To leave my husband due to Tourettes?

[NewYearNoFear]

DH hasn't been diagnosed but he has verbal and physical tics, doesn't do them in public. But at home they've become quite extreme. Every 5 mins. He often says something quite dark about himself. He does it continuously in bed. My young DC now imitate him which is horrible

He isn't getting any help or advice. It's all down to anxiety and invasive thoughts and he seems quite depressed and tired. I want to support him but he is seeking no help and I find the tics v difficult. He isn't v supportive or interested in me but I think the anxiety and tics take up most of his head space

It's the kids (pre school) copying him that has really made me feel awful. Also he tics so much at night that sleeping or trying to sleep with a man shouting awful stuff is pretty upsetting. I know it's more upsetting for him but he just ignores it and gets v angry if I bring it up.

AIBU to just say I can't handle it?

The title of the thread is "To leave my husband due to Tourettes" but that's just OP's assumption. There are lots of possible causes of tics.

👌

With an he has going on, and the way you describe him, or sounds like depression will also be affecting him.
So feeling hopeless and powerless would likely be an issue.
I don't think you can be expected to live like this forever if he won't get help, but I would be sympathetic if he feels there is no escape or help available. So in your situation I'd want to try to understand what help he could get and get him to see it's worth trying, even if that meant showing him a ready made plan and saying it's this or I have to go, tough love style.
But someone really deep in depression would need to have the path presented and paved, unlikely to find the momentum alone, so I'd want to try that first.

OP I feel your pain as I’m also dealing with a DH I’m sure has Tourette’s. I did get him to see the GP years ago but they fobbed him off. We now sleep in separate rooms as I can’t cope with the disturbed sleep. If I’m awake when he comes to bed the twitching drives me insane.

His verbal tics are mostly grunts but in the past couple of years they’ve developed into the odd phrase but nothing outrageous. His physical tics are worse and grow more complex over time, almost like a little dance routine! He is able to suppress to some extent when at work/social but not completely.

I find it very draining to live with, the vocal ones especially. We also have a pre schooler but she hasn’t picked up on it yet. I’m actually more concerned about his safety when driving as a physical tic has him removing his hands and feet from surfaces and pulsing for a few secs, which is obviously not ideal in the car.

This binary position about him not caring less about the impact on his family isn’t helpful . MH difficulties impact different people in different ways. It’s possible that it’s his poor MH that has contributed to him struggling to feel empowered enough to seek help. It’s not always about the person being wilfully indignant. There’s not always a villain in these situations. It’s clear he feels shit about himself already.

That said, it would also be understandable for the OP to take steps to end the relationship or at least give him an ultimatum as the way they are living as a family isn’t sustainable.
OP should be assured that with the DH’s MH difficulties, there is zero chance of the kids being ordered by the court to live with him 50/50. The children’s safety is paramount.

Huntington's is chorea and definitely cannot be suppressed to only appear at home. Not all people with Huntington's have chorea. The chorea isn't tics or stimming. The chorea can appear tic like. Sorry to say but there is a lot of misinformation about Huntington's even within the medical profession and sufferers and their families often have to advocate as there is so much ignorance and misunderstanding.

I think you need a little sit down for a supportive but frank conversation.

1. Tell him that for your marriage to remain strong he needs to let you in, not shut you out. He needs to recognise the impact he is having on you and the children and he needs to be willing to seek treatment.
2. You are not sleeping due to being disturbed by him at night. Therefore he needs to sleep in the spare room until he is better.
3. He needs to book a GP appointment and tell the GP both about the dark thoughts and the verbal ticks when he is at home and in his sleep. He needs to say that this is having a damaging impact in his family - that you are not sleeping and the children are hearing awful things and mimicking him. He needs to ask for a referral.
4. Tell him you are going to see the GP yourself because the impact on you is so profound that you also need professional help.

I really feel for you. It must be hugely challenging.

Obviously you should judge if this is appropriate advice for your OH but could you film him/voice record him and send it to him?
Using the sort of pschology you can use with children (ie look in mirror at angry /fake tantrum face).
I set up a microphone next to my DP taking a nap(after 10th time of him saying he wasnt snoring) and then send him an edited recording(slightly amplified and with pauses deleted). He was annoyed at first but then started playing it and finally understands how disturbing the snoring is!
(He already had an apt I foisted upon him but was still denying the nap snores).

I know someone who says 'I wish I was dead, I wish I was dead, I wish I was dead', every day (she tells me). This is amongst other negative things about herself she either whispers or says out loud, when alone. You would never know if you met her socially because she keeps it in and then it tumbles out when she's at home.
If you ask her what she said, she will say 'oh, it's just my Tourette's' although she knows it's rather a symptom of her unhappiness with herself.

I googled NHS help for Tourettes and there seems little available, and what there is involves consultants, so will inevitably entail long waiting lists. Can you/he afford private help? What help is everyone talking about? There is no cure, magic or otherwise. In severe cases, neuroleptics can be prescribed, which will have severe side effects.

I understand why you want ro leave, OP, and it may well be the right thing for you.💐 But people are being unfair, blaming your husband for not seeking nonexistent "help".

Yes, you'd expect them to be slightly worse outside of home as more stress to control.

I see that you don't want to consider leaving him, but this is affecting you and your dc - and he's not helping himself. He clearly can't control his ticcing, so how will it get any better? He has to be responsible and seek medical advice.

And you say he's not interested in you. Doesn't sound like much of a marriage. And nothing will change if you don't do something.

He has no business getting upset when you go to the spare room, btw. You have the right to be able to sleep in comfort and peace away from his ticcing. He sounds selfish.

This is the most insightful post so far. There are comments on this thread which clearly demonstrate that some people have absolutely no clue about mental health issues. From what OP has said there is a serious MH problem involving the internalisation of anxiety and depression among other things. He may be feeling so despondent as to think he is beyond help, so has no interest in seeking it. Or he may be scared of what’s happening to him and feel out of control.

To suggest that he is acting out of selfishness or being wilfully abusive, or as one poster suggested, exaggerating his condition in order to control OP, is to minimise the effects of MH conditions on the sufferer. For some, the help that’s so easy for the rest of us to access may as well be a million miles away.

DS1 (23) has Tourette’s. He’s able to suppress his tics in public but it leaves him feeling exhausted. They’re worse when he’s stressed.

Those saying "this is not Tourette's" are presumably influenced by popular depictions of severe Tourette's.

Most people with Tourette's have a mild version which they can often control, and which changes in line with the mood of the person.

The symptoms can also come and go on a timescale of months, or fade entirely.

To quote the website below:

Treatment for Tourette syndrome depends on the severity of the condition. Most people with Tourette syndrome can manage their symptoms themselves, and tend to find a quiet isolated spot to 'vent' the irresistible tics and vocalisations they've been holding back throughout the day.

https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/conditionsandtreatments/tourette-syndrome

To be clear, I wasn't suggesting he has Huntington's and sorry if I caused offence. Just trying to point out to OP that, as he's not diagnosed, it's not really safe to assume that his tics are being caused by TS when there are actually a lot of potential causes, which makes his refusal to see the doctor even more unreasonable.

He isn't getting any help or advice… He isn't v supportive or interested in me

That’s why you want to leave him.

I think you wouldn't really know if he has tics at work or outside the house. I am sure other people have noticed. Did he have this issue when you married him? It seems a bit harsh to consider leaving him if so. Also if it is Tourettes there is a good chance one of your children will have it. Regarding getting help, I am not sure there is much of a treatment out there. I have heard that supplements such as Magnesium is supposed to help.

Then you don't know everything about Tourettes. How it manifests, and the severity, can vary.

Then he needs to go to the damn doctor. He can’t have it all his way. He’s beyond selfish.

Although I expect you vowed 'in sickness and in health, for better for worse' etc, this does not mean you have to put up with this. You have no professional experience in how to deal with a man with this condition.

The dark thoughts you just touch on are very concerning.

The fact he'll consider others and control himself when outside but will not control himself around his wife and children suggests you're the lowest on his list of priorities.

If the tics have come on recently, that can be a sign of a medical issue. There's a young guy who was on a learn to sing TV programme whose tics started when a brain tumour developed.

The children have started copying him which will affect them and how others are him.

He's expressing dark thoughts.

You're distressed and worried.

He's not thinking straight - I'd suggest you do what I did with my partner and make a doctor's appointment for him, present it as a fait accompli - 'the doctor will be calling to you around late afternoon' - and tell him that talking to the doctor is a non negotiable. There's something wrong. This can't go on.

Well tough shit if he gets upset. If he was willing to seek help then fair enough but he's not so you need to protect yourself.

Ds2 has tourettes and the verbal tics are constant at the moment but they do stop when he's asleep. He's severely autistic and not receptive to any talking or behavioural therapies so all we have to work with is alleviating triggers as much as possible and a bit of pharmacological help.

Your DH is not in his position though and needs to be seeking help to manage his anxiety. The therapies for tourettes also involve redirecting tics so they're less disruptive which can also help to break the cycle. I had tics as a young teen and they're very much like an annoying itch that needs scratching but the more you scratch, the more you itch.

I’ve not voted.

You can leave for any reason you want but it has to be for yourself and not your kids, because they’ll still have contact with him.

I have not voted for you to leave, simply because there are things you can try without being so extreme.

For one, sleep in the spare room - if he doesn’t like it then he needs to go and get help.

Secondly, after spending a few nights in the spare bedroom then give him an ultimatum- if he doesn’t then you have no choice but to leave.

At the minute it seems you’re making threats but not following through - I would have been sleeping in the spare bedroom ages ago.

If he is a good dad, you cannot take the DC and leave as that wouldn’t be fair.
So yes you can leave but you would need to leave the DC there, unless you discuss that it’s better for you to take them.

I would sleep in the spare room from today and see how you get on for a couple of weeks.
In the meantime, sort your finances out and figure out where you will live if push comes to shove.

It sounds like a very difficult situation and no one would blame you for leaving.
You have to put your happiness first.

Thank you. My observation of MN is that whilst posters are easily able to accept poor MH experienced by women, there is a real block in accepting poor MH in men which can directly lead to harmful behaviour. . More often than not it is solely attributed to abusive intent, even when there has been a diagnosis which inevitably impacts on behaviour. What you get are ignorant comments from many women stating that they have depression yet they don’t act in that way, etc. so MH has nothing to do with the man’s conduct. Bollucks. The disproportionate high rate of male suicide does not seem to make any difference to this refusal to see men’s vulnerabilities.

I agree.

And it’s probably why DH is having such bad ones at night as this is the time when he can finally let them out and probably why he has such dark thoughts as he’s not in control of his own body at that point, which must be terrifying.

OP I wouldn’t usually recommend but I wonder if setting up a camera and showing it to him the next day may help him see just how scary they are for you.

He is probably embarrassed and in a lot of denial but perhaps talk to him about a potential brain tumour or sudden illness as a PP suggested, rather than tourettes which going by these replies have a lot of misconceptions around.

This!
My DS has Tourette’s. If I ever mention it people ask does he swear. Well yes he does swear but it’s nothing to do with his Tourette’s. Having to explain to people that coprolalia in Tourette’s is one of the rarest forms. It’s what you see on TV because it makes good TV.
DS has moderate Tourette’s. He can suppress in public but will be exhausted later. If he’s stressed the tics get worse and harder to suppress.