To be upset about Ex’s new partner bathing our child?

[IcyCat]

Bit of relevant background: ExH and I have been separated for 18 months, hopefully soon to be divorced. We have 3 children (7, 9 & 11) and we get along/co-parent fairly well most of the time. I am the resident parent, our children stay over at his 1-2 nights per week depending on his schedule.

He's been with his new partner for about a year and they’ve recently moved in together. I’ve not met her, but the children like her a lot, so I’ve no problem with her generally. She has children of her own who live with them full time, they don’t see their father due to previous abuse (according to ExH).

Tonight I started running a bath, and DD (7) told me she didn’t need a bath, because she’d already had one with ”partner’s name” before I picked her up (at tea time).
So I said “Oh ok, daddy didn’t tell me you had a bath today.” And then she said daddy didn’t know because he was out at football practice with DS (which was 2pm ish so middle of the day?), and ”partner” gave her a bath, she helped her wash her hair and dried her off, dried her hair etc when she got out.

I feel a bit weird about this. Firstly I don’t think it’s at all appropriate for this woman to be bathing my young child, it’s her dad’s responsibility. Secondly, why do it while he’s out, and to put her in the bath in the middle of the day is odd anyway? I did ask DD if she had been doing some kind of messy play to need a bath but she said no.

I don’t want to accuse this woman of anything because as far as I can tell from the conversation with DD, nothing else happened besides the bath. DD wasn’t upset and told me conversationally, but I’m not comfortable with it at all and wouldn’t want it to happen again.

I know ExH will likely say I’m overreacting so I thought I’d ask mumsnet before I raise it with him, I’m sure I can rely on honest opinions here!

So AIBU to be upset by this?

I meant it's inevitable they will meet eventually, whatever the scenario.

I don't understand the problem. I'm a step-grandmother and regularly help bath my step grandchildren. I can also remember bathing my daughter's friends as well when they needed it after a day on the beach or in the mud and no-one thought it was inappropriate or weird. it sounds like you have issues around the new partner. If so, just tell her you prefer you kids to bath themselves and that you don't want her to see them undressed or similar.

In my job we do safeguarding training a lot. This gave me red flag feelings. I might be jaded due to my role but I would never, as an adult, put myself in that situation due to potential misunderstanding etc. It’s your child so you have every right to say you don’t feel comfortable about this and you do not want it to happen again.

I understand this pov although as PP have said legally if the child is in the care of the father then during that period of time he has the right to decide what happens in all aspects of care if he deems it to be safe 🤷‍♀️

It's the father's child also? What rights does he have?

The OP can certainly raise the issue with the father and express her feelings on the matter but ultimately, it's still his decision while their daughter is in his care.

It wouldn't be the new gf sending back a dirty 7 year old, it is the father

No new gf needs to wash a 7 year old child in the bath.

Of course the 7 year old isn't likely to moan about the events as they want to see their dad again.

Did the child get clean clothes afterwards?

This is an awful situation that the child has been dropped into. New person on their life seeing them naked and washing and drying them.
She needs careful reinforcement about who gets to see her naked.

But the dad wasn’t there was he. So how do we know he had any idea this happening.

We don’t know if it was his decade he wasn’t there when it happened.

Again the father wasn’t there. So can’t say he had any idea this happened or it was his request. As OP said the dad is well aware that baths/showers are part of their daughter’s bed time routine.

@ClaudiasWinkleMan He entrusted his partner with care of his child though which puts her in loco parentis enabling her to make these decisions unless the father has explicitly said she is not permitted to bath his daughter.

It's absolutely not! it's not ok for anyone to take it upon themselves to bath your child and to do it without permission, without reason to do it and without the little Girl' s parents knowing about it. Plain weird. What's it teaching the child aswell? That it's ok for any Tom, Dick or Harry to strip them naked? Nah, I would be round them beating the door down and giving this woman a piece of my mind.

Then, they wouldn't be going round to his house anymore. Plain and simple. I would be saying, you can come round and see her at my house.

@Millie890 You would likely then be taken to court and the judge would take a very dim view on your stance.

Please see my previous legal post on the matter.

Don't think they would "yes, your honour...I was uncomfortable with a person who is a stranger to me stripping my minor child naked and giving her a bath in the middle of the day without her parents permission so I kept her away from a situation where she's open to abuse". Sounds fair enough to me!

@Millie890 I have experience in this field and unless the child is coming to harm, a judge will not deem this to be an acceptable reason for stopping contact. You would have to prove that the step mother is abusing your child.

The partner is considered a part of the father's household and is equally taking on the parental role of caring for the children.

I can see it from both sides. I think this lady has not been dating your ex long enough to be doing such things.

You said you and ex get along so I would just drop a txt and just say "If you don't mind can you leave DD to shower when she gets home at mine if you don't mind". Just gently explain you are grateful for his GF offering to help but you just feel its too soon (which it is IMO).

@ClaudiasWinkleMan we don't know he didn't know and he can change bed tone routines, if he likes.

I have "experience in the field" of being a decent parent and legal mumbo jumbo means nothing to a Mum, Common sense and instinct come first. I wouldn't be waiting until harm had been done so I had a legal argument, if there was the slightest risk that there was a chance that my child was at risk of harm from some weirdo who likes to bath other people's kids in secret then my child wouldn't be going within a mile of their house. Let the court case commence! This is the trouble with courts and social services not doing their jobs properly, they shut the stable door after the horse has bolted. Also, i never said I would stop contact, I said she wouldn't be going to their house.

@Millie890 What exactly has the step mother done aside from bathing her partners daughter? There is no indication that nothing untoward has taken place and father could have asked her to do it as a favour for him. The child did not present as upset by the event nor made any concerning comments that would flag safeguarding concerns.

See my example below taken from my previous post:

One case I was involved in (some details changed as I cannot disclose sensitive information) it was alleged by the father that his son had disclosed that he was being showered by his step father and the step father was causing him physical pain while in the shower. It was also alleged that the stepfather was watching the young boy use the toilet and via a camera in his bedroom while changing, which was admitted to. The father kept the boy in his care due to his concern. As there were no injuries or evidence (despite the admission) the judge ordered that the young boy was to be returned to the mother and stepfather immediately.

So, if the judge ordered the child to be returned in the above case, do you think he would stop contact just because you wouldn't like the stepmother bathing your child? You would likely be considered as frustrating contact with the father which could lead to him having more time with his daughter.

I’m with you. I wouldn’t be comfortable with another man or woman bathing my sons. I’m amazed how many people think it’s ok because she is a woman, and others because she is a mom.

This. Also - use your words. Also - can’t believe you’d show no interest (ie not specifically request) to meet the woman your children see at your ex’s house. Surely that’s the place to start. If her ex was abusive and she’s had her kids by herself for a long time she probably thought she was doing something nice to help you.

On reflection is this not a case of all parties being guilty of omitting to meet each other and agreeing on suitable boundaries? Communication is sadly lacking here which ultimately leads to this type of issue with the child caught in the middle.

Not sure what you mean by “use your words”? I have every intention of discussing it with my ex but I asked for opinions here first as I wasn’t sure if it was worth possibly rocking the boat when we are getting along well.

And if you read my replies to other comments, I’ve clearly stated that I have requested to meet this woman on multiple occasions but my ex refuses to facilitate this!

Change bedtime routine to 2pm when the child was going back to her mums. Ok then. That’s teaching.