Fil’s ‘manners’

[ItsMissChanandlerBong]

This is a bit of an awkward issue, and I’m hoping for some advice on how to deal with it!

My fil is THE loveliest man. We have a great relationship and he’s an amazing fil and grandad. But one awkward thing keeps cropping up, his insistence on ‘old fashioned manners’. These include opening all doors for me, pulling out chairs, kisses on the cheek on greeting and leaving, all of which make me very uncomfortable! He even attempts to put my coat on for me by picking it up and holding it out.

I once got to a door first and held it open for my husband who was carrying our son. My fil refused to walk through unless he was holding it open as it would be rude! This led to a weird awkward standoff.

I suppose I want to know if I’m being unreasonable and should just let him do these things for me (which he NEVER does for his son or any other male) or do I keep doing what I’m doing (rushing ahead to get to the car first, grabbing my coat as soon as we’re leaving and deliberately choosing a chair no where near him at dinner). Or do I brave it and say to him I’d rather do it myself…

Do they @Potofteaplease? The OP doesn't mention her MIL BIL SIL etc kissing her.

I don't think I could join a family where women had to submit to being missed by all the men in the family and weren't allowed to hold doors or put their own coats on.

My first boyfriend's family were quite effusive but when I told them I wasn't used to it and felt a bit uncomfortable they stopped.

They were the only family I've ever been connected with who kissed on the cheek as standard. And it wasn't compulsory.

I'm really struggling to understand why any of the things the OP's father in law does are a problem? Holding doors open, pulling chairs in and out, and holding coats are all just good manners, particularly holding doors open, and kissing a relative or close friend on the cheeks isn't unusual.

I don't eat out very often nowadays but i still find that waiting staff in many restaurants pull out my chair when I first arrive and help with my coat when I leave. I dont think that men holding doors open is confined to older men - just last night a man in his very early 30s held the door open for me when I arrived at a meeting. I find that it's far more common that men hold doors open for me than not, and i only see this as politeness, which I always thank people for.

Making someone uncomfortable and making them do things they don't want to do can't possibly be good manners can it?

Refusing to go through a door because a woman is holding it is so unusual as to be safely considered very odd behaviour.

If this man also insists on kissing his son helps his son on with his coat, refuses to go through doors held by his son then maybe it's just overbearing and not creepy.

But if he only does it to women.

Or worse still just his daughter (s) in law then it's not just his standard manners is it?

I think the key is if you feel you can refuse this man's attentions and everything will be fine.

If you don't feel you can refuse then it's not good manners on his part is it?

Everyone holds doors open for everyone @Growlybear83

That's normal good manners.

Refusing to go through a door held by a woman is not good manners and not normal.

I don't get why these things are even an issue! I always greet my DDs boyfriend with a hug - my FIL greets me with a kiss oh the cheek - what's the problem with that? Maybe the holding of chairs is a bit OTT but it's generational, he's just being polite.

You presumably like the hug and the kiss, though. The OP doesn't like her FIL's antiquated gendered 'manners'. What is depressing is how many people on the thread think she should just go along with it, regardless of her own feelings.

This is the most wonderful dripfeed!

“Oh he’s from a different generation where gentlemen all tipped their hats to each other in the street. Oh he’s just a lovely elderly gentleman. Oh you’ll be sad when he’s gone, just indulge him, he’s so sweet…”

Fuck that noise. He was born in the 60s and is not a charming old man.

Yeah he was born after women burned their bras. There's no way he doesn't know this behaviour potentially makes a significant proportion of women uncomfortable.

1. Other people have different boundaries.

Yeah, no, that covers it.

How lovely to know men such as this still exist! What on earth is your problem? You sound as though you suffer low self-esteem.

Maybe I'm old fashioned but I think it's up to a woman who kisses her.

Are you really ok with creepy men using attitudes like yours to get away with forcing their attentions on women who don't want them?

You don't think women should have control over who touches or kisses them?

Sigh, so much 'suck up the behaviour you don't like because it makes the little old man who's actually in his 50s* sad'. OP, not unreasonable at all. Manners are delightful, infantalising women as delicate little creatures who can't even cope with a jacket are not. If he doesn't respond well to a polite 'no thank you' then know it's got absolutely nothing to do with good manners.
*His age suggests he was more likely to be off his tits on acid at an rave as a young man, not tea dancing to Vera Lynn!

The problem is that OP doesn't like it. She doesn't want to be kissed on the cheek, she doesn't want to be helped into her coat like a child etc.

She finds it uncomfortable.

If that's all you have to worry about ....

He's a gentleman of a generation whose manners mattered. Suck it up. Say thank you , it pleases him so you are making him happy. You say he's kind and lovely. Please reciprocate

1. We are allowed to worry about more than one thing ar a time
2. Have you seen which generation he is?! He is 57

So ? He's 57 and been brought up with manners that are important to him.

Imagine being offended by a lovely family member who is kind to you ...

To be honest, he sounds lovely. If this is all he does that annoys you and let him stick with his 'old fashioned' manners. There are far worse examples you could have given.

It doesn't hurt you to let him hold the door open or pull your chair out.
It does make him feel happy to ge gentlemanly.
I don't know why it's such a big deal for you. Its not like hes being rude or misogynistic.
let him have a little joy, as pp said, he'll be gone one day.

I don't think it's kind to do something which infantalises a grown woman, is something the received is uncomfortable with, and not do it to men too.

And the OP obviously has good manners as she held the door open for him

And he refused to walk through it! That's madness.

No he isn't. He's only a few years older than Liam Gallagher!

@ItsMissChanandlerBong should put up with being kissed by a man she doesn't want to be kissed by for another 30 or 40 years because he likes it?

Its not like hes being rude or misogynistic.

I think that that could be up for debate tbh!