To worry that SIL is planning a surprise visit?

[Surpriseobligations]

My sil lives in New Zealand . In the last 10 years she's made a few visits back to the UK.

2 of them have been surprises. One from her parents who were then expected to host her for the two weeks she was home, and the other from us as siblings. To be fair she normally tells someone in the family eg the PILs if she's surprising us or us if she's surprising the PILs. It creates lovely videos but is a PITA from my biased point of view.

I suspect she might do this for mine and Dps wedding that's upcoming . She says she can't come, but I'm worried she will randomly turn up as a surprise. I've tried to be clear that we are submitting final numbers, share pictures of us making place names for example.

I'm slightly concerned she will turn up, we won't have room in transport to venue, she won't have a place setting, won't fit on the right table for the table plan so we will have to chuck someone off the table and ask the venue for last min meals etc and it will be cause of stress on the day.

Is it okay to outright say to her that we don't want any surprises and she has to tell us now? How would we word that? She's having a bad time emotionally right now so don't want to make her feel bad.

Is it better to speak to PILs to explain to them we really don't want to add people last min

Is it a it bride zila to worry about a table plan?

un needed back story but explains why I'm annoyed at the idea

A slight back story is that she winds me up a lot just in general.When this happens the important people often have plans. Eg last time it was tricky as we were going to a family wedding that weekend then back at work (not local to PIL where she stays). People end up asking for emergency annual leave etc. She's very "my sister has just returned after years I'm sure your boss will understand" even when explicitly told we can't pick you up on that date because she's changed the dates

She's very babied by inlaws so I'd be surprised if they don't pay her flights etc as they contribute a lot financially to her to facilitate these trips and she frequently lends money. This is a bug bear a PIL never offer us any financial support and haven't contributed to wedding (they are buying DPs shoes only which are just from and regular higstreet shop). I'm completely fine with that because I don't view it as their job but will be annoyed if they spend thousands on getting her over here.

I'll also be annoyed if part of the wedding is taken up by her surprise appearance, previously its been for birthday parties etc so the focus becomes a bit on the wonderful daughter returning rather than the event.

Either you or DH should also speak to ILs.

"Is SIL coming? I know she says she isn't, but she likes to surprise people. I've got to give the final numbers and table seating to the venue by ( a week before actual date you need to do it) so please let us know by then if you believe she is as otherwise there will be no place for her. "

And write Mrs Thunderstealer or Mrs Expected on her placecard.

God how tiresome she is.

I would text or email…DSIL we are finalizing rsvp to wedding. Are you planning on attending? This gets it in writing. Then I (yes me not DP) would speak with PIL both and say DSIL rsvp no for wedding. Are you intending to enable her attendance by purchasing her flights? Do you know if there are any different plans? Get that answer firm. I would not ever buy a spare meal. It’s likely you may have a no show and she can have that meal if she surprises. And you DOP are the bride and no one can upstage the bride. Build a little insular wall around yourself maintained by your trusted tribe and be unavailable to her and unaffected by her shenanigans at the wedding. Not available to sort seats or transport or meal. If she lies or PIL lie she can sit on their lap for meal and transport or some other family member. The bride and groom are the focus just be sure to keep that forefront by being fabulously happy and engaged with each other and your people.

You could call her bluff but not give her a place for the main meal. Tell her that the chef has prepared her a sandwich which she can eat in the bar, as you suspected she 'might' just turn up, despite saying no.

<evil>

She sounds like she wants to be the centre of attention all the time esp with everyone expected to drop everything for her.
It sounds like she would do this for your wedding.

You shouldn’t have to spend your day worried about her, that’s very selfish of her and up to your dp and pil to sort out
Your dp and PIL should tell her straight numbers and names have to be finalised. The venue cannot accommodate anymore in terms of seating or food.

Then stick to that.

I'd tell her the wedding has been postponed, not brought forward.
If she arrives early , she might stay on.

Or, tell her the wedding has already taken place - like today ...

How does that work, then?

"Hi mum, I hear @Surpriseobligations's wedding's been postponed/brought forward?"

"No it hasn't DD, whatever gave you that idea? It's on <date> it always was"

I know someone like this, she loved and craved attention. It was ridiculous. She did it so often I don't know why they didn't just come to expect it.

If you've made it clear you need numbers, it's her own fault if she turns up and doesn't have transport and hasn't been catered for. Entirely her own fault. She can watch the ceremony and that's it. Her. Own. Fault. You've been clear.

If you really don't want her there send her a link to this thread.

Is she active on social media? Because you should be able to get an inking if she's on her way as it's a good 24 hours door to door (I've never done it that quick, it depends where you are and which bit of NZ she is) and she'd want to spruce up after such a long g flight. If she's still at home the day or two before the wedding, she's not coming.

How come she needs financial support if she’s able to lend someone some money?? Also, does your venue do bar meals or anything like that / separate restaurant. If she turns up, direct her there for food

So, her “surprise” will make the occasion all about her? Her brother needs to be really, really clear that if she rocks up, she is not coming. Tell pils as well. You get one fucking day, don’t let her spoil it.

I hope you can sort it and then relax.
DH is considering a future surprise trip to Australia for his brother's 50th/father's 80th birthdays. We know it wouldn't work well for his father, but surprising his brother could work brilliantly. So if it gets planned, it would be with his dad colluding, picking him up etc. And then closer to time working out whether his sister in law should know in advance too.

The thought of making a surprise trip to people that you then expect to put you up just leaves me cold. It was difficult enough years ago when relatives told us they were coming to visit us en route to NZ (to see other relatives), a few days after Christmas - and wouldn't believe that we were going to be away (summer holidays after all). My parents had to change plans because they wouldn't accept that they'd be flying back the same way and consider having their stopover on the way back. That was the first time my sister and I flew unaccompanied, as we had a summer course to get to.

You / your Dh / both of you need to talk to the SiL AND PiL and spell it out clearly - no vagueness, keep it factual and simple and to the point.

if she does turn up on the day, no matter how much ‘I’m not going to deal with it’ or ‘tough luck for SiL’ you will get dragged in as the venue will want direction. You could preempt with them (venue, photographer etc) otherwise the PiL could expect her to sit on the top table (esp if she is that ‘ta dah’ I’m here type). You could be clear and say to the venue that if an additional one does show up we will not be catering for them, do not want an extra place set up.

what a nightmare, I imagine she has no self awareness for these matters.

I think she needs to be told in no uncertain terms that a surprise appearance at your wedding is not going to work.
Its not a bridezilla thing to want to know who is coming and plan accordingly.

Hmmm, I think those saying "don't cater to her on the day" aren't acknowledging the PIL's endorsement of this behaviour (if it happens, as they will have paid the airfare).

I suspect if a meal and a place isn't produced for SIL that PIL may go home / out with her instead. Which would be hugely upsetting. And there is zero chance that bride and groom won't have to get involved with giving permission to the venue for an extra meal. Sorry OP, not trying to worry you more.

I'd lay down the law with SIL in advance but agree with those suggesting you pay for an extra meal and plan a place (not at top table). Work out which photos she should be in (as optional extra) to avoid muscling in on them all. Talk to photographer in advance and request very minimal photos of her in groups.

I'd also talk to a group of trusted friends and explain the situation and get them to insulate you from any nonsense.

I'm a planner and knowing I'd got everything covered would enable me to relax.

Fundamentally, do whatever will enable you to relax on the day and for all these months in advance!

How embarrassing. "Surprise I'm here!"

Who gives a fuck love? You're not Princess Diana 🤣

I’d have a plan in mind if she does turn up.

”oh how lucky, there’s a space over there on the table with Mary our neighbour and Brenda from work”

Do not move people around for her if she turns up

Id also give your venue a heads up that you think she might and if she does you do not want people moved around on the day at the behest of her or your in laws

YANBU re needing to know numbers for your wedding. You are however, being unreasonable to begrudge her parents for treating her to flights home so that they can see her. I'm sure that if you lived further away, they would pay for your fiance to fly home and see them if needs be. And just because they have paid for her flights, it does not mean that your fiance should be given the equivalent amount or money towards your wedding etc. in essence, they do not have to treat both siblings fairly, but can treat them according to their needs and it's really not up to you how they spend their money.

Don't think op has returned to the thread

Good for you. I've got zero time for this kind of attention seeking nonsense.

Attention seeking thunder stealer. Not what anyone needs at their wedding.

Completely reasonable to ask her to be upfront… it sounds as though she loves the attention!
I live in NZ… I know several women who could be your SIL!