To think my child is going to be the child everyone else avoids?

[beinghonestherenow]

And I can see why, although he’s only 3. I’m hoping to god he changes but it’s not looking hopeful.

He is really … unpleasant. I never hear him laugh unless it’s this horrible cackle (which goes right through me tbh) when he’s doing something he’s not supposed to.

The more annoyed or stern someone is with him the more he finds it funny.

He is aggressive and bites kicks and pushes, snatches toys, literally the second another child shows an interest in a toy he grabs it. I keep thinking this is getting better but then we’re back to square one.

I am worried about the impact it’s having on my marriage (I’m close to leaving tbh as I can’t cope) and our other child.

Just to add DD is very high functioning / top set for everything in school. They say she is always helpful and eager to please. We would have had absolutely no chance of getting an assessment if we hadn't gone private.

I don’t have the funds for that at the moment @coolcoolcoolcool . Perhaps in the future.

I have just looked at PDA which seems to be an intense need for control. I would not say that really describes DS. It is hard to say at this age which I guess is why diagnosis are only done on quite obvious cases (for want of a better word.)

Private assessments do seem a bit problematic in themselves though. I’m not sure it is ND here.

DS has a temper certainly and he isn’t automatically eager to please as some compliant children are. He therefore isn’t bothered - outwardly anyway - by my disapproval, disappointment or anger and in fact seems to find them funny. He isn’t a talker in the sense that he will avoid or try to wriggle away from difficult conversations. He’s a tricky character to be sure.

I say it loads but I found the incredible years programme so helpful. You can get the book or audiobook but me and dh did the course with other parents.
We have 3 adhd children. The oldest nearly broke us at age 3, destroyed everything, climbed everything, lashed out. The HV was like well he has adhd by looks of him but we can't diagnose him until 6.
We put gates everywhere in the house. Baby locks on all cupboards. Brought cupboard for his room so we could lock them when not is use so he didn't rip books apart etc.

He's not high functioning at all. Socially quite the opposite. Isn't that the point of your post? You don't need labels but you do not a new approach to parenting. You've had some good suggestions of new reading material. I'd also approach a local children's charity for some input.

OP have you posted about this issue fairly recently, within past 2 to 3 months?

If not, then you’re certainly not alone.

Could there be some lingering PND that he’s picking up on?

Is there nothing he likes, laughs at, smiles in response to?

If there doesn't seem to be, try assuming typical rewards are appealing but that for whatever reason he doesn't display a reaction much.

So try rewards like sweets, tv time, things that have sensory appeal like special bubble bath or colourful bath bombs, or trips to rewarding locations like swimming/trampoline parks.

Impose consequences like time outs, removing a toy if throwing it etc, very visible "3 strike" systems - we used to hae 3 lego men on top of the telly, 1 man meant a 10 min tv episode. Bad behaviour meant a man got swept off the telly.

Often 3 year olds don't show a reaction clearly but are learning from the reward or response clearly.

I would say op - 3 year olds can be awful. Mine was a bit - hugely self centred/selfish. Showed zero empathy.

He's now a mature, kind, sociable and popular boy. Hang in there.

Is the other child younger? Could he be jealous or seeking attention to compete with your other child? Have you tried play dates outdoors with no toys involved? Sorry, not sure what to suggest, have you expressed your concerns to nursery key person?

The point is he is high functioning in terms of seeking any sort of diagnosis. I don’t wish to sound like an arse here but there’s definitely a MN view that assumes you make a GP appointment and in a matter of weeks or at most months you have all this lovely support for your child. The reality is so different. It would probably take weeks just to get an appointment and then the likely question would be about nursery and what do they think, offered a parenting course and that’s that.

It also means in the future that if you DO need to pursue a diagnosis you look like you have an agenda.

@Ioverslept (I thought you were Lover Slept!) I do think jealousy is a huge problem. Very difficult to address though.

He therefore isn’t bothered - outwardly anyway - by my disapproval, disappointment or anger and in fact seems to find them funny

Aah no. I think you are misreading his response here.

He doesnt like the disapproval etc. He us 3 so does not know how to react, is trying to make the negative response go away, so is trying to smile/laugh and make it better.

I had exactly this issue with DS. I felt no consequence was "sinking in" because he didnt seem upset

That’s helpful. Thank you.

What do you do though when they laugh? It makes me angry which is all wrong I know.

How old is your other DC?

Any big life events recently?

You say it's only been this bad since February, so a few months? It might be worth looking at what could have triggered things.

It could well yet be a phase as well. I know a few months must feel endless in the current situation but he hasn't always been this way?

Hmm, I’m pretty confident that parents of neurodivergent DC usually have experience of the assessment and diagnostic process, and aren’t making random assumptions.

If you want to carry on making things up as you go along, and labelling your DC as “having a temper” or being “a tricky character” and declaring that he is the sort of kids that others will avoid… then crack on.

If you really want help then you need to take professional advice. “The explosive child” isn’t going to cut it, based on the situation you describe.

@Crunchymum a bit of both I’d say.

So he’s always had a tendency to lash out a bit. But obviously that’s normal in younger children - I don’t mean we just smile indulgently but it is normal and there was a bit of biting at nursery, some shoving at groups, those sorts of things.

It seemed to stop for a while then it starts again and it does worry me as I feel we’re a bit out of the age where it could be reasonably tolerated. I’m very lucky as every time we’ve had an incident other parents have been lovely about it. He bit a child last week and a couple of months ago got a child in a headlock at a soft play place

But then other times he’s fine.

@FishCoral what professional advice? Even for children with a diagnosis it’s hardly the case that numerous people are supporting the child and parents and DS realistically isn’t going to be diagnosed with anything if at all for a long time.

Op, have you read into dysregulation? I’m just wondering about what you are describing. You say your little guy wriggles away and the laughing thing struck a cord with me as my little girl is similar. She is four. She is ok at home but in nursery she is really hard work for them. I’m sure someone better versed in it will come along, but it could be worth reading about if you haven’t already. Her nursery does not think she is nd but they haven’t fully ruled it out either. She personally struggles with transitions in nursery and that sets off the behaviour you describe.

This is the second or third thread about how much you dislike your child. You need some help.

I don't think anyone can or should try to diagnose a 3 year old based on a few paragraphs about his behaviour.

Calmer, Happier, Easier Boys was a life changing book for us when my son was 3 OP. Give it a try if you can. It's really not uncommon to love your child but not like them much at times, especially during those really challenging years. I think it really helps when they start school and learn how to behave there, and better yet if/when they join sports clubs and learn all about how to lose, how to be a good member of a team and it just gets some of their aggression out in a productive way.

’Get help’

This is what you don’t seem to understand (apart from the fact I don’t dislike my child. I am very worried that he will think I do, and that this will start a bit of a tornado of behaviour where it just keeps increasing in ever frantic and destructive spirals. I do dislike a lot of the behaviour but I am genuinely trying to understand.)

There is no ‘help.’ This isn’t like threadworms (ew) or athletes foot where you go to the pharmacy. This is a complex issue. I’m largely alone with it and I’m trying to work through it.

Thanks @Damnyourheadshoulderskneesandtoes . I’ll order that book too. He has started sports so I hope that helps.

Can I recommend How to Talk So Small People Will Listen? Absolute game changer for me. It's available as an audiobook if you don't have time to read.

Sorry but no - I didn’t get on with it AT ALL and was / am lost as to why it’s always pushed on here!

Who have you asked for help so far?

I’m not asking about other families and the experiences that you believe they have had or been told about by them…

I am asking about you and your DS. Who have you approached and asked for help and advice from, regarding your 3 year old child who you say is unpleasant because of his behaviour.

What professionals have you approached and how did they respond?

None, and I’m not going to for reasons explained above.

You sound like you’re interviewing me under caution, by the way.

Hello @beinghonestherenow In your opening post you said that you were considering leaving your marriage. The one person you haven't mentioned in any of this is your partner. How does your little boy behave around them? Does he have a "favourite"? How does your partner respond when your DS is snatching, biting or misbehaving?

You also mentioned that there is another child. Are they younger than DS and are you on mat leave at the moment? Have you spoken to a health visitor or anyone at your GP's surgery about how you are feeling?