Manager saw my Teams message - AIBU

[Mumatwork24]

Need some advice please! My supervisor saw a teams message that I sent to my colleague (same level as me) and I just want others' perspectives on this situation.

Last year a secondment came up within the team that I applied for. My supervisor was supportive at the time, (she always is) and encouraged me to go for it. It was a promotion and would be the next obvious step for me to progress my career.

Long story short, the team manager and his senior (both of whom were on the interview panel) gave the job to someone internal from another team who was already operating at a higher level than me. Feedback was they thought I could have done so much better, they were frustrated because "they knew me" and it was just a case for me of getting through the interview. I'm exasperated because they loved the presentation, they know I already perform way and above my duties and am effectively a ready-made manager in this field - this was also what was fed-back. The person they employed as I mentioned was a few bandings up from me already but had no prior experience at all in the field.

Another secondment came up two weeks ago and was circulated to everyone by the team manager. My colleague and I were talking over Teams about it - I encouraged him to go for it as he is very skilled and like me, wishes to progress his career. He texted me back and said no, he wasn't ready for that jump just yet and that I should go for it. I replied that interviews are a popularity contest and that people employ people they think they can best work with, and as long as they've got the basic skill-set they can make it work. This is honestly what I think and it explains why, in most cases people choose individuals who don't have any experience over ones that do. It's all about whether your face fits as my recent experience proved.

He answered that I should go for it and I just replied "nah, they don't want me." Of course I wouldn't have shared these honest thoughts with management but it's genuinely how I feel and what I think. I've accepted that I wasn't the preferred choice, and that someone else was a better fit. I've not let it impact my work - I perform to a high level, I go above and beyond what's expected of me in this role and I make efforts with team socials and contribute to meetings.

Little did I realise, my line manager was sat with my colleague throughout the Teams exchange - he later told me she was reading over his shoulder and he only realised at a later point. She hasn't said anything to me but she does seem a bit down if I'm honest and I feel guilty. AIBU to feel this way? She's a nice lady and I'm lucky to have her as my direct line manager. But I'm not going to pretend I don't feel that way about interviews in terms of them being a popularity contest as that's clearly what they are. I've worked hard in this team and at the time I was upset as the rejection hurt like crazy but I've since realised it's not because of my lack of skill. The new recruit told me she's learning the ropes from scratch which is fine - but it just confirmed that they must think I'm a total misfit in their team, so I'm not going to put myself in the arena again. They'd just shred my application probably!

Am I being silly or am I justified? Has this ever happened to anyone else?

Thank-you

If I was her, I'd think my decision was right.

You’re scored in your performance at interview, that’s the only way to make it fair.
You didn’t do as well as the other guy.
Its unfair on your manager, who it sounds likes and respects you to make out you didn’t get the job for any other reason.

YABU.

Did you ask for specific feedback from the interview on what you can work on to improve or did you just assume what you wrote to your colleague?

You are being very unreasonable. Interviews are not a popularity contest.

It is very frustrating to interview someone who you really think could be a good fit for a role and they interview poorly.

You have first had knowledge of their work and they response to questions with poor examples and you know they have 20 better examples or aren't giving themselves credit for their work.

Fair interviewers cannot and shouldn't compensate for people who interview poorly. It says a lot about done one's judgment & ability to article important matters when an interview goes poorly. These are often skills that are required fir a step up.

Do you really think people interview candidates just for fun or because they think they might fit the role?

This one is on you. And also, tip for future, interviews watch the response of the unsuccessful candidates too & hugely admire those who take the disappointment with good grace & work on it & get on with their job. When people throw their toys out of the pram, it really is noticed and their behaviour casts doubt over their professionalism.

I think you demonstrated why you are not ready yet for the next level. It’s not just about doing your job well as you progress you need management qualities and you maybe you have some but you are lacking growth mindset.

You clearly did not take on board the comments after your interview and instead felt they should have contravened their own hr policies to give you the job - you are now acting immature and unprofessional and demonstrating to them they made the right decision because you are not ready.
It seems like your workplace is happy with your work and want you to move forward - I hope you now, after reading the responses on Mumsnet, give your head a wobble and find out what you can do differently for next time rather than blaming your failure on other people.

This.

I'd leave and find a promotion elsewhere. I don't think you have a chance here now. You've been quite unprofessional using the teams chat like this.

When I recruit, we have to score candidates on each question, write notes on what they say and this is written up afterwards and filed in case someone questions the decision. Regardless of what I know about a candidate, I can only score on what they say in the interview itself.

It sounds like you did not communicate your skills and experience well enough to be successful on this occasion.

You clearly have ambition, brush up on your interview skills and try again. Good luck.

I've been in a similar situation to OP recently with going for an internal role and someone else getting it who scored better on the questions than I did.

I know that they have to follow particular scoring guidelines for each question, etc.

But even knowing all that, I still felt the same as OP. The outcome changed how I felt about the role, the organisation, my commitment, everything. So by the time another role comes up that I know I can do standing on my head, am I going to go for it? Probably not. I'll be interviewing elsewhere.

i've been rejected for an internal promotion when then panel knew I could perform the role extremely well and on paper was arguably the best candidate. But you know what, someone else performed better on the day and scored higher so got the post.

It felt unfair and stung - i also had a few rants to friends about it. But, you then have a choice ....suck it up, dig deep and address the feedback with an open mind and give it a go.

Or sulk, refuse to ever go for a promotion again and send silly messages to colleagues about face fitting. They clearly wanted to give u a shot as they interviewed you AND were also disappointed you didn't sell yourself.

I've never got complacent about an interview again and you know what - have since been the candidate who got a role against other stronger (on paper) people so it was actually a good thing to happen to me in the long run

I would suggest you speak with your boss - he honest and say it really hurt BUT you are ready to try again what support can you offer etc.

It seems some people think an interview is an end in itself, as opposed to a means to an end. Interviews are pretty random, however scientific you try to make them (if they weren’t, no one would ever hire a duff employee). The main thing an interview shows is how good you are as an interviewee and how well you gelled with the interviewer on the day.

If you actually know someone’s work, and know they would do a job brilliantly, just hire them, regardless of how many ‘points’ they score on a pseudo-scientific interview.

OP, on the other hand, I think you should just keep applying for promotions, both internally and externally. It really is a numbers game if you are actually capable of doing the job. And, as for them seeing your honest opinion (which I tend to agree with), they just have to suck it up.

Agree with PPs. You performed badly at interview (lots of us do), didn’t get the promotion, have put it down to the panel (‘face doesn’t fit’). That won’t help you to progress, but that’s your lookout.

worse, you are impugning senior managers and your company to a colleague who might seek promotion. That’s unprofessional.

You've been given constructive feedback, but instead of examining your own behaviour and interview performance you've blamed the recruiters. You're never going to get anywhere with that attitude.

If you actually know someone’s work, and know they would do a job brilliantly, just hire them, regardless of how many ‘points’ they score on a pseudo-scientific interview.

And open yourself and the company up to possible claims of discrimination?

You seem to have misunderstood the feedback from your interview, and rather than admit or work on any failings you have decided to simply blame them and their lack of professionalism, their favouritism etc. and I think you’re wrong. They gave you the feedback you needed to improve the areas you need to improve in order to progress and you’ve chosen to ignore it. Instead, it’s everyone else who is the problem and they just don’t like you? That’s not how it looks. I know it’s easier than admitting you have places you need to work on for interview purposes, but you’re only hurting yourself in the long term.

Ok thanks all. To answer some of the points. I did welcome the new person to the team - my manager said it was nice of me to welcome her so he was pleased with my handling of the initial rejection. I did have a meeting with him where he gave me one-to-one feedback, he was supportive and told me about the STAR approach.

I do feel guilty that my line manager saw those messages - as I said in my OP. But she is lovely, and we’re on good, friendly terms. I am only human however and sorry but rejection is hard to take no matter what - yes you can learn from it but maybe it was also my error in going for an internal opportunity as I didn’t stop to think about how I’d feel if I didn’t get it. My performance is not affected, m working harder in this role than some others in the team at the same level. I’ve even asked to take on extra overs of work recently and my line manager told me this week I’m doing enough. But………I am not a robot. What didn’t help is that my line manger told me later on after the interview that the successful candidate was well liked and the interviewing manager was very influenced by others and her name was “around.” So I still think there is some degree of “who you know,” rather than “what you know.”

Thanks to everyone who has replied.

That's a weird, bitter and self-defeating response. You said the successful candidate was already working at a higher level, so why are you now saying it's a popularity contest? It's rude about him and needlessly negative about your own prospects.

It is perfectly understandable to be hurt and angry but after that, it's about how you look at it. You can either keep being angry or own the fact that on the day you didn't perform as well as you could and put in steps so that next time you are successful. Don't hold on to the bitterness.

@ImCamembertTheBigCheese ,

Which never come to anything at the interview stage..

Are you seriously telling me you would rather employ a pig-in-a-poke than an excellent employee who you know will do a job brilliantly?

Interviews are very blunt instruments.

Very odd follow up post, all the I’m only human I’m not a robot, nonsense to justify unprofessional behaviour. They made the decision based on who performed best at interview and who had the skill set and they felt most qualified,this wasn’t you, thr other candidate is more senior and , got to several bandings above you already and performed better at interview.

being childish and deciding that can’t possibly be the case it’s some form of nepotism shows you in a poor light.

manger told me later on after the interview that the successful candidate was well liked and the interviewing manager was very influenced by others and her name was “around.” So I still think there is some degree of “who you know,” rather than “what you know.”

Perhaps they're well liked because of what they know. And perhaps they're more constructive and able to handle work knockbacks without taking it so personally.

Hopefully you can use this to work on changing your patterns of thinking about this kind of thing and develop your resilience so you don't close any doors.

Absolutely. People tend to be well liked due to a reputation for their performance at work. Get the job done, capable, go the extra mile etc, they aren’t well liked as they crack a good joke.

tne op is well off in her take and it’s her way of refusing to accept she was not best for the job at that time.

The other candidate was well liked and well networked.

Are you well liked and well networked?

A promotion is often not just about the technical skills but the softer skills - are you a good influencer? Can you work well with others? Can you lead and manage? Are you a team player or a solo operator?

Don't make the mistake of thinking that being a star performer in one role is enough to get you to the next.

It sounds like you gave the attitude and work ethics and potential to go further but not necessarily the skills to get their immediately? Have you got a mentor that could help you refine the interview skills and guide you in any overall sense rather than just concentrating in your current role.

@Jf20

Get the job done, capable, go the extra mile etc

I have been assured I do all these things.

What didn’t help is that my line manger told me later on after the interview that the successful candidate was well liked and the interviewing manager was very influenced by others and her name was “around.”

Networking and getting your name out there is part of building your career and your reputation, though. You seem to go above and beyond in the actual tasks, but promotions and getting ahead is often about much more than that.

It's why a lot of threads on here about going to work social events encourage people to attend at least one or two a year - because it does help your career long-term.