To think women who enjoy choking during sex should know the risks?

[ImTheGoat]

In a different thread the topic of choking during sex has come up repeatedly. Some women say they enjoy it and it's none of anyone else's business. Others have said it gives abusive men an excuse to hide behind if and when they murder their partners- see here for some tragic stories but bear in mind they're upsetting https://wecantconsenttothis.uk/

My own point of view is that choking during sex is dangerous. Study after study have pointed out that it can cause death or lead to brain damage. It's easy to find this information online but here's an article about it https://www.webmd.com/sex/what-is-sexual-asphyxiation I do think people should be able to do what they want sexually if it isn't hurting anyone. But I also think people should be aware of the risks. In the other thread people who raised any objection to choking during sex were called "pearl clutchers" or "sex police." AIBU to think no, knock yourself out if that's what you want to do but at least acknowledge it isn't a safe sexual activity?

I am submissive and one of my favourite things is being strangled or choked during sex. I have never had a tap fail, or I just push their hand away if it's a bit much. My DH enjoys doing it to me too, but I was the one who initiated it. I wouldn't use anything else other than a hand or it could easily go wrong.

I don't think it's smart to do it in a new relationship or one night stand or similar, but with someone you trust it's absolutely fine.

I personally like it and get off on it and I don’t know why 🤷‍♀️. But I wouldn’t just do it with anyone, only someone I felt safe with. It is something we discuss before hand and if I wasn’t comfortable with them there is no way their hand would be near my throat. Most of the time it is me that initiates it, by bringing their hand up to my neck. A lot of people on here are very kink shaming, just because you don’t understand or could imagine liking it it doesn’t apply to everyone. I understand the risks involved and have questioned why I like it numerous times but I do and have someone I’m comfortable doing it with and they are one of the softest people I have met, but we can just switch into and out of these roles.

This speaks absolute volumes of your limited knowledge of what sex can be.

And the fact that the 'kink community' need to continually promote this view of 'non-kink' sex (and you do hear it all the bloody time), presumably to try to keep people from leaving the 'kink community', just makes me think that it actually is a quite pernicious 'community' after all.

I’m in the “genuinely want to know how people make it safe” camp. Your posts are contradictory. You’re saying if you feeling oxygen deprived you could just tap. But you’re saying safe words are not for when it’s unsafe but for other reasons, which to me is confusing given the term is “safe words”. You advise you’ve had to do that during this practice. But not because it became unsafe? So I don’t think it’s unreasonable to try to understand your practice should it become unsafe.

It’s really worrying. It seems if two people know each other very well and can communicate very well and know pressure limits very well it might be ok. But I seem to recall that the deaths often weren’t relationships at this level of commitment. Smack someone’s arse long after it’s stopped being fun and it’s assault. Strangle someone long after it’s stopped being fun and it’s not possible to signal distress and death will ensue. And no one who enjoys it has yet to explain how they reconcile this problem.

The women on that thread did know the risks, though. You just couldn't accept that it was their choice to take them.

People do risky things for pleasure all the time, knowing that they might be dangerous. People who take Ecstasy know what the risks are. People who smoke know what the risks are. People who do dangerous sports know what the risks are. They are adults and it is their choice to take those risks.

There's a fair amount of kink shaming going on here

Good. We need to bring it back.

Why is anal sex a problem to you? If you don’t want it, don’t do it. But a lot of people enjoy it, and it is a normal sexual practice if you choose to participate.

Because teenagers, thanks to porn, now think it’s an everyday sex act. Because teenage girls are coerced into anal by pornsick boys, even though it hurts them. Because teenage girls in increasing numbers are having to seek help for severe anal injuries.

It not something that can be policed, what ever floats peoples boats sexually is fine if all parties consent, and if one of them ends up dead it's a risk they have consider

Sure, it was this one https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4966060-the-most-shocking-thing-youve-read-on-mumsnet

Elaine O’Hara was a very vulnerable woman preyed upon by a family man who got off on stuff such as this and murdered Elaine.
Thank goodness the curious Fishermen and young copper found the phone and other stuff dumped in the lake.

Otherwise he probably would have got away with it.
A very sad case.

Catza I'm not sure it's always accidental

@YeahIsaidit

Yes, because it has to be a binary choice between boring sex and being choked.

Do you not see how bad this message would be for a young woman without strong boundaries?

People do risky things for pleasure all the time, knowing that they might be dangerous. People who take Ecstasy know what the risks are. People who smoke know what the risks are. People who do dangerous sports know what the risks are.

These are all things people do to themselves. Being strangled relies on another party safely administering the risky practice.

Unless you’re Michael Hutchence.

Good point @NotBadConsidering

It should be illegal for rough sex and kinks to be used as a mitigation in a case where someone has been injured or killed. If you indulge in these activities then the perpetrator has to take legal responsibility for the consequences if it goes wrong, and that should include jail time. So the activity is not illegal, but the cause of injury through the activity is. The perpetrator is automatically at fault, not the person the activity is inflicted upon, regardless of consent.

That way everyone can get on with their kinks as they wish but in the full knowledge that if it goes wrong they will have no defence under the law. Perpetrators need to be the ones taking responsibility as they are the ones who are creating the risk. If they don't want the risk they don't indulge.

People who smoke know what the risks are.

I still think that, if it was common to drop down dead after a single cigarette - rather than it taking its painful and life-shortening toll over years - far fewer people would ever go near them.

There's a fair amount of kink shaming going on here

But anything can be described as a kink, and there has to be a line drawn somewhere, beyond which we are free to 'shame' extremely dangerous activities.

How do you feel about the 'nullo' communities, for example? Men who get a huge sexual thrill from having their genitals removed - not talking about those identifying as trans who seek to replace them with facsimiles of female genitals; just want to be completely 'smooth' down there and find it the ultimate sexual turn-on? Is it kink shaming to criticise that practice?

What about those who get an immense sexual buzz from the idea of being eaten (as in properly cannibalised, not a euphemism for anything ordinary)? Not just cannibal role-play but they actually want to eat another human or be eaten by one? Just a kink and anybody shaming them for that is the baddie?

@Winterknights has said everything I think about this issue. Women have been gaslighted into thinking they have arrived at this position voluntarily.

These are my thoughts 100%

Murder/manslaughter is murder/manslaughter.

Of COURSE you shouldn't be indulging in any kind of kink/bdsm play without first discussing it, making sure there are safe words/signs, knowing the risks.

But please, ffs, if it doesn't appeal to you, or doesn't get you off, then fine, but stop kink shaming other people.

As long as they're careful, what consenting adults do with each other in the bedroom is no-one elses business.

you DO absolutely 100% need to trust your partner, you never ever go whole hog into this kind of play, you introduce it slowly and test it out to see how you both react and its vital you stop when they say stop.

Never, ever, EVER do this with someone you cannot implicitly trust.

Utterly grim. And anyone whose husband or partner ‘likes it’ too is a walking red flag.

I am very biased on this as my relation was killed by this practice. So, please, please, if you take part in this consider if it's worth losing your life and the impact that would have on every one around you.

These threads are about as insightful as someone saying “I can’t believe some people like olives.”

I’m really, really over hearing that we shouldn’t judge people’s dangerous and antisocial peccadilloes. If you, whether you are male or female, rate the quality of your orgasms as more important than protecting women from being murdered, I judge you. You should be ashamed of yourself, it is an utterly shameful view to hold. And the women defending it on this thread are, in my view, complicit. Just as guilty as the men doing it.

It's dangerous. Nobody should do it. End of.

I get choked/choke people in ju jitsu every week and have never suffered any adverse effects.

I wouldn't train with anyone who I thought would try to choke me to death, in the same way that I wouldn't have sex with anyone who I thought would try to choke me to death.