult would see their duty lies in protecting a defenceless baby, rather than maintaining the ineffectual mum's boundaries.

Hopefully the OP has by now got the message that her mother is a more effective parent than she is.

@HcbSS or 'kind hands darling' whilst the kid is beating the crap
Out of the baby