FIL 'took' Our car!

[LostMyCar]

Evening all,

I'll start by saying that I've NC as I don't want this linked with my previous posts. This is a long one so I do apologise in advance...

Dh and I live abroad and will be visiting the UK for a couple of months next month. We've been looking for a cheap car to use for the month with the intention of reselling when we leave.

FIL has been kind enough to help with the search and the other night found a good deal. He went to view the car and arranged to buy it the next day. FIL had 1k of our money (from selling a car last year) and we transferred the remaining balance of the car over. We're excited that we've got a good deal and BIL mentions that he might want to buy the car off us when we leave. Great!

The next day DH gets a message from FIL to say that he and BIL are on the way to collect the car. All good. Then BIL sends a message to the group chat saying he's going to need to borrow our car whilst his car is getting an MOT. He doesn't ask, he assumes.

Bit of backstory - BIL (by Dh's own admission) is an immature man child who is often reckless and verbally abusive when he doesn't get his own way. He can't hold down a job and FIL is constantly bailing him out of messy situations. FIL is definitely his enabler.
DH says no I'm really sorry but I don't want you using my car. I'm not buying it for someone else to use. FIL gets angry at this as asks why BIL is good enough to pick the car up then? DH says he thought FIL would be driving our car and BIL would drive FIL's car back. Had he have known this wasn't the case, we could have asked someone else to collect the car.

Anyway, it's all blown into a huge argument. FIL phoned DH and did nothing but shout and scream. How can he not trust his brother? He's trying to get his life together! DH reiterated that he didn't want to upset BIL but he doesn't want him having access to our car. It ended with FIL telling DH to go fuck himself and to get someone to come and collect our car off his drive way that night. Whilst all this is going on, BIL sends a message to DH saying our car drives like a dream to further antagonise the situation.

I phone my parents and ask them (1.5 hour round trip) if they would mind collecting the car from FIL and driving it to MIL's house as she has space in her garage for it. My parents kindly agreed to do so. DH messages FIL to say that my parents will collect the car from him when he's ready. A few minutes later, FIL messages DH and says that the car isn't ours, it's his. He's keeping it and then he transferred our money back to us. So now we have no car.

We suspect FIL will end up giving BIL the car. We now also suspect that BIL was probably always going to use our car instead of his own (on its way out) secretly before we return to the UK.

AIBU to think FIL and BIL have both acted like twats? DH is really upset that his father has treated him this way and I'm furious at the way FIL has spoken to DH. I'm sure in time, DH will forgive them both which is fine but AIBU to want nothing more to do with them?

Thank you if you've made it this far 🙏

I don’t think you are unreasonable but I often don’t like other people using things I paid for and not all my relatives are perfect.
My question is this: why on earth you did any sort of financial arrangements with your FIL when you knew about existence of BIL and FIL regularly enabling him?
You should have asked your parents .
You got money back so let it go, don’t interfere much but don’t forget.

Yabu. Why couldn't he borrow the car? I really don't see the issue. He was ok to help collect it!

Pretty shitty tbh.

FIL had done you a massive favour and you can't lend the car out for couple of hours?

I think then asking your parents to do a long round trip to just put it in the garage is bonkers.

Next time, sort the car when you arrive, yourselves.

But if you refuse them a favour because you're not comfortable (for whatever reason - you've not actually said why), why on earth should they help you?
Would have thought you buying insurance even just for a couple of months would have been very expensive since if you don't live in the UK you won't be entitled to "no claims bonus". If FIL was insuring it for you that would be "fronting".

It's only cheaper because you have relatives running around to buy it for you, collect it for you, store it for you and then sell it for you at the end.

I think YWBU.

Hiring a car for a month will cost about £1500, and it will be new-ish and reliable. How is that comparable with buying a cheapo older car that might break down, plus insurance, tax, etc?

Hmm. I understand the annoyance - this was clearly FiL and BiL's plan when they bought it, and FiL should have been honest with you about that. There's an unhealthy dynamic in many families where parents make one careful child share with the destructive sibling and their stuff gets ruined. But I am surprised you didn't see this coming.

I feel like I've read this before.

Someone needs to collect the car be that BIL or FIL so all this catastrophising about what if someone crashed is a bit ott given it needed to be driven home in any case. Someone could crash into it parked on the drive!

Depends how cheap "cheap" is. It's £1k plus an unspecified amount. So it may be buy a £4k car, sell on for £4k after 2 months vs £1500 gone.

Seems like the grown ups have gone to bed. Of course you are not being unreasonable. They don't just get to decide that BIL uses your DH's car. Their reaction to your DH's refusal is telling. It doesn't matter that they helped your DH secure the car. It is/was his car, he gets to decide who uses it. If their help was conditional, they should have said from the start so that your husband could get someone else to help or agree to BIL using the car until you arrive.

You ‘just because he didn’t want someone else using his car’, but he had no real reason for that.

This is a car your DH has not yet set his eyes on and is planning on getting rid of after a couple of months’ use. It holds no sentimental value. He was just being difficult.

Exactly! What is the problem?

I don't know the exact details but from what I can gather, BIL's car is on its way out and would need to be in the garage for repairs. He'd be without his car for more than a few hours. In this time, he assumed he would be using our car.

Neither DH or I trust BIL with the car. Would he think twice about having a few drinks and driving home down the road? No. Would he think twice about having a Tinder date in the car? No. In fact, he'd probably boast about it. Yes, he really is that immature 🤢 So no we don't want him using the car.

FIl was doing us a favour because he offered and like I said, he would be upset if he wasn't the one to help us. We never expected or wanted BIL involved. He wasn't until he went with FIL to collect the car.

Anyway, what's done is done. We'll find a car when we're back.

I suspect you're not overreacting. My own brother has significant form for borrowing cars from me over the years, they always came back filthy inside and out, usually running on fumes (borrowed with a full tank) and if I'm really unlucky, he crashed a couple of them. My parents were no support at all for me when I was upset at the state of my car lent in good faith after having called me mean when I didn't want to lend it to him. So I get you.
I'd save yourself a lot of upset and just not bother with them any more. Family or not. Some people are just selfish shits but their parents just refuse to see that. It's awful when you're the other sibling

I feel like we’ve gone from “no relevant drip-feed” to “BIL is a drunk driver” quite quickly. That’s a very fair reason not to want him to use it, though.

Indeed! If he has form as an irresponsible driver then that changes the picture somewhat !

Were either of them insured to drive your new car?

Yup. We had BIL’s struggles holding down a job covered in the OP - feels like a propensity to drink and drive would have been a more relevant fact to cover!

Not to minimise but the having a tinder date in the car made me 😆

You’re not under any obligation to let anyone drive your car regardless so what if he went and collected it. He chose to do that because he would take the huff if you didn’t allow it, FIL made this conditional sod that for a game of soldiers

Yes thank you this is perfect

I wouldn't want someone I didn't trust driving a car I was going to be relying on using either. Out of interest on what insurance was BIL expecting to use the car? He (like most people who've only ever been UK resident ) probably has no comprehension of how few insurance options a non UK resident using a foreign licence has -.presumably you didn't put BIL on the insurance and he's likely to at most have 3rd party cover driving another car so you had a perfectly valid reason for refusing to allow him to drive the car.

Was he insured?

Seems a bit petty to say no after they've done the hard work.

I'll bet the car was insured in FIL's name with DH as an additional driver (presumably BIL too). Really tricky to find insurance when you're not resident in the country the car is insured in