Partner wants a baby - am I not compromising?

[Daisyshine90]

My partner (39 this year) wants a baby but I’m still hesitant (34 this year). He brought up trying for a baby about a year in. I said I wasn’t ready as we weren’t even living together yet. He said some things:

“He’s worried for me that I’ll miss my chance” - surely that’s an emotion I should own?
“He’s worried I’ll never be ready” - I said I wanted children just not right then.
“We both met older - he never wanted to be an old dad” - he worked abroad until he was 35 developing his career. (I have a good career too but he is significantly on more than me.)
Some family might not be around next year” - despite no one being ill at the time he said that.

It dawned on me then that he’s desperate to start a family and it’s felt like a pressure ever since. Are these usual things to discuss?

He has offered his own compromises l:
Right at the start of the dating period he was adamant against marriage. It’s been a regular argument since but I started to accept that it wasn’t going to happen. He broke up with his previous partner because she wanted marriage and children and he didn’t/wasn’t ready at the time for kids. Nearly 2 years in, he said he has been thinking about it and now wants to marry me because he cares for me, knows how important it is to me and is willing to compromise. I asked if he could give me a timeline and he said 3 - 4 years but he wants children first. I responded suspiciously and it ended up in another argument. This was because it was on the back of an argument. Was I being unfair in responding that way?

We still don’t live together but I’ll be moving in soon. He has never seen this as a problem though and thinks it’ll work if I get pregnant now and eventually move in. This just seems absurd to me. Now one of his family members is ill with cancer and I’m worried that’s going to be another pressure.

The pressure is hitting hard. I feel so overwhelmed by it that I can’t even think straight about how I feel because I’m thinking about how he feels. I’ve always wanted a family but the thought of being pregnant makes me incredibly anxious. I wanted it to be a decision together, and the pressure just makes me feel as though it’s not my decision.

This is all combined with me moving into a house he is building. Originally he didn’t want me to have any input (just bills) but then after a while we agreed it’d work emotionally if I put some investment in. But now l, after reading up on it, I don’t feel it’s a good idea (not being married) but he’s certain he wants me to put 50% in. The plan is also for his mother to move in the small build next to it (inevitably she will be helping with ‘childcare’). This was his plan really early on so it has never been something we’ve discussed together. I get on with his mum very well but I just feel decisions are out of my control and I’m just fitting into his jigsaw.

I’ve been diagnosed recently with PTSD due tone sexual trauma and have experienced an abusive relationship in the past. I know these impact how I approach relationships and trusting partners. I love him and we have some wonderful times together. Generally we get on really well. It’s just the pressure of the next big steps.

I don’t have many friends who have families yet, so I am surrounded by single friends. I haven’t really been in a position of a serious relationship/living with someone because of my past. This is all new to me and I feel very naive. Does anyone have any advice? Am I being unreasonable?

@Daisyshine90

We still don’t live together but I’ll be moving in soon. He has never seen this as a problem though and thinks it’ll work if I get pregnant now and eventually move in. This just seems absurd to me. Now one of his family members is ill with cancer and I’m worried that’s going to be another pressure.

Please don't move in with this man who is making plans for his own life, and you are the convenient missing part of the "jigsaw" you mention. There seems little real love and desire for you as a person in your own right within these plans he's making.

• do you rent, or own your own property?

The plan is also for his mother to move in the small build next to it (inevitably she will be helping with ‘childcare’). This was his plan really early on so it has never been something we’ve discussed together. I get on with his mum very well but I just feel decisions are out of my control and I’m just fitting into his jigsaw.

The plan to move his mother in a home next door, without discussing it with you, just reinforces that the two of you are not mutual partners because he's not consulted you.

• How do you get on with her?
• How much contact, given her very close planned proximity, will you have with her, before you gave a child with him?
• How much involvement will she have with you and your child?
• Is she the person who has become ill with cancer?
• Are you prepared to be providing care for her as she gets older and/or frail whilst he gets on with developing his career?

Also, is his idea of you becoming pregnant now to check that you can become pregnant and have children? Otherwise why wait for a further 3-4 year to marry, if at all?

You don't have to answer these questions here, but maybe do think about your reactions to the possible answers before you disrupt your life by moving in with him. 🌹

If you want to see a worst case scenario about how it could go in 20 years time. Read this thread. Deceit and gaslighting all through. AIBU to be upset a friend has fallen for my husband | Mumsnet
Maybe it won't happen like this but it did for this lady.

Don't do it. He's been loud and clear that he doesn't actually want to be tied/committed to you in any financial/legal way (house, marriage).

What he wants is someone to have a baby for him. (And potentially become a carer for his Mum in the medium-long term)

I wouldn't be stunned if he refused to marry you post-birth or even broke up with you. Then worse case, you'd be fighting for custody with someone with significantly more resources than you.

It's madness to even consider having a baby with someone who you've never lived with AND whose mum is going to be living with them!

Lots of jumping to conclusions and pessimism here... Many on Mumsnet are completely against children before marriage. Their choice but plenty of people happily don't marry or do it after babies.

Do you really love and trust each other and enjoy life as a couple? Or do you have niggling doubts about him in general?

Jesus. He wants it all his way doesn't he? And what do you want? Listen to your gut, trust it. Don't let anyone tell you your past experiences are clouding your judgement.

Soooo this man wants you to:

• pay for half his house
• not give you a say in fundamental decisions on design of house or even who lives in it / a part of it
• have his children
• move in
• HAVE HIS CHILDREN

and for that he will:

• possibly marry you in a few years. Maybe

This man does not deserve you.

Omg no. Don't do it. Youre not ready for a baby, him dancing a carrot of a maybe wedding isn't good enough and you don't know if he picks up after himself let alone if he'd be helpful when you're pregnant. A baby shouldn't live on a building site. This is all a big mess.

The only thing missing from this list is that clearly after having provided him with children and sacrificed your career, you will then be expected to care for his Mum in her old age. His plans involve using you and nothing more. He will always come up with an excuse as to why marriage isn't possible at the moment. He won't marry you as you are then entitled to share of house and pension etc. He loves himself far more than he cares for you.

There are many threads on here from women who have been dumped by their DPs for a younger version who then find they have to move out of the family home as they don't own any of it despite spending their money on it over the years. They end up having to take the DC with them and try to return to work, possibly having not worked for a number of years or having not progressed in their careers as much as they could have. They then struggle to raise DC alone while ExDP continues the same lifestyle with an OW. Please don't be one of them.

Have a think. What do you want? Marriage is always best before children as it provides them and you with protection. Do you want to be a carer for his mum? What about your own family? Do you want to try to buy your own place so you can have some financial security in the future? Can you cope financially on your own if things don't work out?

My advice: don't ever let him get you pregnant, don't ever stop working full-time if you aren't married and make some plans and act on them for your financial security for the future. Please don't move in with him, he seems so selfish.

No no no. Doesn't sound like you are both at the right stage in your relationship to bring children into this world.

I'll give my example of me and my DH, he's 4 yrs older than me and said he said he definitely wanted kids and I was open to in the future, but not then. We moved in together, got engaged and I said I did want kids but not outside of marriage (ethically and legally - my personal choice). He didn't care if we got pregnant while engaged but that was a big no from me. We are now married and I'm pregnant and couldn't be happier. I'm glad I stuck with my boundaries. Find your voice and be clear on what are non-negotiables for you!

I wish I posted on MN before I got married.

Listen to the advice

More red flags than a communist rally.

Definitely don’t move in with him.

Especially don’t have kids with him without the security of marriage.

WTF! I can guarantee if you have the baby first he will never ever marry you.
Neither should you contribute to anything before you are married so a big fat no to both.
There are so many red flags here I don't know where to start,

Yes, you will be expected to care for his DMum.

You have PTSD and have a history of abusive relationships. Take care of yourself now, put yourself first and make sure you get what you need. This twat isn't going to give you anything except a load of work, a lot of uncertainty, very few rights and a load of dependants that he probably won't lift a finger to help with.

For me, I would want an engagement ring before moving in.
Meaning that you are engaged to be married.

If the living together went superbly, I would then be open to trying for a baby after the wedding.

Living together might prompt you to split up.
Your relationship needs to be more secure before you introduce a baby but I agree with your partner that it is time to play seriously. If you break up you are not leaving yourself much time to find a new partner before your biological clock ticks loudly.
Have you considered freezing your eggs?

There's a lot going on here so I'll try and look at them separately.

First of all, if you aren't ready to have a baby yet (or think you might actually never want to have a baby) then don't be pressured into it. I do think you need to be honest with your boyfriend about that - after all, whenever women on Mumsnet are in their 30s and worrying that their partner says he isn't ready for a baby, the advice is to leave them. If you aren't ready for a baby and don't know if or when you will be, then I think you need to be extremely clear with them about that - for your own sake, but also in the interests of fairness to him. Awful though it sounds, if he is desperate to be a father, you shouldn't give him false hope that it's going to happen with you any time soon, and if that's a deal breaker for him, it would be OK for him to walk away from the relationship (just like it would be OK for a woman to walk away from a man who didn't want a child)).

However, even setting aside the pressure to have a baby, I personally would be backing away from this man. He is trying to push you into investing your money into a future that he has decided for you. He wants you to help him fund the building of a house that he wants and where his mother is going to live next door to provide childcare for a baby you don't necessarily want to have i in the first place. This is all about him controlling the trajectory of your relationship - and your life - while refusing to make the basic commitment of marriage to you. That is because being married is the one thing that would give you some rights to the property he wants you to invest your money in.

Do you have any family yourself? Why he should he unilaterally decide that his mum, rather than anyone, would provide childcare and live in adjoining property?

Basically, he wants to trap you in a situation where you can't escape from him - he wants you to be in a situation where you've had his baby, paused your career, put all your money into a property you have no rights to, and eventually he'll want you to look after his mother when she needs a carer. And it will be incredibly hard for you to leave him because a) you'll have a child together and b) he'll have all your money tied up in a house you don't have any right to. It's chillingly controlling on his part.

Thank you everyone. I’ll have a read through all of your replies (I am grateful for this community and for the overwhelming responses).

Have you posted about his house before? Sounds very familiar and it was a fucking giant red flag then, before baby talk!

At 34 you're not young to have a baby, however the only right time to have a baby is when you are ready and you really want one.

In your shoes I'd be saying, we'll get married, I'll go on the deeds as joint owner of the new property (and invest accordingly), then we'll have a baby. I'll return to work when I feel the time is right, and if I decide I don't want your mother to do childcare, then she won't. What do you think he'd say to that?

Just the fact of him lining up his mother, next door for childcare would make me run away.

It's perfectly fine to have a baby with someone without being married, if that someone is the right person and if you BOTH agree that this works for BOTH of you and will not leave one partner at a significant disadvantage.

In the circumstances that the OP describes, she will absolutely be significantly disadvantaged if she has a baby with him before getting married because:

• He is much wealthier than her and therefore holds the financial power in the relationship
• He is asking her to invest her money in a property he is building for himself (and his mother), but it's unlikely she'll have much, if any, right to a share of that property if they separate
• His career path will continue uninterrupted and his earning power will be unaffected by the birth of a child. She, by contrast, will likely have to halt her career for maternity leave

These are purely the practical and financial considerations, which taken entirely in isolation are already a more than good enough reason for the OP not to have a baby with this man without getting married. He has everything to gain. She has everything to lose. It's that simple.

However, there are also some exacerbating factors around the whole dynamic of the relationship which are incredibly worrying.

• He is putting pressure on her (the person who actually has to go through the pregnancy and birth, and whose career will be affected) to have a baby even though she isn't ready. He has been putting this pressure on her from day one. That is a huge red flag. The OP literally says that she feels incredibly anxious and helpless at the thought of being pregnant because her decision-making power has been taken away for her.
• He is asking her to contribute 50% of the cost of building a house not just for him, but also for his mother, without her having any say in this plan.
• Nothing - NOTHING - in his plans for the future are actually about the OP and what she wants. They are ALL about him and what he wants - his house, his desire for a baby, his mother. She has asked for one thing, which amounts to a degree of legal and financial security, and he isn't willing to give that to her before she gives him a large sum of money and a baby.

It's not only naive but also genuinely irresponsible to suggest that it will be fine because plenty of people have babies before they get married and it all works out. Of course they do, and of course for loads of people it's a perfectly good choice, but it would absolutely NOT be a good choice in the circumstances outlined by the OP.

This isn't pessimistic or jumping to conclusions. It's hard facts.

He wants a surrogate who can pay his mortgage, not a wife.

Why would you try for a baby before moving in together?

I’m not judging, just genuinely interested.

Being in a relationship with someone you live with is a lot different to being in one with someone you don’t live with and most people only realise they’re not compatible when they start living together.

Most people would make sure the relationship is solid before trying for a baby and you can’t know that without living together first.

I am glad it worked out for you.

The thing is, you are on a clock and why he can push you into decisions you dont want to make.

He wants you to move in because it's harder to leave. suddenly youre 38 and think fuck I've left it too late to find a new man to have a baby with so it better be him. Marriage issue can happen after

Then he has no impetus to marry you and you have no exit strategy if things go wrong.

OP, he's lying to you now. An honest man will never ask you to get pregnant before marriage and will never ask you to contribute to his house if legally you have no right to that house.

He's gaslighting you now, by making you believe that if you won't have a child with him ASAP you'll never have it. That is not true. You can always have a child on your own if that will be your own decision and by that time you won't find the right man for yourself. Better no dad than an abusive one.

I'm sorry to hear you've been through so much in your past. Please look after yourself, you deserve to be happy.

Be careful with him now, he's capable of leaving you pregnant on purpose. Listen to your anxiety and gut which is telling you that you don’t want to have kids with this man. Get more trauma counselling or DV counselling, because it seems you're again in the same situation in your relationship.

It's not your fault, but many victims of DV end up over and over in the same relationships. I think more counselling around it will help you with your next relationship. Start by writing every day everything what he's telling you and it doesn't make sense to you. It will help you understand your relationship with him. I'm sure there's plenty of more red flags in your relationship.

I think he's approaching 40 and he wants a family and his mother near him to provide childcare that he might not be too bothered about doing and you're the baby machine that he needs.
It's his house. He decides to move his mum next door and you just have to fit in wherever, just as long as he has a child.
I'd be thinking very long and hard about this if I were you!

RUN
RUN
RUN

It's all about him and what he wants.

If you don't want children, don't have them. And never have children with a man you're not married to or he'll fuck you over.

Get a decent bloke who's prepared to consider your feelings.