The existence of Father Christmas is a lie that children shouldn’t be told

[maybein2022]

I’ve noticed on social media recently that a LOT of people are posting about not allowing their children to believe in Father Christmas. The rationale being they don’t lie to their children about other things, and it doesn’t sit comfortably with them to create this big ‘lie’. Some talk about how St Nicholas was a real person, some talk about how other children believe in the magic so they shouldn’t spoil it for them etc.

My eldest two are way past believing but it never occurred to me that it was anything more than a harmless story/magic that they would grow out of believing. But I now have a baby/toddler too (too young to understand this year) and wondering if we do the whole thing again.

We’ve always done stockings from FC as small, inexpensive gifts, and always done bigger under the tree gifts from us. A lot of the issue comes with of course not all children will get any gifts at all, and therefore it’s awful if they believe in FC and are disappointed or think they’ve been ‘bad’ (kids living in poverty with no parental money to buy anything, kids living with domestic violence etc). Also the idea that FC brings some kids big gifts and some just small.

So: (I am still on the fence anyway about it all)

YANBU: It’s fine, FC is a magical thing that it’s fine for kids to believe in.
YABU: A lie is a lie, kids shouldn’t believe in FC.

We will definitely be doing Santa. White lies have a place, most people have done it at some point and this is one of them for me.

My issue with Father Christmas is he's not consistent. Children are told they have to behave and presents correlate with how good you are. My DC have always had a small sack of smallish things such as stationery and PJs and then bigger presents from us. We went to stay with family a couple of years ago and they'd done a huge (and overflowing) sack for DCs cousins plus gifts from them. My eldest DC sobbed for the rest of Christmas day that she was naughty and didn't deserve anything. Absolutely no cajoling would make her touch any of her Christmas presents that year and I'm now in the bad books because I refuse to visit for Christmas again.

I love Christmas and we made a big deal out of FC coming every year, snow prints in the lounge, presents being sneaked out once everyone was in bed etc. We were always careful to make sure we as parents got the “big” things the kids wanted so they didn’t go about bragging that FC brought them anything they asked for, just little fun gifts.

A lot of this stems from my own Christmases as a child being absolutely horrendous. My Mum had schizophrenia and was an alcoholic and for some reason Christmas used to really set her off (stress, booze everywhere, emotions etc) and without fail every single year she would be taken off in the back of an ambulance, literally kicking and screaming, being sectioned for 2-3 months at a time when I was between the ages of 4-10. It was very, very hard and I have horrid memories of that time (I was put into foster care during those times, this was the 1980s and it was all very shit). But - you learn to grow up very quickly in those circumstances. Despite everyone around me at school getting excited about FC and him coming etc, I just knew that it wasn’t real and he wouldn’t be coming for me. I still had a nice time wherever I was, I was lucky in that all my foster situations were lovely and they always made a fuss of me. But I knew the whole thing was a bit of make believe.

I guess that’s why I went all out for my kids with the magic. Dd is now 20 and I still send her a portable North Pole personalised message from Santa 😆😆

It didn't seem to have any negative effects on four generations of my family. My mother, me, my children and my grandchildren have all survived the 'lie'.

@PuttingDownRoots this is my favourite post today and I agree with you. I believe in the spirit of santa claus too.

My parents told me Santa was merely the delivery guy back in the 80’s, so I did the same. Makes life easier as parents pay for the gifts Santa brings. For my kids they are all grown up now, I don’t regret Santa. It brought a lot of excitement - but then would they be as excited if it was a big pile of gifts and Santa didn’t bring them? Maybe.

We have had this chat in case we get asked why Santa brings some people very expensive gifts (this year a relative has spent £1000 on each of their children!!!). The answer we have is that parents send money. Luckily our kids are so young that they don't really know the £1000 are 3 VERY expensive gifts per child as they have no idea how much things cost. We do circa £60 - 80 each but lots of small, wanted gifts so I imagine the 1k children will feel hard done by with their 3

Same.

I knew my parents bought the gifts, or more specifically my mum bought the gifts, and that they "sent them to Santa" then Santa brought them back at Christmas.

When I figured out Santa as a person wasn't real, what had changed? Nothing. I already knew my parents bought the gifts.

I carried the same thing on with my DC, pet them all work out on their own that Santa is a concept rather than a person, and so far no one has needed therapy to help them recover from being viciously lied to.

When mine was little it was magical, she was so excited when Santa came, I also remember the excitement when I was a child, waking up to see the stocking on my bed.

i think the issue is if parents keep it going too long, kids find out from other kids at school , and of course will be roundly mocked if they think he’s real past about 7. So they know, but they feel obliged to pretend for their parents sake.

ive never really witnessed why did you Santa get you a better present than he got me, sure some jealousy , but never seen a child it to Santa being mean.

I read this the other day and I think it sums up how it is not all about the "lie":

Son: “Dad, I think I’m old enough to know now. Is there a Santa Claus?”
Not being the world’s fastest thinker, I stalled for a time.
Dad: “OK, I agree that you’re old enough. But before I tell you, I have a question for you. You see, the truth is a dangerous gift. Once you know something, you can’t un-know it. Once you know the truth about Santa Claus, you will never again understand and relate to him as you do now. So my question is: Are you sure you want to know?”
Son: “Yes. I want to know.”
Dad: “OK, I’ll tell you: Yes, there IS a Santa Claus.”
Son: “Really?”
Dad: “Yes, really, but he’s not an old man with a beard in a red suit. That’s just what we tell kids. You see, kids are too young to understand the true nature of Santa Claus, so we explain it to them in a way that they can understand. The truth about Santa Claus is that he’s not a person at all; he’s an idea.”
The dad continued: “Think of all those presents Santa gave you over the years. I actually bought those myself. I watched you open them. And did it bother me that you didn’t thank me? Of course not! In fact it gave me great pleasure.
“You see, Santa Claus is the idea of giving for the sake of giving, without thought of thanks or acknowledgement. When I saw that woman collapse on the subway last week and called for help, I knew that she’d never know that it was me who summoned the ambulance. I was being Santa Claus when I did that.”
Son: “Oh.”
Dad: “So now that you know, you’re part of it. You have to be Santa Claus too now. That means you can never tell a young kid the secret, and you have to help us select Santa presents for them, and most important, you have to look for opportunities to help people. Got it?”

Father Christmas is the personification of the spirit of Christmas giving.

Of course father Christmas is not real, but it's about making childhood magical if they believe in the spirit of giving at Christmas.

Growing up I liked the whole idea of Father Christmas more than I do now. It was quite simple then. You knew the bloke who gave you a cheap gift in a department store wasn’t FC. FC in our house only bought 1 big gift, everything else was not from him. We didn’t do stockings. There was a tooth fairy but we didn’t correspond with her, she just took the tooth and left money. Easter bunny was an American thing and so was Halloween. There were no Christmas Eve boxes, no Shelfy Elf. Naughty or nice was a concept but mostly just in that song about Santa, so American because we called him FC.

Basically, it’s overkill now and that’s why some worry about buying into it. I do see why, I’m surprised to say, but …. it’s hard to be that parent who doesn’t allow it

No, I’m not saying we should deny children the magic of Christmas, I was saying I’m not sure exactly where I sit with it. I’m really conflicted as, as I said, I loved doing it for the older two. I think where I might land on it is not to make a huge deal of FC, sure, do stockings and mince pies out etc but not go on and on, make sure I don’t use the good/bad/naughty/nice narrative and continue to buy Christmas treats and toys for food banks and so on. I definitely am not anti Christmas or anti FC. I suppose I’ve just been thinking more about how unfair life is for lots of children.

@Pigeonqueen I’m so sorry. Also daughter of an alcoholic. Lovely you (& me too!) have broken this particular horrible cycle with our own kids. Roll on the magic of Santa eh. As others have said, they’re little for such a very short time. Although I’m loving your Santa comms with your 20 year old 😆

I can't speak for anyone else, but that's certainly not how I felt about my parents when I discovered santa wasn't real 😐

I also love the posts that have said about FC being a concept not a person, eg acts of kindness, anyone who buys a gifts etc. ❤️

Exactly. Childhood is such a small but so significant part of our lives. We need to find the joy in it while we can. ❤️

Dear God. Millennials and Gen Z are a bunch of overly serious miserable fuckers.

Mine are 12 and 16 and still “believe” - basically each year they insist they believe then set Father Christmas (dh and I) a challenge Anneka style challenge of a random thing they want but can’t remember where they saw it. I swear they’re dicking us about. I was looking forward to playing the “Santa game” with dd1 who is now 16 but she’s talking about writing her letter at the weekend etc. I do love the magic of the story and the “just maybe” belief in magic.

I have one dc who is deeply unhappy that they were lied to, and tbh I didn’t enjoy the whole santa thing anyway. It’s been much more enjoyable all around now that we don’t have to pretend.

My 18 year old was so angry when he found out the truth. He said that he could believe any we told him anymore. He is still adamant that it’s an awful thing to lie to children.
Our older child doesn’t care.

It isn't how I felt either.

I think it's safe to say it isn't how the majority felt because Santa is still going strong.

I totally agree it’s a message - to give to see happiness without an expectation of a thank you or a gift owed in return.

Peer pressure?
Societal expectations

Who wants to be that person who tells their young child he's not real?

I really can't understand why people get so worked up,about this. As I mentioned in my earlier post it didn't cross my mind to pretend Santa was real to my kids and that suited me and my kids. I literally don't care what other people tell their kids. I might correct people if they suggest I've been depriving my kids of Christmas 'magic' but other than that I think it's a complete non-issue.

I don't think you need santa for the magic.