DD and her uncle...AIBU to feel uncomfortable?

[maay]

My daughter is 12. In January her uncle started giving her guitar lessons as she really wanted to learn. He has been playing for years and sometimes teaches lessons, so when he offered to teach her for free, it was too good to turn down. The lessons are at our house. She's really been enjoying it. I still offer him money, but it's always a firm no.

He took her to see a band that they both like in March. His wife was also there. DD came back with loads of merch. I was thankful but told him he didn't need to do all of that! I felt like it was really cool they were bonding so well though. DH loved to see it as well.

He has bought her quite a few things now other than that merch. Like a necklace, posters, figurines, he even offered to buy her expensive trainers when she asked me for them in front of him. I said no to that one, because me and DH already decided she didn't need them. (girl has a lot.)

DH and I check her phone regularly. They text each other probably once or twice a week. It's brief and they just send each other memes and links to music they like. I haven't seen an actual conversation with them, so think I'm happy with that.

Yesterday he was at our house. We were all in the same room talking. DD went and sat on his lap and it made me feel uncomfortable. Only because she never sits on an adults lap anymore? I wasn't going to make a scene or anything, so I just made an excuse and asked her to come help me with something in a different room. When she went back into the room, she didn't sit on his lap again.

The same day, he dropped into conversation about how "Asian and half Asian girls are the most beautiful" he looked at DD and she giggled. DD is half Asian. I'm starting to feel a bit uncomfortable with it all. But I'm not sure if I'm being unreasonable? I don't want to break an innocent bond, but I feel like I missed some red flags and I'm now seeing them? DH says he just loves his niece and he doesn't think we have to worry.

I take back my previous post, as the OP updated while I was typing this. My sincerest apologies.

Do not ignore your gut here. People who ignore that little nagging feeling often end up heavily regretting it.

Do not ignore your gut here. People who ignore that little nagging feeling often end up heavily regretting it.

That's really scary, OP. I'm sorry that this has happened to your DP and glad you know so you can keep him very very far away from her forever.

Echoing others to ring NSPCC especially on account he teaches other children. So sorry this has happened to your little girl OP. I think I'd be murderous.

You're an absolute amazing Mum to have dealt with this so quickly before it escalated and spotting the signs. So many would give a family member the benefit of the doubt, he was grooming you too by getting her to sit on his knee in front of you (and using flirtacious language). Try to make you both accept it as normal, little steps to break down everyones boundaries. Fucking monster. Xx

So glad that you were able to have a chat with DD and yes it does sound like a grooming situation 😟 how grim to find this out about your stepbrother. I would be putting a stop to guitar lessons and going out with the band and also saying no to any more gifts. Make sure he knows you're onto him. I agree with other PP that it might be good to talk to NSPCC about what to do next. What a horrible shock for you 😢 I know statistically children are most at risk from someone in their family but you never expect it in your own family do you. I hope your DD is ok 💐

You need to inform the police. This is very unlikely to lead to a prosecution, but it will be officially noted. When people apply for a DBS then noted intelligence is taken into account as well as convictions.
You also need to report this to protect your family. If at a later stage DD tells someone else about this obvious grooming and that person reports it to SS, SS may think you are trying to protect your brother if you did not report it. They need to know that you have done everything you can to protect your DD.

@maay I'm horrified at this.
My ex husband was a guitar teacher and also taught in schools- he NEVER would have done anything like this.

He did teach young people {Children} as well as adults, and their parents were welcome to wait in the room or next door if necessary.

One has to be absolutely unimpeachable when teaching any age students, but especially vulnerable ones.

The fact he is buying her gifts and a necklace was alarming- but the knee sitting thing- absolutely NOT ON.

You do indeed have instincts for a reason.

OP some people are talking about being careful how you handle this so other family members do not blame you.
One thing though you need to understand is that some people defend family members no matter what. They may simply refuse to believe that someone they love may be guilty of grooming a child. Or they want to minimise what has happened so they do not have to emotionally deal with the truth. And this can happen no matter how carefully you approach this.
It happens in families where a family member has been sent to prison for raping a child family member. There are still people who will defend that rapist family member and call the child a liar.
I say this as I really hope all the family support you and your DD. But if some family members do not, please understand that this can happen no matter what you do and is sadly not uncommon. But obviously we have to put our children first.
Lastly when you have the necessary emotional space, you may want to seek specialist counselling for yourself. He is your brother and you will have a lot of complex feelings that it might be helpful to talk about with someone who understands these types of situations.

Oh my goodness, @maay
I hadn't read this when I replied a few minutes ago.

My Ex husband {We still get on} is the guitar teacher {DBS checked - has taught all ages of students- and a guitar teacher NEVER ever, a million times never gets a student to sit on their knee...I feel physically sick thinking of it.

There is no need to physically touch a student's hands, either!

I'm sorry, but this is extremely worrying.

How awful for your daughter.

She's twelve...this has grim implications.

Awful for you, too.

Tragically this is very true.

My ex husband is a professional guitar teacher {DBS and works in schools too}
He has never ever had a student sit on his knee- the very thought is just so ghastly and inappropriate.

Groomers are very brazen and bold. This seems like a classic groomer in action.

While I'm obviously not glad about what's happening here, I am so glad you've broached this OP and are taking control of the situation. I was groomed as a child and what rang alarm bells for me was all the stuff he's been buying her. Now you've found out about him telling her to sit on his lap to teach her the guitar it's pretty clear this is not normal or right, so well done for following your instincts.

I find the voting interesting. I voted yanbu without hesitation but I thought you were going to get your ass handed to you for seeing paedophiles behind every bush. Really heartening to see that nearly everyone could see this for what it is. So sorry you and your family are having to cope with it all.

Why not ask her why she sat on his lap and explain it made you feel uncomfortable

Apologies Op just read your final update. So sorry

Yes, I audibly gasped when I read that.

op, I don’t want to alarm you but when I was a very little girl a family friend abused me while I was on his lap. He did it right in front of everyone and no one suspected a thing. You are her mum. Instinctive alarm bells are ringing for a reason.

Hope you are ok as that's a lot to process - whatever else has gone on with him and your daughter and the fact it is your brother who you trusted. Imagine your husband is also not in a good place right now. I hope you can get professional support too in order to work through this in the way that is best for you, your daughter and your husband.

I have just read all your updates, op. So sorry but so glad that you caught it before anything happened. So glad that people know so much more about this and what to look for than they did when I was a child.

I'm usually one of the the first to say nah don't think so but I'm with you here OP.
Your gut is giving you an uneasy feeling, go with it.
Could be innocent but could also not be.
The buying fancy presents, the sitting on knee, the saying that she's beautiful?
At 12 you're still a kid, even if she is being all innocent sitting on his knee he's being inappropriate.
I'd be wary too.

I'm so sorry - but it's brilliant that you've been able to discuss it.

Your instincts were right.

Please contact the police. He may be doing this to other children. You could do a Sarah's Law enquiry?

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/find-out-if-a-person-has-a-record-for-child-sexual-offences

It may be best not to ask her anything more before you've taken their advice on how to proceed.

And you have another difficult conversation to do - to speak with his partner, who's thinking of having children with him, and tell her exactly what you've learned so far.

That will probably split the family. Some will not believe it.

But the children are more important.

He shouldn’t be around anyone’s DC, him teaching guitar is very worrying. He needs to be reported for the grooming behaviour: the comment about why she should sit on his lap in particular.

It’s good you picked up on this and your DD felt able to be open with you when you raised it, so sorry for this much be shattering for you.

I'm so sorry OP this is horrific.

This really stood out for me:

"He didn't buy her stuff in between though and he wouldn't have randomly invited her out (the band.) He's also been spending more time here in general. Offering to do nice things for me and DH to help us out. That wouldn't have happened before, unless there was a rare specific reason"

This is exactly what they do. Groom the whole family.

Sick bastard.
Cut contact immediately.

even if it is all innocent in your brother's mind, it is not appropriate

In what world does a grown man "innocently" coerce a 12 year old to sit on his lap unnecessarily, by pretending it'll make the child "the best guitar player in the world"? It's a clearly calculated way to initiate physical contact. I.e grooming.

OP at age 32 it's unlikely this is his first time doing this. There may be other children out there in dire need of support. Please get professional advice on this.

Well done OP, you’ve handled everything very well. It must be so painful for you. Take your time, you don’t need to rush anything and you clearly have a great relationship with your daughter. I wonder was she subconsciously highlighting the situation by sitting on his lap on front of you? Btw it doesn’t matter what he says, he was grooming her

Op, I think if your instinct are trying to tell
you something here.