To hope that it doesn’t have to be like this?!

[Switchingoff]

I will probably be flamed for this as a non parent but it’s a genuine q.

Spent Christmas with 4 kids on DP’s side, ages ranging from 9mo to 2.5 (and their parents).

It was absolute non stop them clinging to or crying for there mummys, not listening when told they couldn’t do something dangerous etc (obviously mostly applies to the older ones), being super picky about food, who fed them, where they sat etc, waking up multiple times a night, parents getting pissy if anyone dared to so much as breathe too loudly when kids were napping / had gone to bed etc. Everything (Christmas meal, present opening etc) had to be timed around their completely different nap and meal times. Every possible source of light that might come under doors had to be removed. Parents had to stay with them once asleep or they would cry when they woke (several times a night) - largely applied to two of the under 2s. Or in another case spend an hour putting to sleep.

It was frustrating, exhausting and somewhat ridiculous tbh.

im sure when we were kids we had to go with the flow a bit more and would often just fall asleep in a room full of people and be put to bed when adults went up?

currently TTC but tbh this is putting me off! Does it have to be like this or can you parent differently?! Since when did EVERYTHING revolve round the kids and since when were they so unresilient?!

Oh my god this is mortifying to read. I'll never understand non parents getting up on their high horses????? These children are all TINY. Dear Lord 🤦🏻‍♀️ ear mark this thread so when you come back to it in 3 or so years time you can have a smile and a sigh at your parental innocence!

(i'm being quite generous there with 'innocence', I hope you didn't show this judgement to your family as it will be you one day!! Don't be put off though - you'll love them so much, you won't mind doing it)

I don't think you're wrong actually op and I had 3 under 3.
Yes they could be nightmares occasionally but I wouldn't let it spoil everybody else's enjoyment. The best advice my mum gave me was not to tiptoe around when they were napping eg to vacuum and watch TV or whatever. It's not realistic to keep a household silent when a little one is sleeping.

This sounds completely normal given the very young ages of the kids tbh. Definitely think carefully about whether you want that lifestyle!! My kids are 7 and 3 now so it's easier but this Christmas period hasn't been without it's stresses!

I sort of agree! I think a lot of grace needs to be given to parents of toddlers and younger at Christmas time, but agree that a silent house when they're asleep isn't always the most helpful in the long run. Unless of course the kid is on a hair trigger and the parents haven't slept in 4 days, in which case I don't blame them for a second!

4 kids? The oldest was only 2.5? Christmas? Over-excitement?

Sorry, that sounds well within the realms of utterly normal.

Then they very quickly get older and it calms down.

That works for some children and not others - despite what people say about younger children having to get used to the noise, it was my younger who only napped well in a quiet cot, and my elder who napped best in a pram or on me but would happily do so among chaos. They were both pretty hard work if they didn't nap so in both cases I did what I needed to to get them to sleep.

They are very young and likely over excited, over tired and out of their routine surrounded by more people and activity and different meal times to usual so of course they are not behaving like little adults. You should probably not have kids. Sounds like you are not ready.

OP, take no notice of all these wet lettuces. Our kids used to fall asleep in the corner of parties and get put to bed when the adults went. Of course that's not a good routine, but once or twice a year it's fine. A friend of mine got some very good advice from her mum when she became a parent: "Remember, this baby is moving in with you. You're not moving in with him."
People are too precious now.
"Ooh he's having a growth spurt. This nap must last 1hr 13 mins or forget about it."
You can do it differently if you wish.

So you thought babies and toddlers should adapt to suit the adults?

I sort of agree with you. However, parents are far less relaxed now about being a parents than my parents generation were. Parenting as a verb didn’t really exist then, people didn’t feel like their every move was being watched and judged by professionals and other adults. They didn’t have psychologists telling them their every move would wind up with their kids in therapy for life.

Its no surprise really, with all of that going on, that modern-day parents are a lot more stressed about everything being just-so for their offspring.

Wet lettuces 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

(quite mean when talking about stressed parents just trying to do their best, but a funny phrase nonetheless)

You absolutely deserve to be flamed for this thread.
Jesus Christ.

To try and be a bit more helpful for OP: four under 3s on Christmas Day is quite an extreme situation. You weren't seeing what their lives always look like, and they may also have been finding a lot more joy in it than was apparent to you. I have a 5 and a 2 year old and I'm sure I have friends who think my life looks like chaos, but I wouldn't have it any other way 🙂

YABU about the kids, kids of that age are like mini drunk tyrants on a bad day. Their behaviour sounds totally normal.

The parents, not so much. I don’t think I got pissy with people or blocked out all light for example and I wouldn’t have expected people to time their day around my toddlers, if they are asleep so be it and they mostly napped in a buggy or playpen in the day, so normally quite light. So I think the parents sound a bit highly strung. But my kids on the whole slept decently at night (and by this OP I mean slept in 4 hour stretches between about 6 months and 1.5) so I could probably be a bit more relaxed about daytime naps/ routine.

Ya bell 😂

I know, you're right, bit mean, and I know how stressful it is at times, but some people set themselves up for stress. If you bring a baby into a home where you can hear a pin drop you'll never know that baby's tolerance for noise. We had one kid who slept through vacuum cleaning and one who was a bit more sensitive. But horses for courses. People set up such rules before they've even explored.

All children are different but it's possible that these four were all bit more sensitive than average. Combine this with being away from home or having lots of other people in the house and the over stimulation of Christmas and it's more likely than not to end up as the situation you describe. Parents were probably a bit stressed too which could have made it worse.
Christmas with very young children isn't that enjoyable to be honest. It gets more fun from about four onwards.

So you'd neglect the needs of your small children so much (while getting hammered) that they'd end up falling asleep where they stood out of sheer exhaustion?

Great 👍🏻

No. We're not monsters. We put some straw down in a corner of the room for them.

Yes all that can happen. Hopefully not all at once.

Neither of mine were good sleepers. Ds is 12 and now loves his sleep. Dd is 19 and still struggles. Both took ages to fall asleep. Ds stopped that sooner than dd.

Both have had picky stages, despite their dad being an excellent professional chef and our household having influences of 4 cultures so are lots of different food when weaning and young toddlers. Still developed picky food habits at one point or another. Both now will try anything and everything.

Both been through clingy stages.

Christmas ramps all this up. I was lucky. Dd was the only child in the family until she was 7 so Christmas didn’t involve lots of kids and Boise which can be over stimulating. Ds’ excitement always peaked on Christmas Eve and he would fall asleep early, sleep late and be chilled out on Christmas Day.

And yea lots of families will plan around the kids naps.

Imagine your child hasn’t slept well for, possibly, years, the child is going through a clingy period. They are hyped up with excitement for Christmas making it all worse. The stress of having a nice Christmas is making worse. The stress of getting everything ready for Christmas whilst the kids get more and more excited. The stress of being embarrassed your child is being difficult. Then imagine the person without kids being sure this is all the parents fault and they think kids should just be better. Because they are sure they were better.

I am sure when you were a kid you had tantrums. Or other kids in attendance did and you just didn’t register it.

It’s not your fault you think like this, you don’t have them. I remember when my second child was born he sat next to me one Christmas and said ‘you know, I was a much better parent before I had kids. Just in my head I was sure i would do it better than my friends. I didn’t realise how hard it is and what you will do for 10 minutes peace’

And that sums it up for me.

It’s because those are all babies, not kids! The eldest ones ok are toddlers but same applies.

Their parents are at the absolute coalface, most difficult and physically trying part of parenting.

Spend Christmas with school aged kids (ideally 8+ 😂) or teens, and it’ll be a different experience. Not 100% easy of course as they all have their little ways, but it wouldn’t impinge as much on your experience as a fellow guest.

The other thing is, that’s babies don’t read parenting books. They don’t know how they are meant to react. You can do everything ‘right’ and the baby still doesn’t respond as you expect.

im sure when we were kids we had to go with the flow a bit more and would often just fall asleep in a room full of people and be put to bed when adults went up?

Your memories are probably strongest when you were 7+. These are babies/toddlers!! I'd be really surprised if you remember what bedtimes and parties were like when you were one.

It is really relentless at those ages. Yes they wake up in the night. Yes you end up doing a lot of faffing about to get the nap right, because it might help them not wake in the night (or for bedtime not to take 1+ hour) no, they haven't learned impulse control/any discipline yet so you have to repeat yourself (a LOT).

Age 4+ is much easier in terms of them being much lower maintenance.

<puts note in diary to advanced search OP’s name in December 2025>

AIBU to expect SIL to keep her children quiet while my PFB sleeps?
AIBU to expect MIL to prioritise my DC over SIL’s when handing out presents?

The first comment absolutely nailed it. Nothing else needs to be said really.