Are my kids naughty or normal

[Jingledog]

I have a 2 year and 3.5 year old DS. Went shopping today and the 2 year was in pram wailing until he was given snacks and screeching at top of lungs.

3 year old wanted to do everything tap the card put food in trolley scan items etc when I did some too as he had a meltdown threw himself on the floor screaming and saying mummy I wanted to do it. Same in the next shop then running off after pigeons and not coming back.

Went for lunch ystrday with friend and who has kids same age they sat there nicely next to their parents at the table playing with some little toys and looking at books while mine ran loops around the restaurant cackling at the top of their lungs and wouldn't settle until I resorted to giving them screen time.

I have tried not giving in to them but the tantrums are extreme and long so sometimes give them what they want as my nerves can't take anymore.

Is it the way I've patented or is this normal behaviour?

I have a 3.5 year old boy - I wouldn't accept a lot of behaviour you describe. He's never given a screen so has never expected/requested that, and I don't do snacks so again he would never expect that. While tantrums of course will happen at this age, as the adult/parent you should be the one in control of the situation. For example, my son was getting upset in a cafe last week as he wanted a cake he had seen rather than the meal I wanted to order him. He started acting up and I made quite clear that if he didn't calm down and have the meal we would go straight home. He calmed down quickly and was perfectly behaved the rest of the meal. But he knew I meant it - I think that's the key, consistency in expectations and not saying things you don't mean.

But that’s the consequence - going home AND pissed off parent. That’s how they learn.

You have made a rod for your own back

They are too young for screens.

Do not give snacks to a child when he screams for them, no matter how long he screams or where you are.

If your kids are not able to find things to look at and discover in a new setting i.e a restaurant, they are too used to having entertainment done for them and need to learn to entertain themselves in ways that do not annoy fellow diners

@DriftingDora isn't wrong though is she.

...and in answer to your question, your kids are perfectly normal.

My children are well grown and gone but they never behaved like this. However I have some nephews and nieces who frequently have "meltdowns" and therin lies the root of the problem. These are tantrums not meltdowns, your children behave badly because ultimately they know its gets them attention or gets them what they wanted. The answer lies with you

Sorry but this is bollocks.

You also can’t just ‘march them out of there’.

Yes you can.

Every. Single. Time.

@Nounderwireplease thank you so much. The people saying strap a nearly 4 year old into a highchair and that my kids ruin everyone's days or we'll never be invited out again haven't responded with what advice they can impart or how old their children are getting on now?

@TeapotTitties how old are your children?

Yes. Try being a parent.

Adults - 3 of them so I've been through every single stage.

Why do you ask?

Rubbish. They have no boundaries because the OP doesn't supply any.

Dont take the screen time with you and then they cant blackmail you into giving it

I think it is normal but you must not give in to tantrums as that is just setting up for more trouble when they are older.
I don't care how much my DD screams, I won't give in. Like other pp's, I give 3 warnings and make it very clear what the consequences are. If DD ignores them, then I make the consequences happen. It could be going home, removal of a toy but I always follow through even if it ruins my plans.
You will find that after a few times of seeing it through, they will start to listen.
There is no need to shout or scare them. Just be firm. Short term pain now for long term gain when they are older.

You can't strap an unwilling 4 year old into a highchair, that is true.

So you either don't take them to restaurants until they're old enough to stop running around, or you warn them they'll go home immediately if they start.

And see that warning through every time.

No I wouldn't accept running around a cafe at all and wouldn't meet up with someone who did tbh.

But get creative- it's only a phase and this is where they're at now.

Meet up elsewhere more child friendly instead with stuff for them to do - go to a play area (fenced in one) with picnic benches and take hot flask so the kids can run around like loons. We mainly did outdoors to get the wriggles out when small. (And I was stingy about cafe prices tbh)

Wailing for snacks - next time go prepared with some snacks and have them ready. Look for triggers and preempt them. Have snacks and a drink and something to play with wherever you go. I had little "busy bags" and would get them to put a toy in and add a crayon or two and some pictures or plain paper.

I agree but I have tried talking to them and they don't listen I don't like to shout as I was shouted at a lot as a child and don't like to lose control it happens sometimes but scaring them is the only thing that seems to have some impact
You don't 'talk' to children that age in these circumstances. You don't shout either. You use a tone of voice that is very firm and making it clear you mean business.

If that alon doesn't work, you do introduce consequences. You tell them before going out what behaviour you expect. You then tell them what reward they can expect if they act well and what they consequences will be if they don't. You tell them you'll warn them twice but after that, the consequences will apply.

Iv done the 'we'll go home' and I had to leave my friend there and then. I didn't want to and felt bad , although my friend said I was doing the right thing. Massive tantrum but....after that, I just had to mention that event and the consequences for them to suddenly behaved. It was a pain then but the best investment for the next outings.

Actually OP, you're wrong in your last post, because most people on this thread are trying to impart their advice, it's just advice you don't want to hear. You are too soft on your children and you need to better enforce boundaries. If that means 'your' plans get ruined, then so be it (not that I understand the concept of 'your' plans when you're out with 2 kids). You need to set expectations and follow through with consequences. And yes, a nearly 4 year old can be forcibly made to sit on/in anything

I'm not sure why you asked about the ages of my children, OP.

All four of them are adults now, as it happens.

Is it relevant?

I don’t think your children are naughty, they are little and learning how to behave and it’s your job to teach them but that doesn’t happen overnight. I have 3 boys, they have always been been pretty easy to take out and about especially my eldest who is quite placid but they have definitely had their moments too.

Places like restaurants, tell them what to expect beforehand, look at menus ahead so you can order quickly. Have something for them to do, colouring, little puzzles or Lego, something to keep them occupied, include them in the conversation. Ask for some bread or breadsticks to come before food so they can snack. If they get up and run around tell them they can’t do that and why and that if they do it again then you will need to leave and follow through. You don’t have to shout and scare them but mean what you say.

Just keep being consistent and they will learn.

This is exactly the type of miserable, child-hating attitude I was talking about in my post. You’ve embodied this attitude perfectly!

This is exactly my experience.
My eldest two (both boys) were very well behaved in restaurants/coffee shops, and would happily sit for a couple of hours doing some drawing or sticker books.

When I saw other children misbehave, I used to wonder why their parents didn't "just bring a sticker book" 😳

I cringe now, because that smugness came back to bite me on the arse when I had DC3 (a girl). The interest in colouring or sticker books lasted all of 5 minutes, before she'd be trying to get down from the table, whinging, wanting to run around, tantrumming when stopped from doing so.

There's only a year between her and DS2, and he had to put up with being taken home countless times despite his behaviour being good.
She was just of a different personality, and definitely not ready for eating out as a toddler/preschooler.

Oh OP, we're going through this at the moment. It's exhausting. No matter what though, we never give into screen time. I've watched this play out with my nephew. He's now 9yrs old and just can't do anything without a tablet. You can get away with small kids having tantrums (lots of sympathetic looks all round) but when a 9yr old kicks off no one has time for that.

You have to follow through. When you say something you have to do it. Kids needs to be able to rely on adults to mean what they say - even if it's discipline. If you say you'll be there to pick them up for school - you mean it. When you say you're going to take them out of the park for bad behaviour - you mean it. There's no real difference. That builds secure kids. They know their parents say what they mean and they can trust it.

I knew that would be your answer.

Normal. They're 2 and 3. Well done for eating out with them, and going shopping with them both.

All the women on here saying you need to be tougher on them...bet they stuck their kids in nursery all day so never actually dealt with them in a day to day situation..😂