Me and 13 yr old: The constant, awful battle over screen time

[Bellballbune]

NC for this.

I wrote a long, detailed post and then erased it. There seemed no point in such elaborate detail when the headlines are clear:

• I’m a fairly controlling mum about screen. I think 4/5 hours in the holiday gaming (plus his phone with him most of the day until he must leave it downstairs at 8pm) is fine. Plus, episodes in evening on TV as a family
• He can’t bear being restricted. Wilful, combative, relentless over wanting more - all the time
• Dh who agrees with me but is easier going and enjoys watching sports in evening on TV and likes DS watching with him - so doesn’t care that he’s just come off hours of gaming onto more screen.

i know I need to find a better approach rather than a shrill, stern reproachful way of trying to coax DS off. I know I’m not handling it well. I do try to offer different things - board games, cooking etc - but his interest is minimal. His interest in everything is minimal. He just wants to chill! All the time. It drives me fucking insane.

He does do some sport and he will go to the park with his friends for a bit but that’s it.

I’m worried about the level of screen usage and addiction. I’m worried im failing him as a parent. He used to be so engaged in tons of stuff.

And I actually just hate family life at moment as it revolves around all this and DH and I just end up arguing over my approach and how I’m getting it wrong. It is so boring! And I’m scared DS will just hate me soon enough.

i dream of running away….

Any thoughts?

Stand your ground. In a few years he may call you an abuser on TikTok but who cares. You're doing the best for your child and we all know it.

Look at Kate Siverton on This Morning. She now advises parents on screen usage, I thought she was really good.

I never restricted screen time. What I did do, however, was set a list of things that had to be done before they could go on their screens, including tidying their rooms, other chores, music practice, and reading. I found those would take up a surprising amount of time (especially the reading), leaving them with much less time to focus on their screens alone. Watching TV with Dad is a shared, relationship-strengthening activity that I wouldn’t count as screen time.

THIS IS THE OP! I can't get into my other account for some reason

Family link is no longer enforceable when the child is 13 - my son knows this and whilst we had enforced limits on everything, he basically told us that he could lift them if he wanted. What's the point of pretending we can enforce those limits when he could circumvent them if he wanted?

But I think other kids would go along with Family Link beyond 13. Which is why this discussion is hard; it's all about personality as much as anything else. If you have a more fearless, less abiding child - they will do what they can to rip up the rulebook.

I do offer alternatives, I'm a 'present' mum, and i'm working less at the moment so I'm around. But I also do balk at having to offer alternatives to a 13 year old boy in order to 'coax' him off screen. At what point will he just say I'm off, and go and do something on his own? He never has, even as a younger kid (and he didn't do any gaming until he was in Year 6 onwards, and then very tentatively - it's revved up this year as it's so much more about socialising) but I do despair at his inability to entertain himself.

But I also accept that I need to offer alternatives to get more of what I want.

Hmmmm i think we live in such a screen obsessed world now that it is fighting a losing battle. If he’s already spending four hours a day on screen then I think any damage is already being done and you nagging won’t really help things. It doesn’t mean he will turn out badly necessarily. Also so many parents sit on their screens constantly so telling kids they can’t do it seems hypocritical.
Watching tv is different to gaming - it’s pretty relaxing. I’d let him do that if he wants to.
idk what the right answer is but I did v few activities as a teen, I read trashy books, magazines and watched way too much tv. I’m an introvert and sports are really not for me and I didn’t have that many friends either. I turned out okay - qualified as a lawyer for instance. My mum’s friend’s son was obsessed with some war based computer game as a kid and spent every day on screen all day. He’s a CEO of a charity now and did extremely well at school and uni. His sister never had screens and has severe MH issues and has been very troubled from teens onwards.

i hope you find the right answer for you and your family.

I also have a screen obsessed 13 year old son. He can be mardy about it but generally he is quite compliant which makes it easier but it still drives me nuts that as soon as he has a minute free he's straight on to the computer - he never ever chooses to anything else, even though he enjoys reading, games, drawing etc.

Some things that worked (a bit) for us are:
I sat down with him and told him why I'm harsh. He understood and it seemed to help a bit when I cut screen time -he knew I was doing it out of genuine concern rather than just to be annoying
I got him a debit card and gave him permission to go to the local town. He's very food oriented so he loves going in to get a Greggs. It's a walk, he buys something small and gets out and about.
I've prompted him to plan social things with his friends - going to town, going to the park. You could have knocked me over with a feather when he told me he had arranged to go the city to play crazy golf with a bunch of friends - such a good result. So far a one-off but still good progress
I paid him to read the first book in the Hunger Games series (yes it got that bad). I did it because I knew once he'd read it he'd get into it and read the others. It's worked somewhat although he'll always always choose screens rather than reading.
I paid him to do some work for me - he is also quite money motivated so that worked well.

I sometimes wonder if I should make him go cold turkey - two weeks without screens. It's hard because a lot of his schoolwork is on computer. I would hope though that after a couple of weeks he'd realise there are other things to do with his time and he'd have a bit more variety in his pursuits.

I also have an 11 year old DD and she isn't bothered about screens at all -she'll watch a few bits here and there and play a bit of minecraft but she'd far rather go to her friends house or make something crafty.

I've just finished a work contract that was entirely conducted in front of a screen. Teams meetings, online learning, training, research, writing, spreadsheets, visuals ... Screen. Their world will be screen-led even more than it is now.

I do offer alternatives, I'm a 'present' mum, and i'm working less at the moment so I'm around. But I also do balk at having to offer alternatives to a 13 year old boy in order to 'coax' him off screen. At what point will he just say I'm off, and go and do something on his own?

Yes I'm with you OP. Also, you can offer alternatives all day long, and they can just politely decline. (Mine doesn't always, but enough to make it difficult) You can force them off the PC but then they look at their phone... force them off that and they go watch TV. We do have times when the WiFi is off but it's a constant battle.

I don't have an answer, except that lots of people tell me they grow out of it. Until then, solidarity!

The screens themselves aren't the issue (at least not for me). It's the hours of mindless watching of stupid youtube videos or of playing the same game. It's the lack of human contact, the lack of engaging with anything.

ThIS IS THE OP

I have to say, that's a ridiculous implication - that if he's already doing 4 hours a day, the damage is already being done and there's no turning back.

So, if you had a child who's an alcoholic - would you just stop battling with them to stop drinking, because hey, what's the point the damage has been done?

And It doesn’t mean he will turn out badly necessarily. - cheers!

Limit the gaming. Absolutely.

but watching sports with dad side by side in the same room. Allow that, it’s still family/social engagement.

We are not at this age/stage yet, but have discussed it a lot with DH. I think the only way is to get them doing other activities. So like a PP said, running, badminton, Scouts.

So he’s not a Scouts-type boy? What about taking him rock-climbing, dirt-biking, go-carting, archery, shooting. Cycling. Geocaching. Army cadets. Marine cadets.

Screen-time, particularly tiktok and gaming, is so addictive and so damaging to growing brains. There’s no two ways about it. Get them out the house doing something else.

We have already mentally allocated funds (and time) in the teen years towards horse riding, driving round the country to rugby matches, whatever it may be. We will support literally any hobby or extra curricular for teens if it gets them away from screentime. Not only for the damage that gaming and tiktok does to their attention span and reward/dopamine cycle, but also to get them away from the kind of shite they’ll read on the internet too.

Next holiday? Send him to football or rugby camp, or coding camp, whatever suits. Even just a generic holiday club for working parents. Better than the endless battles about screentime.

I don't think you're controlling enough about screens tbh.

4 to 5 hours gaming, plus phone whenever, plus more TV on top is A LOT.

Id implement a rule of x amount of screen time, fullstop and its up to him how he uses it.

There are a bunch of studies that show how bad, too much screen time is for kids.

Pediatricians recommend limiting screen time, too.

And just talk to some of these guys who grew up glued to screens all the time. It's obvious they're not as smart or social as they could be.

I get that it's easier for parents to just let their kids have unlimited screen time, but they really need to say no and deal with the tantrums.

And no, kids who game for 3 or more hours a day are not doing well in school. Schools these days are a joke, and they accept the bare minimum from students. Cheating is also really common.

The American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) recommends the following screen time limits for children by age:
Under 18 months: No screen time, except for video chatting with family or friends
18–24 months: Limited to watching educational programming with a caregiver
2–3 years: Up to 1 hour a day of high-quality educational programming
2–5 years: No more than one hour per day co-viewing with a parent or sibling
5–17 years: Generally no more than two hours per day, except for homework
Teens and adults: Two hours per day

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10353947/

Because she's trying to do the best thing for her son?

I think this is a good answer.

You’re right that there’s no solution because screens are now just part of life. We can choose to spend our lives fighting against this new situation and feeling guilty or we accept that this technology is designed to be addictive and there’s only so much we can do to fight against it. The whole time they’re not on screens has become work and effort and that’s awful but that isn’t your fault.

My DS is autistic and has always spent far far longer than your DS on a screen. I spent years feeling terrible about it but I remember someone saying that they thought it was a good thing because it stopped their child going out and getting into trouble. Not that mine would - he’d no doubt read for hours instead. Mine’s at uni now doing computer science. He has a really good routine, eats regular meals and has a regular sleep schedule. I make him come on dog walks during the holidays but I do worry that he doesn’t do enough exercise.

I think that is very much the case

🤷‍♀️
Youre the one worried about it affecting his life outcomes. I think it’s more complex than that.

Re the 4 hours a day and alcoholic comparison, that would be like me saying it was okay to drink 5 pints a day but not 7. Okay one is maybe not quite as bad as the other but if you think excessive screen time is damaging then 4 hours is quite a lot yes and if you are worried about addiction then letting him play for 4 hours is likely to get him as hooked as playing for 6 hours.

Anyway unless you and his dad are on the same page and enforce it to the same extent, it will be an uphill battle.

Have you tried a trip away where you “forget” to bring his phone or iPad? As in full on cold turkey.

But what if your kids are happy to game all day and tik tok on their phones if away from console?

Not all children self-regulate. Not all parents can afford to take their kids to loads of activities.

Very few children use Snapchat or Tik Tok for their educational value

Its interesting here that people cant imagine teens doing anything unless they are led by the hand...ie sport or organised days out.

Too many kids growing up not knowing how to just go to a park and hang out with friends and yes maybe be a bit bored ! But also develop independence and enjoy life off a screen

Please get on board with this petition about smartphones. Children are growing up too fast with smartphones. They wreck mental health for our young children. It's too late for some, but might help others. smartphonefreechildhood.co.uk

Ds was obsessed by music and listened to albums learning songs by heart
Ds2 used to spend time gaming with friends in person...is this a possibility?
Ds2 also had an Achilles heel of enjoying watching drama series with me...Mr Selfridge, Red Dwarf that sort of thing
They both loved watching sport with peers/parents.
Ds2 had a season ticket so went to lots of local matches with DH
Ds1 was in a choir at the weekend

Otherwise I would have said they would have been screen junkies and the same tension you feel to limit their use was ongoing!!
Ds2 at that age never willingly read a book even comics...I found it v frustrating

Getting outside- travel of any kind/ going on errands/socialising/ to theatre etc felt like a relief because I knew they weren't on screens and they were hitting the dopamine button in some other way.

We also made a big effort to watch series with them...Dr Who, Downton anything current ....conversation /banter and communication being a big part of the experience

This is the OP

Maybe I am a nag - actually, I know I'm a nag - but my DS is going to make me his first therapy session as an adult whatever I do, so I may as well die on the hill for what I believe is right.

Why are the children always so gifted so articulate so amazing.. never rings true