The existence of Father Christmas is a lie that children shouldn’t be told

[maybein2022]

I’ve noticed on social media recently that a LOT of people are posting about not allowing their children to believe in Father Christmas. The rationale being they don’t lie to their children about other things, and it doesn’t sit comfortably with them to create this big ‘lie’. Some talk about how St Nicholas was a real person, some talk about how other children believe in the magic so they shouldn’t spoil it for them etc.

My eldest two are way past believing but it never occurred to me that it was anything more than a harmless story/magic that they would grow out of believing. But I now have a baby/toddler too (too young to understand this year) and wondering if we do the whole thing again.

We’ve always done stockings from FC as small, inexpensive gifts, and always done bigger under the tree gifts from us. A lot of the issue comes with of course not all children will get any gifts at all, and therefore it’s awful if they believe in FC and are disappointed or think they’ve been ‘bad’ (kids living in poverty with no parental money to buy anything, kids living with domestic violence etc). Also the idea that FC brings some kids big gifts and some just small.

So: (I am still on the fence anyway about it all)

YANBU: It’s fine, FC is a magical thing that it’s fine for kids to believe in.
YABU: A lie is a lie, kids shouldn’t believe in FC.

They aren't little long, do you not do anything else magical for your children to enhance their imagination? God, I must be the worst parent ever because there is definitely no gruffalo characters in our local wood, or monkeys swinging about the trees, or fairies at the bottom of the garden. Wonder and curiosity is important in a child's development.

It’s not joyful if a child asks if Santa is real and you say no because you’ve just robbed them of the joy, excitement and sense of wonder….of imagination and creativity, thinking of the North pole and all the magical creatures there, and getting up everyday excited to see what elf on the shelf has done next. Discussing it with their friends

When kids are old enough it naturally runs its course but they still enjoy the other bits like socialising with family.

Only an absolutely awful, terrible, ghastly parent would deny their child the opportunity to believe in Father Christmas, imo

Another social outcast here also with children that know joy and have fun at Christmas without the Santa lie to prop it up. Pretending Santa is real doesn’t make Christmas any more special or fun for children. My children are not little deprived Timmy’s with sour faced cruel Scrooge parents going bah humbug.

The nature of the lie makes a massive difference. It's not even really a lie, done properly...it's more like immersive roleplay at an age where they don't really know the difference between truth and fantasy anyway. They'll gradually realise it's a show you put on because they enjoy it and as long as you just let that happen, it's fine. It's not comparable to a lie of convenience or anything malicious.

If you don't want to do it then don't, that's fine. Something about the performative "I won't teach my kids that LYING IS OK" around Santa comes across as just making an easy gesture on something to gratify your self image rather than modelling a real life lesson.

I always knew santa wasn't real, my mom never lied to me. I always loved and still love christmas.

I knew the tooth fairy wasn't real... Still got money under my pillow.

My mom was always honest but said I couldn't tell other children because they believed in these things and you have to let people believe. I felt like I knew something others didn't and always found the 'meeting santa' events hilarious.

I also found it really weird that a random man could break into our home and it was actively encouraged. (I never did trick or treating either... asking strangers for sweets will never sit right with me!)

However, I have let my child believe what he wants. (Will never be allowed to trick or treat) I think he is quite suspicious but once the presents are there he isn't too bothered either way.

Seems he's only been delivering gifts to children since 1842

Father Christmas - Wikipedia

Before that, he seemed to be the spirit of Christmas in the way of feasting and good cheer.

Pretending Santa is real doesn’t make Christmas any more special or fun for children

I think you are very wrong.

I feel like for me I can't lie to her like that and then expect her to be honest with me.

This is the first year we have had to tackle it and DD isn't even 3 yet.

She understands the concept of pretending (when I asked her to give me examples she was spot on) so I explained it's a story and it's pretend and we can make it a fun game we play together if she likes (which she does). So that's what we're doing.

A lot of other parents think I'm some kind of monster, but I'm not going to lie to my child just to meet their approval.

The elf?

On the shelf?

A mysterious Elf watching them, tracking their moves and giving them social credit if they've been good.

Practice for the future world?

I honestly don’t care what people choose to do with their own children regarding FC, but it seriously makes me roll my eyes when people claim it’s meaningless without it and go on and on and ON about ‘the magic’. As @NotEvenThought said above, I’d there’s no magic without FC then you’re doing Christmas wrong.

I also cannot stand the parents who 1) actively keep the lie going beyond their children wising up, acting devastated about it and 2) get pissy at the notion that other children may ‘spoil’ it by revealing the truth. The notions you teach your children aren’t my kids’ responsibility to uphold.

I can’t ever remember believing in FC, though maybe I did when I was super little, and Christmas was still extremely magical to me and still is. I’m vague about FC with my own kids. We do it in a low key way, and when they ask if he’s real (they are 6) I say I don’t know, what do you think? And let them decide for themselves.

l also do know at least two people in my life that have been impacted by the lie of FC. They both had to be sat down and told before secondary school as their parents feared they would be made fun of. Both have very negative memories of the whole thing and remember feeling humiliated and betrayed. One of them even is still sensitive with his siblings over it as they like to bring it up ‘for a laugh’ and they still feel mortified over it. I don’t think that’s the norm or anything, but it does happen.

Didn’t do me any harm. It’s the magic of Christmas.

Social media on the other hand…. Waaaay more damage.

Father Christmas can bring one low key present or the stocking, or just one present - we send money and a list to him and he brings it.

To everyone saying it is awful to deny a child the magic of believing in Father Christmas, what do you think about all the UK children from different cultural backgrounds who don't do Santa? Part of my family is Muslim as stepson converted. He and his family don't celebrate Christmas but his kids have plenty of joy in their lives without Santa. For anyone in a UK city, it's likely your kids will go to school with lots of children who don't believe in Santa due to their religious or cultural background.

Also I knew from age 4 that Father Christmas wasn't real (my mother is a terrible liar) and I bloody love Christmas and always have.

If the idea of Father Christmas as a magical gift giver didn't exist, I bet children would still get excited by Christmas Day and the presents under the tree. And have a magical Christmas.

Maybe Jesus might get a look in as well. Instead of being overshadowed.

The reality and every day beauty of the natural world has more than enough magic and wonder in it, without inventing fake magical beings. All the excuses about enhancing imagination, increasing joy, curiosity, and wonder they are just rationalising.

I am glad I started this thread. Some really interesting responses. I also do really get everyone saying about the magic and creativity/role play/imagination aspect too as an ex teacher. I also get those saying most children naturally realise there isn’t actually one man in a red suit delivering gifts all around the world in their own time. I also understand that life is unfair, and some kids get nothing at Christmas but that doesn’t mean all kids should be denied the ‘magic’. I also think it’s very interesting that I didn’t question FC at ALL when my older kids were little. Instagram for example really hadn’t taken off at all, maybe even didn’t exist, I can’t remember.

I feel a bit uncomfortable with it too. Like you say it’s how you compare with others. What about people of other cultures and faiths who don’t celebrate? How do we discuss it? I’m keen to further my daughter’s learning and understanding of the world and I can’t help feeling that telling her anything made up undermines this and confuses her. My LO is 20 months so not a concern for this year. I think I may just explain it’s a story which some people believe.

The not lying to your child always makes me laugh. So none of these parents have ever told a lie to their child. I fully believe in making Christmas as magical as I can, including santa. He brings all the presents in my house.

My parents never did the 'he brings good children presents'. Just left that bit out. Never heard of it til I was older. Loved the whole magic of it!

This too, although im not religious i feel a bit uncomfortable with the way Christmas is, i think its quite offensive to actual Christians that there is so much noise that isn’t what it is about at all

It's not a Christian festival originally and I've never known a Christian who didn't know that.

Santa is quite a big lie.
Does your child ever ask why other children in families only get 1 present but they get all their gifts from Santa?

Maybe Jesus might get a look in as well. Instead of being overshadowed.

The guy born in September trying to gatecrash Saturnalia and pretend it's all abour him and his birthday three months ago?

@maybein2022
on your logic the same should be said about god too, as both cases are unproveable

This is laughable. Christmas is about infinite elements of joy that have no basis in the imaginary; that are real and tangible and meaningful – the food, receiving gifts, getting excited about the gifts you’ve given others that you know they’ll love, getting creative with wrapping and crafts, getting and decorating the tree, seeing your town up in lights, dressing up, snow, endless parties, seeing your friends and family, the films, the music.

None of this hinges on Father Christmas. And the idea that you can’t or shouldn’t base your Christmas on all the above and omit the made up man in a red suit or you are ‘absolutely awful, terrible and ghastly’ is beyond ridiculous.