Or is he - moving costs after relationship end.

[DietCokeAddict19]

Ex has lived with me, rent free but paying half the bills, for 5 years. In that time he’s been able to rent out his own place to the tune of £1800 a month which he has been putting in savings.

So we’ve split up, and he has moved out and back into his own place. He lives 3 hours away, so with various trips and van hire, it’s cost him £220.

In the process of sorting out finances and our joint account etc, and he has asked me to pay half of his moving costs.

I’ve told him he’s being completely unreasonable - it’s not my problem that he lives 3 hours away and needed to hire a van.

From a guy who earns at least 4 times my salary, he’s just being a CF, right?

lol yes he was paying tax.

Just say no
No explanation debate or justification needed
Then send him a bill for rent, equivalent to 900 pm for 5 yrs

So, he’s saved in the region of £100k in the time you’ve been together and has the cheek to ask you for £110 to move his own stuff. Let me just ponder on that….NO.

Re asking for half of the cost of the white goods back.

I've replied with:
"Those are things that you used and benefited from whilst you were living here. You're asking for the money back from them because I continue to benefit from them and you don't? When you were living here, you benefited to the tune of £1800 a month by being able to rent out your flat that you weren't living in because you were living here. Did I get half of that money?"

Do end of relationships always have to end in mud slinging? It feels like this is just going to get messy and hurtful, but I'm also not ok with him telling me that I owe him money due to my unreasonableness and for me to just shut up and take it just to avoid conflict (which is what I usually do). Maybe it's time for me to practice what he said he always wanted, which is for me to be my authentic self and tell him how I feel.

Dammit, have just seen the suggestions of a blanket "no" without going into huge paragraphs of why.

Must remind self that "no" is a full sentence.

Yes I think you've just answered your own question here.

The more you enter into a dialogue with him and try to justify yourself, the more nasty and messy and drawn out it will get.

If he replies to that message, your next reply should be, "I am not willing to discuss this with you any further. Goodbye and have a nice life."

And then block him and never speak to him again.

The blocking is so tempting but my kids still want to talk to him, and my DS's phone doesn't work properly so this usually gets done on my phone.

I'm aware I'm just making excuses here.

I'll buy him a new phone.

Is he likely to actually take me to a claims court for not paying back half of the white good costs?! Seriously the man is loaded, I wish he would just fuck off with these petty requests.

Christ, no, taking you to the small claims court would be absolutely nuts.

How old are your kids?

Crikey what a cheeky git. When I moved out of my ex husband's house I paid for all moving costs myself despite him earning substantially more than me. It's not your problem he needed a van, it's his! Especially considering he's been living rent free for goodness knows how long + making money off renting out his own place.

ETA and heck no to the white goods request. He can sod right off with that request. Doubt he'd go down the small claims court tbh. Beside does he even have proof that he paid half?

14 and 12. He has a very cute dog that they miss terribly. It's the dog that my DS wants to see on videocall.

(and no, I'm not getting a dog!)

(maybe I could stretch to a cat)

Yes he would have proof that he paid half - he would usually buy stuff and I would pay him my half. Probably more difficult for me to prove that I paid him my half, to be honest.

Honestly, if it's only the dog they care about, I would be upfront with them.

"Look kids, it hasn't been easy for me, he hasn't been very nice to me over the breakup, and I just want to cut him out of our lives now. I don't really want you maintaining a relationship with him. You can watch videos of dogs on YouTube, or alternatively, how do you feel about getting a cat?"

I'm a little bothered that somehow you're questioning yourself and actually considering that his outrageous requests are fair.

I suspect he was manipulative in other ways over the years.

I do love how you mentioned the £800 per month in rent to this cheeky cocklodger!

Have you done the freedom program or read the book Why Does he do that by Lundy Bancroft? Both valuable resources.

Is it fair do you think to ask them not to have a relationship with him? He's been in their lives for 5 years.

Saying that, he hasn't said goodbye to them and has shown no interest in doing so.

I know. This is my pattern. I did the same with my exH - he was a massive gaslighter and I ended up believing everything he said.

I can't quite believe that I'm here again asking if it's fair for him to ask for this money back when he's absolutely taken the piss for years, and I need to work on myself to find out why I can't just say "no, I'm not paying you for that".

I've read the book and done the Freedom Programme; neither seem to be helping me here. I feel that the Freedom Programme shows more extreme behaviour, and he's not like that. He's far more subtle. And then by the time I started to sense some thing was a bit off, he was already living with us. He definitely fast forwarded us through at the start of the relationship though and I need to be aware of that in the future.

I'm believing his version of what fair is, and I'm struggling to say no when my version of fair isn't aligning with his. He claims fairness to be his top core value - perhaps that was just another lie. Turns out he might not have changed as much as he believes he has (or as much as he tried to convince me he has, at least)

If fairness were his top core value he would have paid you rent or given you half the proceeds of the rental income he got from his property, OP.

I absolutely would block the wanker and tell you children you don't want them to have a relationship with him.

I know! Why couldn't I see that before? Or at least, if I could see it (because I've known for ages it's not fair), then why did I believe him over myself?

More therapy for me...

So you most £500 family credit AND your single supplement for council tax.

You lost A LOT of money with him being there. :(

Hopefully you've leaned from this OP and not be a walkover again.

Please block him. He's not going to enjoy staying at his mum's for long and will soon try to get back!

I just moved a subtle one on too. Not living together but v omnipresent! The whole injustice of it all it still eating me up. I was fairly open with my kids, similar ages to yours. They'd seen how he always seemed to come up smelling of roses, and didn't express any desire to stay in touch. Block him everywhere OP, your intuition has served you well and this could have been so much worse. These sneaky beings are so manipulative. Don't let him take anything else from you.

Yep. He made a LOT of money out of living with me, and I lost a lot.

The good thing about us ending now is that when it comes to DS going to uni, his high earnings won't count against DS when applying for loans. Ex had already made it clear that he wouldn't be contributing anything to do with DS going to uni so I was worried knowing that because he is a high earner then it would disadvantage DS. No need to have that concern any more!

Thanks, it's good to know that being open with the kids has been useful for you - how long had you been in the relationship for?

Shame I didn't listen to my intuition sooner and completely agree that he can't take anything more from me.

I'll talk to the kids once they are back from the weekend with their Dad.

Ah ok. I definitely understand this. These ones can be so subtle and slick like the smoothest salesman!

Seems I've read some books about covert narcissists that covered more of the subtle slick manipulation. Not that I think they're narcs but more self centered opportunists!

I find the ones that bleat in about any one thing to be quite the opposite.

The new agers, the super woke, the fairness 50/50 ones, cheating is the worst, I'd never look at porn it's so evil types, etc.

I like to take an autopsy or retrospective about a previous relationship to identify early behaviors.

Like before, I didn't pick up that rushing things or mirroring were red flags, or weighing out if something was more of a benefit to them but was costing me in time, effort, financially, mentally, emotionally, physically.

6 years together. He wanted to move in but I wouldn't entertain it until the kids are grown. 6 months apart now. He's a proper sneaky one and I still get baited. I couldn't bring myself to block everywhere and it's amazing what they'll do to get in your head. Sooner you block him the better, honestly, if you can somehow have it so he just ceases to exist in your world, the quicker and stronger you'll heal. Stay brave, you got this.

That's interesting about covert narcissists, I'll look that up. My mum and exH are both narcs so wouldn't surprise me if I'd fallen for another one!

Yes about the bleating on!! "Fairness is so important to me" blah blah. Apparently only when it works for him!

Wouldn't an autopsy be great, to be able to dissect things that happened early on and some of the subtle things that got missed.

I hope you are in a better relationship now (or happily single!)

Well done for not letting him move in - you must have known you'd never get him back out!!

Yes I agree blocking is the best thing. He's already told me that he has seen I've replied to his email, but he can't read it because he's in a panic. It feels harsh to say it when we had been together for 5 years, but that's really no longer my problem. I'm not sure I'd go as far as emotional blackmail, it's more emotional outpouring with no appropriate boundaries or filter. I'm sure he hasn't been sleeping well, neither have I, but whilst he likes to take the opportunity to tell me about how he is struggling, I'm not discussing it with him because it's nothing to do with him how I am feeling or how well/badly I'm coping. It's just not appropriate.