Best friend only wants to catch up with me (childfree) at kid-oriented venues

[PlaygroundSusie]

Hi all - I’m childfree, so I hope it’s ok for me to post here. But I’d really appreciate some advice/perspective from parents.

My best friend and I are both 38. Met at uni. She has two children, DS aged 7 and a DD aged 3. She and her kids come as a package deal. She chooses not to socialise without them. This is because (as she’s explained) she wants to cherish every moment while they are still young. She works part-time and her kids are in loads of activities, so family time is vitally important to her.

I respect her decision and understand her kids are her top priority. I am also fond of her children and enjoy seeing them. The problem arises in where we meet. My friend never wants to stop at home. She always wants to catch up at very child-friendly venues. Usually playgrounds, but sometimes places like petting zoos, children's museums, festivals aimed at pre-schoolers, etc.

This means her kids are usually excitable, and easily distracted, and tend to race around a lot. Or they need help navigating the slide, or want to be pushed on the swings, etc. About 80% of my time is usually spent watching or helping my friend parent her children, and only 20% is us actually catching up and having a proper conversation.

On the very rare occasions we meet at her house, it’s much better. The split is more like 50/50. I happily interact with her children for a bit, but then they drift off to their toys, backyard, etc, and my friend and I chat. But unfortunately, my friend and her kids get bored at home, and prefer to get out of the house. Cafes are occasionally an option if it’s raining, or too hot, but otherwise they want the playground or some other place specifically designed for kids.

At the risk of sounding horrible, I’m tired of always catching up at child-oriented venues. I’ve been doing this for years, and there seems to be no end in sight. I’ve reached my limit. We’re catching up this weekend, and I suggested meeting at a café in a park (I figured we could maybe have coffee then go for a walk afterward). Her response was: “DS7 and DD3 would prefer to meet you at the playground. So, the playground it is – LOL!” Again, I appreciate her children come first, but I did find this a bit frustrating. Shouldn’t the grown-ups get to choose the venue?

AIBU? Is there a polite way I could tell her I’m sick of always meeting at child-oriented venues, and that I’d vastly prefer to simply catch-up at her house or a café? Any other suggestions? I feel like such an awful friend for feeling this way!

You're friends is obviously struggling with parenting but you are definitely not being unreasonable. You have been lovely and really patient but enough is enough. In my experience these people just take take take and this won't be reciprocated. It's OK to let this friendship cool a bit she might come back to you...but she might not. That's fine not all friendships last. Just suit yourself a bit more.

So what are you actually going to do about it?

@Fofftwenty21 have DM'd you.

Having read your updates I’ve changed my mind. I don’t think she’s a user and I do think that you need to stay in her life to support her when the kids are teens and there’s the inevitable meltdown when they make it clear that they don’t want to be smothered any more.

Her DH should be noticing this unhealthy behaviour and trying to discourage it. But perhaps he’s happy enough with the status quo if she’s doing most of the parenting legwork. Selfish but understandable.

In your position I’d probably suck it up for her sake tbh because she’s a decent mate in other ways and you’ve been close for so long.

I am actually starting to feel sorry for here children.

"She feels much happier and complete when they're with her."
Do they even get playdates in their friends' houses? As in, dropped off to play with their friends and the friend's mother watches them? Or does she attend those too, following them around the friend's house, never letting them out of her grasp sight?

She is absolutely suffocating them, and there are two extremes that OP's friend is opening up as possibilities for her children.

1. The child cannot operate independently because they're never allowed to so much as try. The fact that their mother won't let them out of sight leads the child to think it's because she's 'keeping them safe' and begin to wonder just what she's keeping them safe from. Their imagination creates all sorts of bogeymen, they start limiting themselves to their mum's restrictions. These timid children become adult in age, but infantilised. They're still living at home in their forties, single. This suits their suffocating mother.
2. The child rebels against the excessive presence of their mother, and feeling under scrutiny whenever at home. They become secretive about their school life, because it's the only life they have without her being there. They distance themselves emotionally from their mother, and may either go off the rails or leave home just as soon as they can. Mother starts wailing to their face how she feels incomplete without them, and drives child further away.

Obviously these are extremes, there's a whole range of possibilities in between. The point I'm making is - I don't consider her parenting to be that good. Parenting is about taking care of your children AND preparing them for their independent adult life. Instead, she's limiting their experiences to what makes HER happy. Her selfishness is not just affecting the OP, it's potentially affecting her children too.

@GreenClock Why should OP stay in her life to pick up the pieces?

Also, that might not happen. I've had older and younger friends and I've seen the older ones morph into "must stay at home in case the kids need me" when the kids are teens, as well as chauffeuring round.

If there's something I wish someone had told me when my friends started having children, it would be "don't make too much effort".

People are entitled to live as they want, so I'd not criticise this lady for those choices, but OP, I think it's worth being aware this might not change.

@hydriotaphia I've worked full time for most of my kids' lives. And socialised. Eldest is now 18 and we're very close. It is possible to keep friendships, work and be a good close parent. I divorced last year & lost a parent recently and my friendships kept me going. Friendships are very important, more so as your kids get older and you age yourself. Being a parent will always be my top priority but it doesn't have to be at the expense of everything else in my life.

I suspect it won’t last more than a couple more years, but feel your pain!

The offering to pay/drive is not about 'being a good friend', it's about controlling the destination. Also, if she had expected you to PAY! to go to the petting zoo, you'd have been more likely to stand up and say no.

Maybe OP, you were best mates for 20 years. 20 years is a long time, she's probably your oldest friend.

However - 'old friend' is not the same as 'good friend'. 'Old friends' are people you have a shared past with. 'Good friends' are people you have a shared present with. 'Old friends' can be 'good friends' too. But she is really only an 'old friend' now. She refuses to have a shared present, insisting on you attending her personal present. No sharing.

Since she has been her very good friend for so many years I think you are just going to have to be a bit more direct with her and tell her that you don't want to do these things every single time.

Who knows though, maybe she's always been this way and has always been the one who get her way and to take more than she gives?

I would find these meet-ups really tedious and boring but I suppose if you think she is and has been in the past a really good friend and don’t want to loose the friendship maybe you just need to put up with this for the next few years until the kids get a bit older and more independent and trips to the playground etc are no longer a thing

She is really going to struggle when they’re older and don’t want to spend every minute with her. It’s not healthy for all your identity to be wrapped up in being a mum.

After reading multiple threads on here about people going for a coffee with girl friends and bringing their 16 year old son or similar I'd worry it might never end.

I'd keep inviting her to adult stuff just in case but would probably write this friendship off. If people want to choose to only spend time with their kids that's fine but you need to be realistic about the consequences.

@GreenClock She absolutely shouldn’t feel an obligation to put up with this until the kids are teens - another 10+ years when she’s already done 7 - to support her mate. It’s particularly galling that you blithely say that the DH may be just happy to let his wife do all the parenting! God forbid he be under any sort of obligation as the father. Nope - the obligation as always falls on some random woman with no familial connection to the kids.

@EmmaEmerald You should post about this on the MNetters without children board. Name change was made to ensure that both childless and childfree are welcome, and I can’t see how anyone would be offended by what you’ve said here.

For me the nail in the coffin was when one of my mum friends brought her 10 year old daughter to a hen do meal and then started picking on everyone else for wanting to order alcohol as it was “setting a bad example”.

She’d been like the mum in the OP for years and we’d been putting up with it, but for whatever reason nobody thought she’d be that bonkers. I think she lost quite a few of her mates that night.

So yeah - this behaviour doesn’t always stop when the kids go to school!

Wasn’t that quite embarrassing for the 10 year old?

"On second thoughts, there's no point me tagging round the playground with you, why don't you take them there first and tire them out, then I'll meet you all at the cafe - say 4pm? Kids can have hot chocolates and we can chat properly."
For extra chat, gift them some little sticker/colouring books to keep them busy.

Wandering round the park while kids scooter/bike up and down is usually a good one for a chat too. Are they into scooters or bikes yet?

Not overtly - she was super confident and very happy to hold court and feel like a grown up.

Why don't you let her go. She is probably finding the friendship stressful too, but is too kind to say anything.

Blimey this is all about what SHE wants. Her attitude to not leaving the children is really odd. You have to question how long this will go on for and what you get out of the friendship.
I have a single best friend. She loves my kids. We did walks picnics occasional beach days sitting walking the kids play. Cafes outside . NOT playgrounds / soft play , petting zoos . These sound no fun at all for you.
As a friend she should make time to give you undivided attention .
Could her DH persuade her that he would like solo time with the kids to build their relationship? She either needs to do early evening drinks with you after the kids are in bed or you could spend time at her house so the kids can play safely whilst she chats to you without hovering over them. Does she ever give you her full attention?

It sounds like she is a dear old friend of many years and you have a great shared history but she is not a good friend now as she doesn't prioritise you and has no interest in catching up with you in your own right. You don't have anything in common anymore and that's not going to change any time soon. She is not a good friend for paying when you go to these awful places you don't even want to go to - it's the least she should do.

Would she be there for you if you got married and had your own kids, or if you had a crisis in your own life, if she can't even be bothered to give up a few hours with her kids to see you now?

'You should post about this on the MNetters without children board'

Great suggestion! Come and join us OP if you haven't already

Although to be fair, virtually all the parents on this thread have been horrified by how demanding the friend is being

JESUS CHRIST is all I can say to the story about the 10 year old at the hen do 🤦🏻‍♂️

That would do my nut in, and i say that as a mother of two!! I'd be saying, albeit a bit more polite than what I'm going to suggest....kids choice first meet up, second meet up adults venue choice and so on

Sorry....but I'm angry on your behalf

I think this might be how some of my friends vanished actually. I was probably seen as an obligation all along. It might be worth having that chat OP.