Best friend only wants to catch up with me (childfree) at kid-oriented venues

[PlaygroundSusie]

Hi all - I’m childfree, so I hope it’s ok for me to post here. But I’d really appreciate some advice/perspective from parents.

My best friend and I are both 38. Met at uni. She has two children, DS aged 7 and a DD aged 3. She and her kids come as a package deal. She chooses not to socialise without them. This is because (as she’s explained) she wants to cherish every moment while they are still young. She works part-time and her kids are in loads of activities, so family time is vitally important to her.

I respect her decision and understand her kids are her top priority. I am also fond of her children and enjoy seeing them. The problem arises in where we meet. My friend never wants to stop at home. She always wants to catch up at very child-friendly venues. Usually playgrounds, but sometimes places like petting zoos, children's museums, festivals aimed at pre-schoolers, etc.

This means her kids are usually excitable, and easily distracted, and tend to race around a lot. Or they need help navigating the slide, or want to be pushed on the swings, etc. About 80% of my time is usually spent watching or helping my friend parent her children, and only 20% is us actually catching up and having a proper conversation.

On the very rare occasions we meet at her house, it’s much better. The split is more like 50/50. I happily interact with her children for a bit, but then they drift off to their toys, backyard, etc, and my friend and I chat. But unfortunately, my friend and her kids get bored at home, and prefer to get out of the house. Cafes are occasionally an option if it’s raining, or too hot, but otherwise they want the playground or some other place specifically designed for kids.

At the risk of sounding horrible, I’m tired of always catching up at child-oriented venues. I’ve been doing this for years, and there seems to be no end in sight. I’ve reached my limit. We’re catching up this weekend, and I suggested meeting at a café in a park (I figured we could maybe have coffee then go for a walk afterward). Her response was: “DS7 and DD3 would prefer to meet you at the playground. So, the playground it is – LOL!” Again, I appreciate her children come first, but I did find this a bit frustrating. Shouldn’t the grown-ups get to choose the venue?

AIBU? Is there a polite way I could tell her I’m sick of always meeting at child-oriented venues, and that I’d vastly prefer to simply catch-up at her house or a café? Any other suggestions? I feel like such an awful friend for feeling this way!

She sure ain't doing her kids any good being with them 24/7, they need space to grow and figure stuff out for themselves, and what about their relationship with Dad? Does he not deserve quality lone time with his kids?

I thought it was a compromise because on this outing, we took it in turns to do what the other wanted. I wanted to go to a cafe, so we did. She and her kids wanted to go to the playground, and we did.

But her kids were still there!

"My kids would rather get out of the house and visit the playground."

Honestly she sounds bloody awful.

It's all her way!

Doesn't sound as if she wants to see you that much.

I sympathise, I have a friend very much like this. Her husband is an arse though and as a result she ends up bringing the kids with her cause he is grumpy about doing what a dad should do. In addition her mother in law makes snide remarks such as 'Going out again?' if she dares socialise with people from work or do something for herself which is semi regular (maybe monthly?) but not like every week or anything. I feel bad for her marrying into such a backward and chauvinistic family.

I have built a positive relationship with her two kids and as I don't have many friends I just think beggars can't be choosers really. It's nice to see her, even with kids in tow, but sometimes they interrupt and say 'Mum Mumm stop ignoring me' when we are just trying to chat and catch up!

You do realise that you can reply with
"Sorry [her real name], but I am tired of having child-centred catch ups. I miss the times when we could have a chat over a meal or a glass of wine. I'm going to give these catch-ups a miss until your kids are older and you feel ready to leave them. Look forward to seeing you then - @PlaygroundSusie "

Or words to that effect.

Im A parent & although I think every parent absolutely can chose how much time they want to spend with their children, I think she is being very selfish in your friendship. She is not considering your needs at all & that isn’t how friendships work, parent or no parent.

I think you need to talk to her (not text) call her when she’s not busy & say something like, I love you & your kids to pieces, and love spending time with you all, and your friendship is so important to me. However as I don’t have children of my own, although I’m very happy to meet at the park etc sometimes, I’d prefer if we could alternate meet ups to places where we can be more relaxed & have more time to catch up such as XYZ..

If she doesn’t get it from that then you could try asking her why & if she is struggling at all with parenting & is actually needing that support. That might be the case, in which case you could recommend for her to talk to her partner about getting her some part time support of a nanny or something because you just don’t have the capacity to do it all the time. Of course you’ll still want to part of the time because as friends we support eachother, but you can’t do that every time it needs to be 50/50.

if that’s not the case & she still refuses then you need to be firmer & say that it really needs to be a 2 way relationship, you both have needs & both should put in equal efforts to accommodate each others needs in the friendship, as that’s how friendships work.

If she still can’t see it from that then you can repeat it and emphasise the love you have for her but until she can meet you in the middle you’ll need to take a step back and prioritise your own wellbeing & happiness and leave an open invitation for if she ever changes her mind.

You sound very patient and invested in this friendship . Personally I’d think some time away from her children would be good for all of them . I’d possibly not make her a priority.

my phone is a Samsung and can click in see all for ops posts

No to that. Suggest something in the evening or lunch without kids. If she says no then just keep in touch by phone. If it fizzles out then so be it, friendship isn't about one person getting their own way 100% of the time.

I'm childfree and this thread is funny to me because literally 99.9% of mums act this way but are calling your friend out for it. I bet there are lots of people in this thread who arrange things with childfree friends and either a) turn up with their kids even though you arranged to not do that b) cancel or c) change the plans and make it about soft play or similar.

The advice is also wild, as if you can do anything with kids around. You can give them all the activities in the world and they will still want your attention every 3 seconds. Or if they're older they're listening to your convos and ask questions.

I've not had a proper in-person conversation with any of my friends with kids from the time they gave birth to now (the oldest being 11). Most of my friends, even good ones, I haven't even seen more than once or twice in many years because they don't make an effort and I'm tired of inviting people and it going nowhere or arranging plans that are cancelled last minute (you never know if it's an excuse or not), or people trying to bring their kids to an adult party or pub trip.

Even when we do have a convo it's all about pooping/sleeping/a problem at school. They never ask how you are or what you've been up to. I struggle to really relate to what they're saying and I really struggle to have long conversations about nappies or baby led weaning because I'm used to adult conversations on a whole different plain about business, or travel, or politics. I can't imagine my days being about placating a child because their ice cream is too cold, it would drive me up the wall.

It's a totally different world. A plan to do something is not a big deal to me because I do things whenever I want all the time, whereas for parents it's like a few hours every few months so it becomes a big deal.

Most of my friends are childfree and we arrange plans last minute (unless it's a specific holiday or birthday thing) and everyone just turns up or comes over.

You can make an effort but you have to be prepared to step back too, as over time you'll both get new friends that relate more to where your life is right now and even the longest friendships (one of mine was a school friend) just don't last.

It does sound tedious, OP, but as she is an old friend, I’d put up with it for a few years, because this phase will pass.

Personally, I was always keen on child free meetups, but now mine are teenagers, every meet up is child free, they wouldn’t be interested in coming along. 😂 So you’ve got a few more years and then her children will refuse to come-or you’ll meet up at home and they’ll say hi and wander off. I think it’s worth hanging in there for a long friendship, I’ve done the same with my sixth form/uni friends, and it’s totally different now that our children are older.

But wherever I go, my kids go.

Does she take them to work wih her?

@moomoomoo27 , I'm childfree too and I can relate to a lot of what you say. In theory, if a friend becomes a parent, everyone is supposed to be very kind and accommodating and supportive of each other, and your friendship is supposed to merrily roll along with a few easy adjustments.

In reality, that's just not what happens. It's more likely that the friendship as you know it is gone, and the kids are really all that matter. Of course the friend who is now a parent can't just pretend that the kids don't exist, and of course their life has changed hugely, but as the childfree friend, it's very hard to know where you fit in. You feel like you're expected to be grateful for having any of your friend's time or attention at all, and all on their terms. It really does put a stress on a friendship, no point pretending otherwise

This! I have 2 young children and none of my friends' would entertain this. All their children have grown up now anyway as I'm an old fart mother! They would never want to meet at a park or child centred restaurant. And I m very grateful for that! You need more friends! X

I have DC. Admittedly they are grown now. But I have managed to keep my chiildfree friends of over 20 years. The idea that all mothers are interested in talking about baby led weaning is a bit suss to me, as my DC would say! I travelled with my children from the time they were 3 months old. I was no nappy changing hausfrau.

" About 80% of my time is usually spent watching or helping my friend parent her children"
unfortunately she is using you for help with childcare

hmmm @PlaygroundSusie I'm not sure I'd call sitting outside in winter in a noisy playground with a takeaway coffee 'going to a cafe' though! Brrrr ❄️

I have children and childfree friends and I'd consider a fair compromise meeting without the kids about half of the time. There is no compromise at all here.

Tbh, it sounds like she has built up a sort of anxiety about leaving them, but is putting a front on it of "cherishing her time with them". I wonder if she catastrophises about what would happen to them if she wasn't there? And it has become harder to go out the longer she has left it. Did she find it difficult to leave them at nursery? Is she constantly expressing concerns about them at school or nursery or worries about them while they are there? Did she give up drinking because she worries about looking after them properly if she's had a glass of wine, or if she could get them to a doctor if they needed it?

Think some of the posters are being a little hard. I'd try the gentle approach of asking if you can come round in the evening and see what she says. Agree though with disengaging about how much of a second pair of hands you are.

If she won't budge on that, I'd leave it a bit and put the ball in her court to invite you to something, but say no if it doesn't suit you.

I haven't read the whole thread, only your posts OP, but I'm wondering whether there's some anxiety around her kids that even she might be unaware of. Undiagnosed PND? It's not normal to subsume one's entire identity into being a mother and to refuse any activity that doesn't include them. The whole giving up wine thing because mothers don't drink is very odd.
Assuming all his normal re her mental health, she might come out of this when her dc are older - if you have the patience to wait that long! I'm not sure I would. I hated spending too much time in playgrounds with my own dc, let alone someone else's!

If you decide to put up with this for old times sake and in the hope that the real her eventually emerges, then I think you are right to pull back on being so helpful - have your coffee and a rest!
But it isn't normal imo and I don't think I could have done 7 years of it without saying "ffs, think about me for a change!"
You are a very good friend to her .

I have this. She does occasionally come out now in the eves as her children are older but I'm always made to feel guilty and that she's there only begrudgingly. She never wanted to miss meals with her children or doing bedtime. It was very hard work. And still is although she's getting better.

That said, I had a family crisis a while ago and she was a really good friend to me then. Came over, offers to help, chats on the phone. Would your friend do that for you if there was a real emergency?

Could you come at it from an "I'm worried about you" pov or is she a shoot the messenger type?

Next time she says 'the kids would prefer to go to the playground' could you not say 'ok no worries, let me know when you're back and I'll pop round'?

Cross posted @LadyBird1973 !

@LadyBird1973 I’m wondering the same, it could be some type of anxiety about leaving her children. I wonder whether her DH is even “allowed” to babysit?

Is your friend neurodiverse because this speaks to me as someone on the spectrum that I can't cope with lots of conversations all at the same time with competing interests.

I have a dear friend who is childless and she waited 15 years for me to be properly free again and we went away last year for 2 nights which was amazing. She's very zen though and non judgemental.

I never ever asked her to come to the playground with me or out on days out but then she doesn't live close by. She may well have done. She was and is just a lovely wonderful person but I'm not one to take advantage and wouldn't use the words your friend has used. She sounds a bit manipulative.

I was similarly exhausted every night at 9pm.

You could maybe wait for the 3 year old to start school. She may have more free time to herself then and want to actually see just you!

But she may equally just be a time waster...