Parents moaning their pensions are not enough!!

[Bluesky91]

My parents own a large 3 bed semi. They extended it to convert to a huge 5bed house. After I moved out, my brother stayed back. He is not a high earner (teacher). He got married a few years later. His wife works for minimum wage. On their salaries, they will struggle to live on their own - they will have nothing left to save/spend on lifestyle. They have a 4yr old child. They all live with my parents.

Earlier this evening, I was visiting my parents. My mom was out with her exercise group. Brother, SIL and DN went out for dinner. My dad ticked off all of a sudden saying they have no money by 20th of every month and it’s very unfair on pensioners. wtf. My parents have TWO pensions. Just that they chose to pay everything for the house, bills, food, cleaner, car, childcare, DNs activities, etc. DB/SIL spend their income on lifestyle and investments. it’s not NHS/ Govt’s problem. My dad got so mad a me for saying this, he shouted at me saying “do you want us to kick your brother out? How will he live?”

Within means? Like everyone else?

AIBU ?

Also, not excusing your Dad losing his cool with you @Bluesky91 but in my country, retirees on a state pension either the means tested one or the contributory one, if they live with a PAYE earner they would lose some benefits like getting their tv licence paid for, getting fuel allowance in winter.... there may be other things too but I can't think. So if your brother isn't paying rent, they're losing out financially twice.

Sometimes there is no option but to have professional care, whether that's at home or in a nursing home. It's easy to say "the family will do the caring" but if it involves hoists, incontinence, intubation, then that is not remotely realistic.

You are a lovely little family. On the other hand your brother and your SIL are mumpers. They're milking the money tree successfully.

I can't see a solution to be honest. I know two grannies up here in Wales who every week catch a train to Euston, then the underground to spend two days looking after grandchildren to save money on nursery, after school club runs. They even use grandparents as babysitters while they have holidays to Europe and Africa. To get some downtime, recapture the romance.

OP, you’re actually in a really good position here with yours and your DH’a parents.

You are free to live your lives as you wish with no interference from either set of parents. As you haven’t benefitted from gifts/supported living etc you have no obligation to do any care when parents are older and might need the help. In fact, you would be doing your own siblings a disservice if you didn’t allow them the full opportunity to return the kindness they have received all these years from parents.

You and DH crack on and enjoy your independence.

As for DF, next time he moans ask him why he thinks pensions for 2 adults should support a family of 5. Then leave it there.

It will indeed. My friends husband demanded his mother move in with them, my friend discovered that she was doubly incontinent. Her husband went abroad for a month. My friends back went lifting granny, they both were hospitalised. Friend phoned husband who was very annoyed to be called back. He did one day of care before finding granny a home. By the time my friend was discharged, granny was gone.

Not sure what anyone can say or do OP. Deeply entrenched culturally misogynistic practices at play here. I know it’s hard but you’ve just got to distance yourself from it, or come to terms with it.

Thanks all for your support. I don’t know why I created this thread, but as some of you said, it’s best I say something and step away.

I will speak to DB tomorrow.

I think it's due to having a traditional mindset in which men are important and women are low status people. Probably at least partly unconscious but what it means is that everything you do is discounted and marked down, everything he does is elevated.
You (as a low status female person) are destined for a menial and impoverished life whereas he should be helped to fulfill his destiny of wealth and success.

This played out with my (ex) in-laws.

They had two boys and a girl,

They bought the daughter a house.

She had kids and chose to home educate them and at one point her kids were over at the parents every single day for about 5 years.

The dad got fed up with being used for childcare and started being out so the mum took the brunt of it all. Only Covid stopped that.

Neither of the boys were given any money or childcare beyond the odd weekend or two. They are massively resentful and the relationship with their parents has really suffered.

The parents are now elderly and neither of the boys (or their wives) will be looking after them. The daughter probably won't either as she's just had another baby and is busy trying to beat the British record for most number of kids in one family.

I think the parents regret the unfairness but it's hard to tell.

You certainly can't do anything about it - I was married to one of the boys (now divorced) and he tried multiple times to suggest both to them and to her that they were being used/she should go easy on her parents and it just caused rows.

My only suggestion is to make clear that you will not be doing any caring as they have been so unfair.

From what you've written I would not speak to your DB. In my experience it will just all kick off as he will want to protect his cushy life and will use it as an opportunity to throw you under the bus. He will tell your parents and you will the bad guy, sticking your nose in etc.

He knows he's golden child and will do anything for to protect it. You say he will get the house and pensions - says it all that they all think this is acceptable.

I understand this is cultural but these things have to stop somewhere. I would be telling my father that I don't want to discuss it and to not offload onto you - he needs to speak directly to your DB and SIL.

I would however be making it very clear that I wouldn't be doing caring in the future.

If you're certain that your brother and SIL aren't paying their way, and have no intention of moving out, then it must be so frustrating to watch it all play out, but I'm not sure there's a whole lot you can do.

Your parents should have put their foot down a long time ago and insisted that your brother pay his way. Maybe they just assumed that he'd fly the nest in time, but he never did, and they feel that they can't turn around now and start asking for money. Maybe your father is too embarrassed to admit to your brother that his circumstances have changed (e.g. going from a high salary to a pension) and that they're struggling. Maybe they think it's small sacrifice to make (being skint) in order to have their family at home and have constant access to their grandchild. It's probably easier to blame the government for their woes than to admit that their own flesh and blood is taking advantage of them financially.

If your parents are unwilling to make your brother homeless now, and he doesn't move out in the future, they might well leave the house to him and his wife in their will. Although the house may need to be sold to pay for the care of one of your parents. In Ireland we have the Fair Deal scheme. I'm not sure how it works in the UK. If that happens, your brother and his wife might have no option but to move out so that the house is sold. But their investments might provide them with a property at that stage.

I don’t know why but I think this is really common.

in terms of your family.

1. Take a big step back
2. keep responses to any of this nonsense 💯 bland “that sounds hard/difficult” etc

I've a polish friend. Their parents thought the son was the golden boy. Their daughters worthless. He never worked, took drugs, the daughters made good lives, worked hard, had gorgeous children.

Golden boy never married, no-one would have him.

He inherited every single penny having never left home in 60 years. He's now inherited a six bedroom house, tons of money. It's a slum already. He's never cooked, used a dishwasher, made a bed.

Do you think your father expected you to say, "oh, that's OK, I've got loads of money, I can afford to give some of it to you to stretch your pensions to subsidise my brother's life-style because he's not even slightly paying his way"? It's strange. I understand your resentment and I think you need to prepare yourself for the inevitable time when your brother insists it is your turn to take on caring duties (payment for their care) for your parents. I don't know how feasible it is for you to keep a running total of what your brother's family have saved by living with your parents all this time, so that when you are told you need to do your share, you can ask with what money? It sounds very petty, I'm just pondering on a way for you to be treated fairly in these very unfair sounding circumstances.
Sorry, I wrote the above before having seen your latest post, I hope your word with your brother goes well.

I think all you can do is be very clear. If your dad complains you say “well at least dbro and SIL will be there to look after you in old age”, preferably infront of your brother. I think given your parents have got very traditional views in regards to their son they will expect their DIL to pick up their care. How they all sort that between themselves is their business. I can’t imagine they actually want any money from you if they have decided they are very traditional, you don’t take money from your daughters, only your sons.

Nothing you say will have an impact on what your parents decide to do, they are determined to sub him regardless. I think you should though make it very clear to your brother that you won’t be stepping in to care for anyone, he’s been subbed by your parents for a reason. He knows this as well, he knows full well what the expectation and payback is.

There is nothing you can do about the rest of it but you can draw your boundaries. I know it’s difficult OP I’m asian too and I get the context but you will have to be blunt, either now or in the future.

It is deeply unfair, absolutely, times have changed and most people my age are writing inheritances to be equally split and recognise the value of their daughters. Neither I nor DH have received as much help as our siblings and we’ve turned out to be the most comfortable (we don’t blame siblings at all btw all decent people) but it also means we don’t feel the same duty to be doing stuff for anyone. We don’t have money or childcare to pay back. We are also not that close to our parents. I think we were both black sheep tbh and it suits us just fine.

SIL asks for help and gets it, if you aren't going to ask for help why are you so resentful of not getting it? If you want things more equally then ask for help too?

I hope that it goes ok. You know to be very careful what you say.

I'm not sure I'd point it out, if you do that the parents and brother will start working things such that OP is put on the spot and HAS to step up.
I would instead make sure to swerve if & when the need arises.

Ask for money? We won’t, I think my in-laws should go on a vacation with that money. She thinks they should give it to her so she could buy jewellery.

I’m beginning to realise DH and me have been super dumb all this while. Both sets of parents ring us when they need “help”. My parents won’t ask unless they are desperate (they just manage on their own) They are afraid of making DB look bad. Inlaws ring DH for help with everything.

What exactly do we do that makes them think we’ll look after them while they look after their other children? I wonder why in-laws don’t ring SIL when they need anything?

What exactly do we do that makes them think we’ll look after them while they look after their other children?
It's probably because when they say 'jump' you say 'how high', in other words they ask you because they know you are obedient.
You need to stop obeying, turn the phone off, dont respond unless it's something that benefits you, etc

Because they know you are both competent, generous and kind. They know that you will help them despite both sets having blatant favourites.
As I said earlier, you both need to draw some boundaries. That might involve seeing a counsellor to help get your thoughts and feelings together. Do not be guilt tripped into running around after your elderly parents who have treated you so unfairly and put their son above you in every way. He can fulfil the traditional expectations as he has happily benefitted from them all these years.

The trouble with boundaries is, i suspect if the op was ever showed any actual consideration from her parents she would go running, as shes been looking for this for years.

Its a very difficult web to untangle.

Precisely. Being so independent is also what makes parents leave people like OP and her DH out of wills, "because they're so good at looking after themselves and don't need any help".

Inheritance or financial help isn't a given but I get you, it hurts when a sibling is favoured.

You don't have to take advantage of them but equally not let them take advantage of you.

Totally agree. That's why therapy could help. Dysfunctional family behaviour and expectations are pretty hard to escape from.