AIBU to defend my daughter?

[stressedmummmm]

My daughter is 11 (12 in June) and she has been a handful to handle both at home and in school. She is starting to get into more and more trouble at school and I'm not sure what to do.

Recently she has gotten into trouble for googling her history teacher during class which the teacher. She's gotten an afterschool detention.

Previously she had gotten into trouble for being rude and combative to her very kind teacher. The teacher has said that negative consequences do not have an effect on her, and the sanction system fails her.

Another teacher has said she's so distributive in music class that the teacher has requested she be moved to another class as she didn't want to deal with her anymore.

At home, she will scream at me if she does not get what she wants. She is very rude to us all. She hits her brothers if they do not listen to what she tells them to do, for example, to turn their iPads down. She will scream if her food is not how she wants it. She will scream if I dont take her somewhere specific now.

She is very jealous of me hanging out with my friends or even speaking to them on the phone. If I go out with my friends she will call her father in tears saying I have abandoned them (we live close to my inlaws, and when I go out my inlaws kindly have the kids). She will also text my friends on my Instagram and tell them to not contact me/I don't want to speak to them.

Her father and I had a rough patch a few months ago and she was witness to a lot of the fighting. However, these behaviour issues are not new at all. Amid our fighting, she got into trouble at school. In the first term of the year, she had gotten (within two months) 25 negatives.

I lost my mum at 14. My stepmom was not kind, and she didn't like me. I ended up spending most weekends with my grandmother on my mum's side. As I got older I started spending more time away from my dad's house until I got married at 23, fresh out of uni. I think I tried to give my children as much love as possible, and I always try to show them I am on their side. Kind of us against the world. When my daughter gets into trouble I am the first to defend her, but it gets out of hand and the school has mentioned suspension and expulsion more than once. My children live a blessed life, they get everything they want. DD goes horse riding three times a week, and I am thinking of buying her a horse.

I am worried that I have raised a spoiled brat but that she also might be neurodiverse. Her brother has been diagnosed with ADHD, but he behaves much better and his issues were very apparent. Shes smart enough to be masking, but her behaviour is out of hand.

My friend tells me I need to become more harsh with discipline, and I should be punishing her more severely. Especially with the horseriding privileges. How should I do this? Please be kind, I am trying my best here.

With all due respect, from the OP's responses on here I'm not sure that she is actually applying sanctions and is consistent in her approach. This seems to be very much a 'tail wags the dog' situation, where the daughter is the dictator and everyone else has to accept it, including putting up with her bullying her brothers, insulting teachers and preventing classmates from learning (I wonder how many of the other children's parents have made complaints about her, or are about to?).

Asking strangers on the internet 'how long' should she apply sanctions does not inspire confidence in the parenting of the child.

Of course you ABU in defending her! How can you possibly defend such out of order behaviour?

Hi OP,

I’m sorry but she is a spoilt brat.
This will have to do with who she is as a person, but also the way you and her father have parented her. You sound extremely lenient and weak regarding discipline and behaviour.

I would suggest that you speak to her firmly about her behaviour, rudeness and general spoilt affect. I would cancel horse-riding indefinitely (minimum 1 year depending on proof of good behaviour) and would not buy her any pets or new electronics.

If you are too weak can her father help with the discipline?

Sorry she is only going to get worse in the next few years if you continue spoiling her.

Her behaviour is unacceptable. You have nothing to defend there. You have to commit to a strategy to make her behaviour improve. If you don't have the knowledge to do it, there is always tips, advice and counselling. She will thank you in the future.

Preteens and teens can be a PITA, but that need actions.

Now is 12, but she can grow being like that and that is against her own future.

Your spoiling of her and letting her become a rude terror is going to do her no favours.

It’s not fair on her siblings, classmates or teachers. No one will want to be around her.

What is there to defend? She's a brat!
I'd bet money that there is nothing wrong with her, she is just poorly disciplined.

Agree you need to set really clear expectations for behavior first and really clear consequences. I would recommend reading 1,2,3 Magic and the Incredible Years. It is not going to be easy if you haven’t been doing this all along but you need to stick to it.

It is also really important that you praise any good behavior/following the rules. Recommended ratio I think is 4 praise to 1 correction. It’s a lot! Especially if she’s used to behaving badly, she actually needs it REINFORCED when she does it well and what that feels like. With our 4 year old sometimes praise looks like “welL done for telling me you’re angry with me with your words instead of hitting!”

I was referring to the sanctions imposed by the school, which appear to have had no impact.

You have my sympathy - although no doubt parenting style & consistency comes into it hugely - also, kids are different. They aren't all the same/blank pages - some of them are far more emotionally unstable and challenging than others - so give youself a break. You said yourself you have other children who do not have the same problems and presumably they are growing up in the same environment/with the same parenting style - so cut yourself a little slack, you have a live wire for sure, and it's relentless when you have a challenging child - and mixed with lots of feelings of shame/blame for the parents - so please be kind to yourself.

I would defintiely however sit down (with your partner) too and put some strategies in place. I have followed "the incredible years" (which is for kids up to 8 so a bit young) but essentially an intervention where you commit to certain things - spending dedicated time with the child every day, praise, encouragement, etc and establish some good positive consistent actions every day, and then start to build house rules - be repsectful, be kind, etc - and as they are broken (which they inevitably will be) - you need consequences - (loss of screen time, horse riding, not going to things, taking away phone, no pocket money) - BUT do not stop the positively and encouragement even if she is being difficult. She needs to know she is loved whatever she does - but that even though you love her, the other things (screen, horse etc) are privileges, not rights.

Re: jealously - I would try to talk to her about this. This shows deep insecurities - again, it needs to be a combination of love/reassurance but also consequences (e.g. if she messages your friends).

All behaviour is communication.

Talk to the school SENCO and pastoral lead. Come up with strategies and rules together. Good luck

You do not have discipline at home that’s it. Giving a child everything they want anybody with money can do that. How have u taught her right from wrong and that every decision no matter how small has consequences. If u what the rest of yr life to be peaceful then buckle up u have serious work to do for the next 6yrs to set boundaries no matter he it pulls yr heart strings and be consistent coz guess what if u don’t there is a great chance yr relationship with yr other children will be impacted it’s only a matter of time. Stay strong and remember u get what u put in

I suspect the OP might be neurodivergent from the way she asks about discipline as if she has never heard of the concept before

I think I tried to give my children as much love as possible, and I always try to show them I am on their side. Kind of us against the world. When my daughter gets into trouble I am the first to defend her, but it gets out of hand and the school has mentioned suspension and expulsion more than once. My children live a blessed life, they get everything they want. DD goes horse riding three times a week, and I am thinking of buying her a horse.

Good grief.

Yes, you've raised an entitled brat. She may or may not be ND, but that doesn't mean she' can't be an entitled brat, too.

You need to set expectations and hold her to them. You need to revoke privileges when she doesn't meet them. YOu need to stop defending her when she makes poor behaviour choices and institute a proper punishment.

Electronics is an obvious place to start. Horse riding is a privilege, not a right.

Start parenting your child.

Seriously ! No she is spoilt, entitled and a nasty little madam who has no boundaries, and not excuses.

How about listening to those with nd kids who do recognise this behaviour as part of their kid's neurodivergence (like me)? Just because you haven't experienced it doesn't mean it's not real.

The judgement levelled on here towards a mother in distress who is reaching out in desperation is horrific, abelist and staggeringly simplistic.

I'm actually embarrassed to admit that it could have been me way back in the day, smugly dispensing useless advice aimed at NT kids about boundaries/consequences/rewards etc.

I don't know that this girl is ND but I'd bet a lot of money on it and please, from a parent who has a similar one, stop talking with such conviction about stuff you don't necessarily understand (even if you're a teacher of 20 yrs/work with some nd kids. They are all different). As I say - 3 or my kids would respond to trad discipline but not my nd one.

She definitely has a problem. She needs some therapy I think to try and find out what is bothering her. Has she always been like this if she doesn't get her own way? She could well have a personality disorder that she needs to learn to be able to deal with. If it turns out she's just angry and spoiled, then a different approach will be needed.

@stressedmummmm please do NOT take away her hobby. That's a healthy emotionally regulating hobby. Exercise and animals. Extremely good for psychological wellbeing. Screens are the opposite. Taking them away is a good consequence. But you might want to get her assessed for adhd if it runs in your family. Something is going in and you need to find out what is is

Get her assessed
Get her some therapy
Get yourself some therapy

If she wants you to buy her a horse, then she needs to earn it.

Set some boundaries: Work hard at school, no detentions, to be polite and respectful. To be helpful at home etc.

Oh ffs 🤦‍♀️

Yeah definitely buy her a horse 🙄. I mean come on its hardly rocket science is it. Poor teachers (and other kids who are having their education disrupted). Maybe pay for homeschooling instead if she can't behave herself.

What exactly makes you think she is ND? Many ND children are well-behaved, others aren't. Have her teachers said she may be ND? What are the reasons/behaviours for suspecting this?

ND has been very under-diagnosed, especially in girls, but lately it's used as an excuse for everything.

I think it's really important not to try to excuse horrible behaviour with 'she might have ADHD'. And from what you've said this is probably all down to a lack of parental discipline, being backed up when she shouldn't be and no real consequences.

Essentially you've probably allowed this to happen over the years and now do not want to assume responsibility for what she's become.

If sanctions imposed by the school haven't had any impact as yet that is no reason why the child's parents should not be imposing sanctions at home. At the moment, the only 'sanctions' in this home seem to be on the child's brothers, who are being forced to tolerate her screaming fits and physical abuse.

And according to the OP, the school have mentioned not ruling out suspension or expulsion.

A mother in distress yes but to blame it on bad behaviour is a whole thing altogether. So a child contacts yr friends online to tarnish yr name and u blame it on a condition. Start parenting people and stop making excuses the least u can do is own up to yr mistakes as a parent nobody has a manual but only then can u make a positive impact and seek professional help before it’s too late and not on social media

This sounds more like spoiled brat behaviour than ASD - it all sounds very deliberate and manipulative. You sound like a follower of gentle parenting, and that you have not set any limits for her. Your daughter may need some counselling for herself to explore her feelings. But the main issue here is you and your attitudes to parenting. You may benefit from some counselling yourself, and a parenting course.

Where is your husband in this? Why did it take a friend to let you know this is not right? And why did you use the word 'harsh'. You could easily have said firm or clear.

Going forward there needs to be clear rules and immediate proportionate consequences for bad behaviour. You need to stop giving in for an easy life. And it needs to be consistent - you cannot offload this to your partner.

They won’t have an impact if the OP doesn’t show that she is on the school’s side.