Nightmare MIL-now shes stranded!!

[AlwaysAnxiousAnnie]

This might be a bit long winded but I'll try and shorten it down.

I posted before about my MIL. Basically she has long standing issue with alcohol. She will not stop drinking and she's torn our whole family apart in the process. Shes been admitted to hospital several times over the last 12 weeks because of her strange behaviour, symptoms. Theyv said she has alcohol related brain damage and alcohol induced psychosis, she was even briefly sectioned. She is delusional and delirious. She believes things that aren't true and even acts on these strange thoughts and scenarios in her head. For example, she booked and paid for a wedding for me and her son, suits, tiaras, all sorts. Holidays,hot tubs, puppies. She's turned hostile and violent. Assulating me, assulating her husband, criminal damage, causing a nuisance in the town, getting busses to towns 20 miles a day in her dressing gown and being confused. We've tried to get her all the help but social won't touch her and neither will GPs or anyone really because it's all alcohol induced and she's said she won't stop until she's dead. Her husband has been staying with us because the police were called loads of times and she is deemed as a risk to him. He's 75, shes 20 years younger. Anyway, last week she begged him to go home, all was fine for a few days, they booked a last min holiday that DIL paid for. The night before die to fly she kicked off and assaulted him, she was arrested and put in court but no charges b cause they couldn't "prove" and she maintained that he is the one that assaulted her. (Not true, she's gone through phases of going round telling anyone who will listen that we've all been handy with her,,including her son being in prison for assulating her lol) so he went on this holiday by himself. He was there four days and she decided to book her own flight and fly out there. She was there four days and the whole tim, she had been throwing bottles and smashing them, throwing her own shit at him, all sorts of stupid behaviour all because he's trying to reign in her drinking. You can't tell her, she never accepts responsibility or accountability for anything she's done and she's done some stupid shit! Its always everyone else's fault. So yesterday DIL flew back to the UK and left her there. We've since learned that they've kicked her out of the hotel for her behaviour, she's got no money. We've had the British embassy on the phone asking us to send money and book her a flight, she's at the airport abroad. she's lost her passport but they've said they will sort her some documents if we sort the flight. My partner has said no. He's not bailing her out anymore and she needs to accept responsibility (she's still maintaining that it's all DILS fault and she's done nothing wrong) DIL won't help her. I feel terrible and now we are all disagreeing because I'm saying we need to help her get home and they are saying nom she's made her bed and this might be the wake up call she needs. Thoughts?
The embassy have said they are speaking to the holiday provider about getting her home but we don't actually know yet what's happening, we've had no more correspondence. I do understand why my partner and DIL are so cross, she has put us through hell and back the last 12 weeks and each time she does something more and more extreme. She's caused us so many problems with police and social services (I have an ,18 month old) and we were safeguarded because of her coming to my house every day and kicking the doors in) . I know this is long but I just wanted to know what would other people do, how would they feel? I'm so upset

I get you, OP, and think you’ve done the right thing and behaved wisely in an impossible situation.

Models of human behaviour, like that of AA (they’ve got to hit rock bottom…), Al-Anon (you didn’t cause it…), or Transactional Analysis (Karpman Drama Triangle) are just that - models. They might or might not apply or be useful in any given situation. And these three would all count as pop psychology, rarely taken seriously by professional psychologists or substance misuse experts.

Despite what the shoutier “experts” on here say about needing to write off and abandon those they confidently internet diagnose as narcissists or irredeemable addicts and therefore beneath contempt, it’s not wrong to have compassion for another human being no matter how badly they’ve behaved or what choices they’ve made. Nor does it mean you’re playing the role of a victim or rescuer.

Often it is the case that it’s best to distance from a violent alcoholic. But doing your best to ensure their basic safety also isn’t wrong. As with so many things involving human beings, real life rarely fits into simple models.

Bless you for your concern, humanity and compassion.

Her husband's position was to support (or possibly even ask) the OP to collect his mother. There is no suggestion that the OP is undermining her Fil's/husband's choices.

OP said ''My partner has said no. He's not bailing her out anymore and she needs to accept responsibility (she's still maintaining that it's all DILS fault and she's done nothing wrong) DIL won't help her. I feel terrible and now we are all disagreeing because I'm saying we need to help her get home and they are saying nom she's made her bed and this might be the wake up call she needs. Thoughts?''.

People have given OP their thoughts, she is free to reject them. But criticism of a persons actions is not a deadly insult. There's really no need for a defensive reaction.

I'm sorry but even the heading of this thread screams out drama. You are extremely defensive to anyone questioning your motives, show a complete lack of respect for your father in law and husband's wishes, undermine their efforts to force her to get help and it is clear you are getting something out of all the drama of the situation. You even play the martyr by telling us all about guess who was lumbered with picking her up when that absolutely was not the case. Nobody even wanted you to collect her but you just wouldn't listen and that's on you, so please stop trying to justify your disloyalty and stop berating anyone else who actually has the insight that you clearly lack. The fact you so readily undermine your husband and don't respect his wishes actually demonstrates the mother in law issue is the least of the problems in your marriage, but you're probably in denial of that too.

Have you not read the millions of times I've stated that I was asked to go and collect her or are you blind as well as insensitive.

I’m sorry you are getting hassle, @AlwaysAnxiousAnnie

Its clearly an awful situation, there is no good or best outcome just one that’s not quite as bad as some of the others.

Well done for getting through it in one piece. I hope you all have a peaceful Christmas.

@AlwaysAnxiousAnnie frustratingly, far too many posters are too lazy to read OP's updates. I learned the other day that you can ask mumsnet to add a disclaimer on your OP to ask posters to read your updates before posting.

Here's a link to the thread about it.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/site_stuff/4963485-mnhq-asking-posters-to-read-all-ops-posts?reply=131501760

I think you did the best thing under the circumstances.

In case you missed it, I posted the below earlier today.

It's a shame that the authorities have deemed that she has mental capacity. My late BIL was an alcoholic, and because he could be violent it was enough to get him into paid residential care. He died as a result of his addiction. I would persevere with trying to get her into residential care, and stress how violent she can be.

@CaroleSinger you are the one looking for drama.

OP has been dealing with a very difficult situation. She has actually gone above and beyond. Although I think her decision to collect MIL was a risky one, I for one am glad that her MIL is now in the healthcare system, and I do think the fact that OP was involved may have made the process of getting that care slightly easier for MIL.

This thread has seen some nasty posts. We could all have done things better in crisis situations with the benefit of hindsight. Even if you have been in a similar position (as I and many people on this thread have been), each situation is different. I agree that OP should distance herself, which she has done after collecting MIL at the request of her family. How about some practical suggestions about how to move forward instead of tearing into her? OP is in an extremely stressful situation and posters should have a bit of awareness of that.

Good point @RampantIvy . Also, if posters don't have time to read the whole thread, they can always just read the OP's updates by clicking See All on the original post on any page.

I think a misunderstanding has arisen because the OP's DH and FIL appeared to be very firm in their resolve to cut off any contact or support, but then once MIL was back in the UK they have shifted their stance and asked (put pressure on?) the OP to collect her, but not offered / not been able to accompany her to do so. But now it appears that the whole family is on the same page in terms of not supporting MIL any further, so hopefully they can maintain a united front.

Either way, I don't think the OP is getting anything out of this dreadful situation, and she deserves our empathy, whether or not we agree with her decisions. We can't know for sure what we would have done in her position.

Not very fair that based on this situation alone you are now attacking my marriage and my apparent denial of my marriage. My DH ASKED me to collect my MIl. I did not go against him in any way.

Think youv done admirably op
Reading through your updates I can see it hasn't been at all easy.
You must be very weary.
I do hope things get sorted out.

Just let it wash over you- it’s not relevant to you. The OP has misread/misunderstood or perhaps views it through the lens of her own experiences which could be very different.

Don't engage with posts that don’t help you- life is too short, life energy too precious!

let it wash past. Focus on what helps you.

Just ignore that extremely unhelpful post.
It will be good practice in ignoring other people trying to push your buttons. (Is MIL likely to try doing so?)

The moment FIL booked those holiday tickets for himself and his violent, brain damaged, psychotic alcoholic wife, he set this ball in motion.

what did he think would happen? She was never going to sit in the shade, eating ice cream and doing her knitting.

Also, I don’t know why everyone is laying in to OP, who had no hand in this ridiculous situation in the first place.

When FIL decided to go without his wife, he should have hidden her bloody passport so she couldn’t follow him.

It is clear that this whole episode has been very difficult for you - especially as it seems to have reignited your own feelings relating to your mother's alcoholism. I'm glad that getting her back worked out OK - but please be careful about taking such huge risks with an unstable and violent alcoholic.

I hope that now she is in her home area you and your DH will be able to take a huge step back. I think you will need to be tougher as you can bet there will be new crises when you are called by police/hospital/social services who want you to take over responsibility for her - but you have to draw a line and say no to any further involvement. She seems to have had multiple assessments now that say she has capacity to make these unwise decisions.

Has FIL decided what he will do? Has he moved out of their flat? It is likely that the hospital will discharge her as soon as she is considered able or she will discharge herself to drink

When FIL decided to go without his wife, he should have hidden her bloody passport so she couldn’t follow him.

I agree that he bears some responsibility yet he & her son have absolved themselves but asked (expected?) Op to do what they wold not!

Where will she be discharged to?

If it's back home with a care package will FIL have to move out for his own safety?

@BrownTableMat the posters who were telling the OP not to go last night were mostly doing so from a position of warranted concern for her safety, as she'd described her MIL as violent and psychotic. Also, I don't think I've read a single post saying an addict is beneath contempt. The 'expert' posters you're talking about are people who have experienced a loved one succumbing to alcoholism and all they are doing is sharing their experience. They have no less compassion or humanity than the Op but bitter experience has taught them that you can't ensure the basic safety of an alcoholic who is determined to put their need for drink first and if you attempt it, you are likely to damage your own health and sanity.

I think that some people placing the blame on FIL are demonstrating exactly why male victims of DV find it so difficult to get away because so many expect the male victim to take responsibility for his abuser.

Yes some of his decisions may have not been the wisest - yet we hear time and again on DV threads about how it takes victims 7 attempts to leave.

So FIL may have been unwise to return to the home when the police had declared MIL a risk to him and unwise to book a holiday. But he has been assaulted several times in recent weeks and decided to get away without her. MIL obviously was well enough to navigate booking a flight, fit enough to travel and make the onward trip to the hotel without help - then she attacked him again with bottles and literal shit.

I'm sure that if a female victim of DV had managed to escape to a hotel in Spain after an assault, and her abuser followed and physically assaulted her with bottles and excrement that MN would not be blaming her and saying she should take responsibility for her abuser.

I agree that the OP should now step back and let her FIL and DH decide how to handle the situation going forward. The OP is clearly a very compassionate person trying to handle a v. difficult situation and protect her DH and his elderly father. But there’s only so much she can do-and I think you’ve done enough. 💐

Well for now she's safe, and you can all breathe a little easier knowing she is at least back in the UK. Well done for getting her to hospital safely, that was above and beyond given all that she's put you all through.

Wishing you and your family a peaceful Christmas, OP.

I meant lack of understanding as to how serious are the mental and physical health issues facing MiL. A family member died last year amid very similar circumstances and I’m shocked at the lack of understanding as to how much irreversible damage the alcohol will have done up to this point - mentally and physically.

If she has been diagnosed with brain damage and associated mental health problems, and has carried on drinking, the damage will have continued along with concomitant damage to major organs as well as causing various other health issues.

She has been admitted to hospital - presumably for management of withdrawal. This in itself carries risk -she will be vulnerable to seizures, further brain involvement and coma and will likely need care when she is discharged from hospital. Yet the expectation seems to be that in a few days the hospital will call to say she is being discharged and things will carry on as before. I suspect MiL is nearing end stage and the likelihood is that after withdrawal treatment her overall condition will be re-evaluated and the news won’t be good.

The OP isn’t undermining her husband. And she’s indicated several times that she was asked to go and pick MiL up. And she doesn’t lack insight. MiL is surrounded by people who very clearly do, because they don’t appear to have much appreciation of the seriousness of her physical condition or what comes next, considering that she has continued to drink long after the diagnosis of alcohol related brain damage. The majority of posters here don’t seem to have much grasp of the seriousness of the situation either, judging by the advice to abandon MiL to her fate. The OP obviously is aware of what’s happening and what needs to be done, because she made sure her MiL was admitted to hospital where she will get the care she needs, and hopefully input from the appropriate authorities.

If some of the posters on this thread had their way, MiL would be left to get on with it, and would probably die alone if she went into withdrawal with no medical supervision. MN has outdone itself with this one.

You are reading a post on MN. You don’t know all the details.

Yet the expectation seems to be that in a few days the hospital will call to say she is being discharged and things will carry on as before.

She knows more about the situation than you do, and her expectations are based on recent experience of her MIL being admitted to hospital and the hospital discharging her MIL.

Hospitals don’t always discharge people into suitable care.

It’s been adapted for MiL’s needs, so they can’t make her homeless.