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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ignore my managers rude text?

395 replies

Anon1359 · 27/12/2023 07:26

I work in Retail and have done for the same company for 12 years. The past year and a half the shop has had a new manager and her moods and attitude really affects the staff in the shop. She is very passive aggressive, if she is in a mood then my god everyone will know about it.

Anyway me and my DD who’s 4 have been ill this Christmas, I’ve worked all the run up to Christmas while I’ve been on my death bed because I didn’t want to leave them short staffed and you are made to feel awful if you call in sick. Don't know how I’ve done it but it’s killed me! I haven’t been able to move off the couch since Christmas Day and I need to rest, I’ve got laryngitis, a cough and flu symptoms and my little girl decided to add a stomach bug to the mix last night.

So I text my manager yesterday a nice polite text like I hope you’ve had a lovely Christmas sorry to text on Boxing Day etc but I’m really not well and my little girl is poorly so I won’t be able to come in tomorrow, to which the respond was:
‘I am with my family. Cover yourself!! You are leaving us short, can no one watch daughter’s name while you work?’

I am livid with her response, not even listen I know you’ve been so ill and still came in don’t worry about it I’ll get it covered. And regardless of my daughter I’m not well either!! So I put in the work group chat if anyone could cover me, the message was read and blanked by everyone but I did try.

My colleagues go into the shop at 5 to open for 6 so I’ve text the morning team leader as early as possible to see if they could try and get cover saying ‘I’m sorry I am really not well, I did try to get my shift covered but won’t be in’

To now I’ve just got another text from my manager saying ‘why are you off?? I’ve had messages this early saying you won’t be doing your morning shift and you haven’t got anyone to cover you? You were told last night to get cover. You will need to come and see me when you come back in tomorrow.’

I am honestly gob smacked, what do I even say in this situation? Should I just ignore her? Or will this make it worse? It’s barely even 7 o’clock and I’m on the couch crying because I feel so anxious, I’ve done nothing but work hard for them and I’m being treated like this! I won’t be able to rest now, I’ll just be panicking all day because I feel guilty and what’s going to happen when I go back to work.

OP posts:
AnneValentine · 27/12/2023 17:18

TheRealLilyMunster · 27/12/2023 15:47

I'm not sure it matters whether or not you have prior warning of the emergency, as long as it involves a dependant.

My daughter had an operation just before Christmas, and I needed to take a couple of days off work to look after her. I advised my manager as soon as I could, which was a couple of months in advance, and I took the time off unpaid with no issue.

Show quote history

Which is at your employers discretion and not part of dependent leave for an emergency.

L1ttledrummergirl · 27/12/2023 17:29

In your place I would be asking for a copy of the following policies:

Dependents leave
Sickness policy
Grievance policy
Bullying policy
Disciplinary policy

Ensure you followed your process either written or previously established locally for calling in sick.

Raise a grievance about her messages, the threat to discipline you (she hasn't followed the process), and include the fact that you called the store, but no-one answered. Ask what the contingency for this is, it may be in the sickness policy.

She is out of order.

Easipeelerie · 27/12/2023 17:48

Abitofalark · 27/12/2023 15:45

You've had some good and some bad suggestions as to what to respond - the difficulty is in knowing which is which.

Ref your suggested response: ‘Hi name sorry to message you again I did try to ring the shop to speak to you but no one answered. I definitely wont be in today I am really unwell and i need to rest. Thank you’

I would take care not to undermine your position and the strength of your message, for example, by apologising. (You were ill and gave her advance notice in order to be helpful.) So I wouldn't put 'sorry to message you again' or 'Thank you' at the end. They're not wrong things to write - polite. yes but not strong. And her messages have been angry and disrespectful, if anything requiring challenge rather than appeasement. I would not put 'Hi' but 'Good morning' or Dear X', as slightly less casual, more formal. She's your manager, so...

Again when you say you are unwell it's a plain statement that isn't wrong but stating in what way you are unwell would strengthen it, as 'unwell' is not specific but rather vague and could be a cover for anything. If you said as you did in your opening post what symptoms you are suffering from, that is stating something that comes across as more actual.

Adding 'and I need to rest', weakens it as if you aren't actually unwell, because unwellness or illness is incapacitating and makes you unable to work - if you are ill it is obvious you need to rest but unwellness is more serious than that.

Please try not to worry but do telephone ACAS as they are there to advise on employment practice and problems; it is a free and confidential service.

And do not rush to give up your job which you have held for 12 years unless it is for one with better pay or conditions or promotion. When you go back you can raise it with higher management. Know your value to the company and your rights in law to be treated reasonably. She may not last long if her conduct towards a valued longstanding employee, or staff generally, would embarrass them in front of an employment tribunal. Or she might leave of her own accord anyway if she's not managing well and is unhappy. That often happens with poor managers.

Useful info here.

WashItTomorrow · 27/12/2023 17:53

TheRealLilyMunster · 27/12/2023 15:47

I'm not sure it matters whether or not you have prior warning of the emergency, as long as it involves a dependant.

My daughter had an operation just before Christmas, and I needed to take a couple of days off work to look after her. I advised my manager as soon as I could, which was a couple of months in advance, and I took the time off unpaid with no issue.

Show quote history

No, that’s not right. It has to be an unforeseen emergency for dependant’s leave. For a child’s operation, like you mentioned, it would normally be annual leave you need to take off.

Original poster
Anon1359 · 27/12/2023 17:55

Thanks for all the replies everyone. It is her job to get cover for me, never been asked to cover myself the whole time I’ve worked there, think she was just being unhelpful and arsey because she can.

I am in a union for everyone who’s mentioned it, I will wait and see what she wants to talk about when I next go in, then will contact them.

Shes just very difficult to deal with, I have contacted the union before over her, as I was signed off by hospital and GP last year when she first started for 5 weeks and she was messaging me that it was down to her own personal discretion whether I will get statutory sick pay for being off and that my absences may be unauthorised! A long with the constant daily harassment of texts asking if I’ll be ready to come back any sooner!

Definitely going to start looking for a new job now, should have gone after the first instant but I love my colleagues just the management is shocking

OP posts:
Howbizarre22 · 27/12/2023 18:07

You have a paper trail of harassment evidence if you end up leaving your job because of her or if you decide to report her. Please consider you would also be helping all the others who she will be bullying now and/or in future too.

TheHumanSatsuma · 27/12/2023 21:23

You are entitled by law to have someone with you in any meeting. This doesn’t have to be a union person. You have the right to pistpone a meeting if it is not convenient/you haven’t got someone with you.
From now on, any message you get, phone, verbal, face to face or online follow it up with an e-mail clarifying what has been said.

WashItTomorrow · 27/12/2023 21:29

TheHumanSatsuma · 27/12/2023 21:23

You are entitled by law to have someone with you in any meeting. This doesn’t have to be a union person. You have the right to pistpone a meeting if it is not convenient/you haven’t got someone with you.
From now on, any message you get, phone, verbal, face to face or online follow it up with an e-mail clarifying what has been said.

No, that’s not right. It depends whether it’s a formal or informal meeting. An informal meeting, there are no rights to bring someone with you.

Maze76 · 28/12/2023 17:41

She works in retail, stores are generally open.

Beverly990 · 28/12/2023 17:42

It's the managers job to manage and covering for ill staff is part of management. If she's acting like that go above her head. It'll be the reminder she needs to wind her neck in.

Londongirlx · 28/12/2023 17:48

It's your Manager's job to get cover, you complied with your end, that is, letting them know you were unable to work, due to illness.
Don't worry about work, concentrate on getting better

Islandermummy · 28/12/2023 17:51

Tryingmybestadhd · 27/12/2023 15:03

Hand in your justification to HR . You should t have contacted anyone on days off . That was rude .

I disagree with this (but accept it might depend on the job etc). If I was relying on a colleague to be in, I'd want the earliest heads-up possible that they might not make it. Calling in sick on the day is obviously ok if unavoidable but more of a headache than if you have more notice.

Manager can either (a) ignore her work phone when she doesn't want to be disturbed or (b) forward the message on to anyone that ought to be dealing while she's on hols...

Actually ironic isn't it that the manager clearly hadn't arranged cover for herself so that someone could deal with staffing issues while she was on hols!

Hilsberry · 28/12/2023 17:53

In my line of work texts were not accepted. You had to lift the phone and call in sick but that’s maybe how different organisations work. If you are ill you are ill. You can’t work and you will only spread the bug to other work colleagues. I wouldn’t feel threatened by her wanting to see you about it. What does she expect? You organising your own cover is a real cop out for her. She’s a manager that’s her responsibility. I was a manager. That was my responsibility. If you’re ill your conscience is clear. If you lose your job you can take her for unfair dismissal.

Topi226 · 28/12/2023 17:55

Do you work in next by any chance? I used to work for them and it sounds exactly like them.
Do not worry about it at all. She gets paid to deal with it. It's her job to have the stress. Not yours. Just look after yourself and your daughter

rchblf · 28/12/2023 17:56

Keep all messages and anything else documented. Self cert yourself off work ill to get a rest. When returning if the issue cannot be resolved at store level then seek advice from head of h.r dept.

Zerosleep · 28/12/2023 18:03

As a manager myself I can understand the frustration and the impact staff sickness causes, however it’s my job to support staff with their health and wellbeing and also my job to arrange cover. I think she is disgusting. If I were you I would contact ACAS and get some advice as to your rights as an employee. Her behaviour is bullying and aggressive.

Beemagirl · 28/12/2023 18:03

Firstly, sadly this is fine example of the appalling uneducated/untrained and uncompassionate behaviour which is prevalent in the UK retail sector.

Secondly, as an HR Consultant with 25+ years experience I can endorse the advice you’ve already received which says it’s not your responsibility to provide your own cover.

Thirdly, as a parent you have the right to unpaid parental leave if your daughter is ill.

Fourthly, you have the right to receive Statutory Sick Pay (if your company doesn’t provide company sick pay which almost never is the case in Retail) and you can self certify for 7 days before you’ll need a Fit Note from your GP.

Finally, you have 12 years service and therefore full employment protection (gained after 2 years service) and you will also be protected against discrimination via the Equality Act 2010.

DO NOT put up with this behaviour from your manager. Be polite but be assertive and if you have any further problems contact HR and ask for their bullying and harassment policy. Raise a grievance and hold them and her to account.

Please be reassured you cannot be dismissed for anything you have stated here.

Now rest and get well and ignore any texts you receive from work until you’re fit for work.

Katbum · 28/12/2023 18:06

‘Hi manager - I’m concerned your response breaches employment law and duty of care towards employees. Please arrange to have HR present at the meeting. Please do not contact me again until I inform you I am well enough to return to work as your messages are causing stress that is making my illness worse. I will provide dr certification should I be off for more than 7 days.’

MrsChambers40 · 28/12/2023 18:07

Time to walk away from the company or at the very least to report your manager to HR. Disgusting behaviour! Hope you both get well soon!

LlynTegid · 28/12/2023 18:08

Managers who cannot manage people well are not confined to retailing. Too many are promoted because of their knowledge or skills in other areas, references from previous employers are not worth much (indeed I think some are positive to help someone leave).

Hope the union can support you OP.

Supersares · 28/12/2023 18:09

Ugh I hate bosses like this. If they’re like this they’re basically not up to the job and should do another job.
Does she know you’re ill too?
If you have Laryngitis are you able to get a doctors note to cover yourself?
Sending healing wishes and hope you and DD are feeling better soon x

Jumpingthruhoops · 28/12/2023 18:10

If you're in a customer facing role, trust me, customers on the 'shop floor' would rather staff didn't bring an illness into work.

InvestingMimi · 28/12/2023 18:17

I had a nasty winter bug last year the week before christmas I rang in to say I was sick on the Monday morning my boss called be everyday after that first day to find out how I was, three times on face time on the last occasion I saw him writing notes when I challenged him about the note writing claimed he was supposed to do so and to check the sickness policy which i did. It said no such thing, you ring in once, say when you expect to return if you dont then ring again, if your period of sickness exceeds 5 days that you self-certify get a sick note from your GP. Needless to say I wrote him a stern email telling him how intrusive his calls were, how bad they made me feel and highlighting the relevant sections of the policy for him. He apologised through gritted teeth I think largely because i copied in our director.

TerfTalking · 28/12/2023 18:18

DustyLee123 · 27/12/2023 07:30

Stop mentioning your daughter, YOU are off sick, you can’t work.

This! The correct text would be “I won’t be in, I have laringitis”

Trainingfairy · 28/12/2023 18:19

Don't over escalate this and be aggressive before you need to; nothing will be achieved by getting combative about the way she handled this, be the better person and don't give yourself extra stress by having to deal with more hassle.
Leave it for now and formally report sick in the morning. Don't be either chummy or aggressive in your message or even apologise - you can't help it; just state that "following my earlier message on xxxday, I confirm that I am still unfit for work due to xxxxx and am therefore self certifying my absence due to being unwell. To ensure that I don't breach the Company's sickness absence reporting procedure would you please send me a copy of the Company sickness policy and process.
Additionally, my daughter is also unwell and as I have no one else available to care for her at this time, I will also need to take compassionate leave to which I am entitled . Would you please also let me know the reporting procedures for this so that I can ensure this is managed in accordance with my statutory right to do so.
I realise that this is inconvenient but I am not currently fit for work and will keep you updated regarding my return to work.
Regards etc...
And you might find this link useful re compassionate leave:
https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/time-dependants-compassionate-leave#:~:text=You%20have%20the%20right%20to,for%20taking%20it%20are%20genuine.
Oh and while you're off work, spend time looking for another job; don't jump ship until you've secured one and leave when it suits you, not when your manager wants to try and fire you!
Good luck OP and concentrate on getting you and your child well.

Time off for dependants (compassionate leave)

You have the right to take time off work to deal with an emergency involving someone who depends on you. This is sometimes called 'compassionate leave'. Your employer can’t penalise you for taking the time off, as long as your reasons for taking it are...

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/time-dependants-compassionate-leave#:~:text=You%20have%20the%20right%20to,for%20taking%20it%20are%20genuine.

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