Male carer changing daughter’s nappy

[FirstTimeMummyHK]

AIBU to expect the nursery to tell me in advance that a man has now joined the nursery and will be changing my daughter’s nappy? We have been with this nursery for a while and there were only female carers there. The other day I went to pick up my daughter and there was a man sitting in there and I asked the nursery manager quietly
whether he changes my daughter and she said yes he would do. The nursery manager was very grumpy that I mentioned it. I was very nice and
polite to her. I felt that her reaction to my
question was unnecessarily grumpy. I am part of a religion where it’s quite a big deal to separate men and woman although we are not orthodox. I understand that nurseries wish to preserve equality etc and I am
a huge supporter of
men taking on caring roles. However AIBU to expect to be told in advance that a man would be changing my daughter / taking her to the toilet/ wiping her private area??

Sooty wasn't arguing that they'd been removed, though. Sooty was just saying 'not gonna do it.'

Thanks to those who managed to find some remaining quotes. Obviously I don't agree with them.

IKR? It's terrifying. I'm wondering if it's an age skewed thing. Older women generally have been round the block a few more times and are more cynical about masculine human nature. I know it took me years to truly comprehend just how different men are from women, and what the implications are both for women and society.

I also struggle with that type of 'women are just as bad' post. How can anyone know so little about the very basics of safeguarding, that they think women are the same risk as men regarding sexual assault? I try and convince myself that a man wrote the post you're responding to, as the only possible explanation.

I agree with the op. I wouldn't want an (unknown to me) man to change my baby's nappy. Just instinct, and I wouldn't feel it necessary to justify on religious - or any other - grounds. I'd just request that he doesn't change her.

I think it's a kind of wilful ignorance. Germaine Greer nailed it when she said most women have very little idea how much men hate them.

Going by the responses in the last thread about this only a week or so ago its because "all men are filthy predators" and you'd "have to question why a man wanted to work with young children".

If the person themselves, or someone advocating for them if they are unable to do it autonomously, refused consent to you washing them in an intimate area - and there were alternatives available - then you shouldn't be doing it. It doesn't matter what your job is, it does not give you any rights and you shouldn't be forceably washing them anyway.

If there were legitimately no alternatives and it became a question of them suffering harm or neglect then people much more qualified than you or me would have to make some tough decisions on their behalf and in their best interests. That is a very niche, very extreme situation and absolutely not reflective of what we're talking about here. We're talking about a child in a normal care situation whose advocate has said they do not consent to them being touched by a particular person. If other alternatives exist, which they do, then absolutely that should be respected.

My point still stands that expressed refusal of consent in intimate acts should never ever be overridden for the sake of equality or professionalism or feelings or cultural differences.

So ANY man who works with children is a paedophile?

Nobody said this.

How do we,as a society, provide male role models if we won't let children be educated by, cared for by men

Primary is a safer venue for this, as the children can speak and schools do understand safeguarding

No wonder so many young boys and men struggle with self esteem and mental health

Can do this without putting vulnerable children into danger

I was wondering if this was an age thing too. I'm 54. I think that young women just haven't had the life experiences that we have had. We are jaded for a reason.

Having said that, the inability to understand statistics and risk is quite surprising. The stats are in this thread, in black and white, and you still have posters claiming that women are just as bad as men.

It's quite dangerous to be so blinkered. Are these the women who would happily wander through the woods alone at midnight?

I agree with you OP. I wouldn't let a male stranger change my female baby's nappy.

My 78 year old mother is in a nursing home.

A male carer came in to help her get undressed and changed into her nighty.

She cried and refused. She didn't want a male carer to do that to her.

She asked for a female carer instead. I was proud of her.

Also, a lot of posters think that proper safeguarding of vulnerable children means that their daughters won’t be allowed to go into engineering?

…..wut?

I choose to get a female to do as many things for me as i can. I always request to see a female doctor.

I used to go to a male dentist as i originally felt that was safe, as onviously he is not seeing any of my sensitive bits,

but the last time i went to see my male dentist, he pressed his thigh heavily into me , while i was lying there, and started breathing heavily.

After that experience, I decided that I will only see a female dentist in future.

I wouldn't let a man change my female baby

Not in my case. 51 year old female that works with vulnerable kids, that usually need intimate care. I work with some fabulous male carers.
It’s the lack of awareness around safeguarding protocols when working with children that is driving the hysteria, not a lack of awareness about the risks that a minority of men pose to children.

I have read a lot of the thread and I completely understand the point about men being a much higher risk of CSA than women. And acknowledging that is not sexualising DC.

There was a bit that the OP said that did seem a bit like it was sexualising girls where she mentioned that one of her objections to her DD having her nappy changed by a man was that women in her culture remain 'untouched' before marriage. Apologies if I've got the wrong end of the stick on that.

But women need to speak for female babies and toddlers , as they don't have a choice.

If we women as adults often choose female caregivers, as we feel safer with them.

Shouldn't we also do that for babies/toddlers.

what about dads, what about in hospitals?

@CuttingMeOpenthenHealingMeFine

I was the one who talked about 'zero risk', but not because I don't know the offending stats. My position was that if safeguarding is stringent enough, the sex of the carer needn't matter (and the male carer is not stigmatised because the rules apply to everyone).

I still think stringent safeguarding is important, but the cases PP linked to clearly show safeguarding is undermined by gullibility, and the authorities are not banning male carers and are banging on about 'stigma'.

So, as ever, it's every woman (and child) for themselves.

Let me ask women on here this.

When you are much older and in a nursing home.

You might wear a nappy.

You might poo yourself.

Would you prefer a male carer or a female carer to come over and change your nappy, and wipe your bum and vagina?

will you be checking for lesbians working there?

Exactly. This is exactly it.

Would posters who think the OP is being unreasonable be happy to send their female children to a nursery that happened to have only male staff?
I'd be happy if a man worked at my childs nursery but I wouldn't be happy with them changing my child's nappy. Not because I think all men are paedophiles but because as others have said, the HUGE majority of paedophiles are men so, for me personally, it's just a case of risk assessing. Of course there is always the chance a woman would do the same but it's much, much less likely.
I was glad that I was lucky enough to send my child to nursery when he was already potty trained too.

This is an ineffably stupid thing to say. There are female paedophiles but the statistical risk is minuscule compared to that posed by men.Nearly 99pc of sexual crime is committed by men.

It really isn’t progressive to put children at risk. It’s the same with elderly and severely disabled women now being faced with male carers giving intimate care. Against their wishes. And no they’re very rarely ‘trained professionals’. Even if they were, that doesn’t impact risk of being an abuser in any way.

Should be prioritise kids safety? are you 100% certain what you're advocating for doesn't hurt 1 extra child? There are plenty of jobs men do that women don't. I don't believe we should pretend men and women are the same.

https://theconversation.com/a-survey-found-1-in-6-men-admit-sexual-feelings-for-children-so-is-paedophilia-increasing-218124

Well surely we should do it for all babies not just female?

I'll just leave this here...
https://theconversation.com/a-survey-found-1-in-6-men-admit-sexual-feelings-for-children-so-is-paedophilia-increasing-218124