My brother has hidden my nephews rugby playing...

[touchrugby]

Asking for my brother - I think he’s in a mess and I need to tell him what to expect and how unreasonable he was. Interested to hear from other divorced parents and sports teachers/ school administrators. I’ve tried to give as much context as possible.

My brother got divorced 4 years ago. They have (had?) an amicable coparent relationship- there was no cheating or unkindness in either side. My brother just became obsessed with giving his family a good life and he worked a lot of hours. When he wasn’t working he was a very engaged parent- my nephew is hugely sporty and they were always off doing sports- swimming, tennis, football, cross country etc. Ex SIL was a SAHP but eventually got frustrated (with justification) at never seeing her husband so went back to work and divorced him. They share 50/50 custody with my brother as the higher earner paying all DNs expenses.

My brother really wanted nephew to go to this very nice private school. To facilitate this he pays all the fees. It’s a great academic school so ex SIL was pretty happy-except for the sport. They’re a big rugby school and she was adamant that DN not play rugby due to injury risks. There was a big argument about it, with my brother and DN really wanting rugby, and her adamant that he wouldn’t play.

The school offers non contact rugby and eventually they agreed DN would do that. DN is in year 9 now and it’s recently come out that he switched to full contact rugby in the 3rd week of year 7 and SIL didn’t know. It’s come out because he’s recently been made captain of the A team and a few mums congratulated her.

It seems he hated the non contact team. He’s very gifted with sport and apparently it was a team of lads who just wanted to run around for a few hours and throw a ball. The school put little effort into it and there were no matches. He asked to switch to “proper” rugby and the school said they needed a parent to approve it- and my brother did.

His argument is that his son wanted it, the school did email SIL as well, and it’s been 2.5 years.
Her argument is that he knew her stance, he also knows she’s a bit disorganised and rarely reads emails especially ones about sport which she know my brother manages (she has over 10,000 unread emails on her phone!) and that my brother conspired to hide it.

She has a very valid point about the conspiring. She has a new partner. He works Saturdays so my brother used to have DN every Friday night so they could see each other, and he’d then take him to Sat morning matches before dropping him at SILs Sat evening. Brother and DN have both, in 2.5 years, managed not to say anything to her about his rugby which is obviously duplicitous, especially considering how good he is. Brother just managed all the kit and the washing and the games and it apparently never came up in conversation.

Shes utterly furious and is going to the school Monday to tell them to remove him from rugby. Brother planning on going to the school to tell them to keep him in rugby. DN is apparently going to refuse to return to his mums house unless she agrees to the rugby and is determined to continue.

I’ve maintained a good friendship with SIL. In many ways I’m closer her than my brother as I see her more (he’s still a workaholic in his non parenting time so he’s hard to get hold of!) I heard about the odd match but nothing specific, I assumed it was non contact and frankly don’t know anything about rugby anyway. She’s very unhappy with our family as obviously our parents knew as well. My dad watches half the matches!

Does anyone know what the school might do? My brother and nephew are digging their heels in and saying he’ll live full time at my brothers and my brother will therefore get full parental responsibility. I think this is rubbish and not legal. I am worried that a nice coparenting relationship is ruined and that SIL might lose my nephew. He loves his mum but he’s obsessed with sport and apparently A team captain at a school like his is a BIG deal. He’s already playing some 2nd eleven matches as well which is also apparently important. I don’t know how to feel about what my brother did. He has absolutely supported what DN wanted. My nephew is so happy playing rugby and so good at it and still uninjured, and it’s the game played by 90% of the school. She knew sending him there that if he didn’t play rugby he’d be a bit isolated but she will not have it.

Frankly I think there’s fault on both sides, but on balance how much more unreasonable was my brother and what the hell might happen next?

How embarrassing for that poor boy with his mother being such a fusspot ‘that parent’. His rugby team mates must think ‘how weird’.
I hope the lad breaks free and enjoys his sport.

Yeah. Imagine a parent having concerns about the well-established longterm risks of a sport. Embarrassing.

Headgear? What exactly are you suggesting?

She means a scrum cap

Tbh, it will be embarrassing for him if his mum vetos him playing.

Especially since the ‘deception’ for over 2 years has somehow involved the mother having received correspondence from the school about the rugby (but not read it), never having gone to watch her son play a sport he loves, and not even really talking to him about it. For over 2 years.

I simply don’t understand how you could not know that your teenage son plays contact rugby. The emails probably include loads of information about stuff like the RFU’s head case programme and how to spot the signs of concussion/what to do about it etc. And, as others have said, newsletters which may include photos etc.

it’s really odd to not at least skim the newsletters, especially if they may include information about your child. It’s unusual to not have significant sporting achievements come up at parents night or in a school report. It’s unusual not to talk to your child about what they’ve been doing. Or notice if they’ve had a bit of a bump.

Tbh, if my DS had felt the need to lie to me about something like which rugby team he plays on for years, I’d be wondering how I’d fucked the relationship up so badly that he wouldn’t even try to talk to me.

Being furious at the child’s father would just be a way of distracting from my own shame and embarrassment at being a shit mum. Especially since I’d found myself in situations where it was obvious to other parents that I took no interest in my very sporty son’s sporting interests.

I would be embarrassed about that!

Then she misunderstands the point of them. Scrum caps will not prevent concussion, in fact it has been shown it can give false confidence.

Scrum caps are for the Scrum, protecting ears but not much more. The only backs that wear them are because they have long hair.

Yeah. Imagine a parent having concerns about the well-established longterm risks of a sport. Embarrassing.

Yet she allows him to go skiing which of course has no risks whatsoever

The mum is being really unreasonable here.

She needs to separate her anger with her ex for being sneaky from her sons love of sport clashing with her beliefs. It is her sons life and be is becoming his own person and as a parent you lose influence as they grow and can make their own decisions.

If she doesn't back down on this and tell him how proud she is of his obvious talent and leadership skills she is going to lose him and do irreparable damage to their relationship.

She can have her concerns and make them know but she cannot stonewall this at this age and against the wishes of the other parent. She has become entrenched in her view and lost touch with reality a bit.

Well that's confusing. A lot of Australian rugby league players wear headgear. And junior rugby players often as well. Not a scrumcap.

Google Jonathan Thurston head gear
That's what I mean

It's perfectly reasonable to have concerns about the health dangers of playing rugby.

Not so much to allow him to be sent to a private school- payments courtesy of ex - where rugby features heavily, and try to stop her DS doing something he is clearly talented at.

I'm slightly stumped as to how she didn't know. Even when we went to parents evening some teachers would mention DS rugby playing in passing and he has certainly never been captain of the first team.

Repeated studies have shown that headgear being able to protect players from concussions in contact sport is a myth. As far back as 2005, a study of 304 rugby union players in New Zealand found “the risk of concussion was not lessened by the use of padded headgear or mouthguards”.25 April 2023.

Conclusions: Padded headgear does not reduce the rate of head injury or concussion. The low compliance rates are a limitation. Although individuals may choose to wear padded headgear, the routine or mandatory use of protective headgear cannot be recommended.
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov › ...

If it actually made a difference it would be mandated. Yes non scrum playing players wear it but it is false confidence. A quick look at Thurston and he says he put it on because he was only 70kilos, it is little more than a comfort blanket.

Something doesn't add up here. All the schools I know have regular photos of sport happening on their social media accounts. Has she really not seen his photo in any of the posts?

Most schools would also regularly email out the team sheets to parents, after all how else would the parents get to know if their child was playing that week, home or away, timings? Did she not check any of her emails at all?

Apparently not. She has over 10k unread emails that include all the emails from the school about sport. Because she’s just not interested and has delegated it to her ex.

Neither she nor anyone else in her family have ever thought to go and watch her sports enthusiast son play his sport. His paternal grandfather goes fairly regularly though. Meanwhile, the mum spends every Saturday across London with her boyfriend because sport is too boring for her.

She doesn’t even talk to her son about his sport by the looks of things.

And weirdly the OP is the father’s sister and somehow seems to be trying to justify her ‘scatty’ SIL delegating all sport decisions to her brother but being unhappy that they aren’t the decisions she would have made.

Tbh, I don’t even understand the whole how the divorce came about narrative. The SIL was unhappy that her extremely high earning husband was either at work or doing sport (with their son) so she stopped being a SAHM and got a job so they could have the child 50-50 and she’d have far fewer needs for the financial settlement. Why?

@marmaladulation

Hi, I too invested invested in headgear for my son thinking this, but actually...

North Queensland coach Neil Henry said after Sunday's match at Toyota Stadium that he had initially been worried about the health of Thurston ''but he wears headgear''.
That comment prompted Muratore to contact the Herald to express his concern that players may think headgear will protect them from a concussion.
''The only thing headgear protects you from is lacerations around the scalp and face,'' Muratore said. ''That is really the only thing. For the concussion, it does nothing because concussion is the brain moving inside the skull and there is no way you can stop that. I don't know how we can get the message through to people and educate them that headgear makes no difference, and in fact if you give it to kids it often gives them a false sense of security.''

I will be following the study on smart mouth guards, recently used in the Six Nation's, with interest. Although it is not just injuries to head, but neck and spine that made me relieved my son switched. Yes, there are lots of rules to improve safety, but they have to be implemented correctly (and as this thread shows, there is confusion about what the rules are) and I actually do feel quite sorry for the level of responsibility PE teachers take on in this regard, because they don't have a team of medics on the sideline to assess. They have to make split decisions whilst still managing everything around them. Not just games, training too. I imagine young players may often truly think 'I'm fine, don't fuss' and no one may clearly have seen what happened to assess severity properly, so on and on they go. The mix of size, height and weight in the younger years was especially difficult to watch.

School reports would mention being captain of the U14 A team I am sure

So does she not read the school reports or at least the part from the TUTOR or form teacher saying how well he has done in rugby etc

The PE section of the report???

Very strange behaviour

Tbh, if my DS had felt the need to lie to me about something like which rugby team he plays on for years, I’d be wondering how I’d fucked the relationship up so badly that he wouldn’t even try to talk to me.

Interesting that this is your angle, rather than wondering what the hell the dad has said to the son to take on this level of deception.

5, Never noticed the bruises and scrapes to his body?

Women can't win.
She is fine for her ex and their son to have a special thing and is not micromanaging? she is a shit mother.
she learns what their special thing involves and is scared about the son? she is jealous because of the special thing.

Wow.
How many fathers know nothing about their children and yet, as long, as they see them on the weekend they are fine, no judgment?

I love rugby, my husband played it at a high standard and both of my sons play. Physicality is part and parcel of the game and I'm with your nephew, touch rugby is a bit crap.

Would I want my kids to pursue it as a career? Absolutely not. As PPs have said, far too much of a sacrifice in terms of the impact of long-term brain injuries. I read an interview with Steve Thompson (England hooker that won the RWC) and he can't remember his kids' names. He's 40 odd. It's so sad. Another friend's rugby playing son has memory loss and permanent headaches and he's only in his early 20s.

Rugby is probably one of the only sports where I think both parents should agree because of the serious health consequences. So I think the deception was wrong and it should have been a whole family decision.

Nah I'd judge them too. I think it's fine to let the father and so have their 'thing' but to never take enough of an interest to ever go to a match is a bit shit. She goes to the music and arts based stuff because it interests her but you should support all their interests

I'd absolutely judge a man in the same position.

You can also let father/son have their own "thing" and pay attention to what your kid gets up to at school for nearly three years!

Your DB has

• gone against his co-parents wishes (which were safety reasons)
• continually mislead her for a prolonged period of time (given she said no contact rugby he has mislead her, no matter how you frame the nuances of the situation)
• encouraged his son to do the same (there is no way they've not had any conversations about "not telling mum")

And your DB is now

• continuing to go against her wishes
• supporting his son to against her wishes
• making no effort to mitigate the situation he has allowed to develop.

A good parent would not be allowing a mother / child relationship to be hanging on such a fine balance.

Effectively the mother has no real choice here. She either gives in to the rugby or her DC moves out? And what is this teaching the child about getting his own way?

As I say I realise there are a lot of finer points this situation. The boy is gifted at rugby, the boy loves rugby, the mum missed a lot of signs he was playing contact rugby etc but overall the DB is has created an untenable situation.