If you are lonely, do you ever feel even worse when trying to get out and do things with people? Volunteering, classes, etc?

[Manycupsofteaforme]

I'm probably not explaining well, but it's like everyone has their own real, main people in the form of their close family and friends, so even though it is nice and interesting to chat to people I meet out and about, it compounds the isolation in a way.

I do a small bit of volunteering in my local community and it is enjoyable but people naturally chat about their parents, kids etc and I feel myself taking a step back and mentally removing myself into a different category because they are 'normal' with rich tapestries of family and friend connections.

I have my lovely DP but my parents are dead and I can't have kids and I feel so awkward at best, and in a constant state of bereavement at worst. It will soon be Christmas, and I feel so isolated. I moved countries and really like where I live but I haven't made friends here, and over the years drifted from friends I had from uni etc.

Does anyone else find similar, that being around people who are lovely but who you are not close to actually makes you feel more lonely?

Don't get me wrong, I think the lowkey social activity I have when out and about is important because it meets a need to interact with other human beings, but I miss more meaningful friendships and connections.

Can anyone relate at all?

@OnlyTheBoresKnowItAll Thanks so so much love. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for being so kind.

Re your first post, your male friend's lucky to have you. Nothing wrong with enjoying company and having nice places to go with a genuine friend. Being open to different people and experiences is how we grow and learn. A friend is a friend and better than staying in on your own missing out. That's all that matters and long may it continue for you!

Re your second post spending the night with an acquaintance, again we're all adults and you both got what you needed with safe and clear boundaries. Nothing wrong there. I'm so sorry people have mistreated you and don't understand your needs but glad you have the wisdom to value yourself and make your own needs important. Which they are! Yes, understandable about getting harder even though we don't always want to, we learn to when dealing with certain types.

Totally agree we don't always know the right thing to say but a bit of empathy means the world!

Was honoured to have been trusted and happy to talk the problems through. Thing is, I wasn't expecting sympathy and haven't talked about my uncle before really as what happened is simply a part of my life I can't do anything about. I was just saying I'm very upset at having to stop helping others due to a difficult environment. Yes the reaction was sadly very hurtful on top and now I'm a closed book again. Please don't stop being who you are. You sound decent, intelligent and deserve people to love you.

Yes thank goodness for MN! There's loads of great folk on here to talk to and have a laugh with. It's so appreciated and valued.

I can relate. I love my DS and feel blessed but being a single parent is the loneliest experience ever.

Feel so incredibly lonely since separating from ex H that I'm finding myself constantly anxious and depressed. I don't talk about my personal life at work and too embarrassed to let on about my circumstances to the school mums. Both of those only just makes it even lonelier.

The loneliness nearly killed me when I was in my teens growing up in a highly unstable home, then I met my Ex and then failed in the marriage lasting 10 years before I left as things became unbearable for everyone. I have a handful of not close friendships but to be honest I don't know what to do anymore. I wish I did not fail in my marriage.

@Manycupsofteaforme Thanks so much for starting this thread and to everybody who's posted. You've all posted bravely and honestly with kindness. So many are affected but it's rarely admitted to irl.

I really relate. I always wanted to marry and have children but neither has happened and around aged 35, I found my hobbies started to make me miserable mainly because of insensitive people questioning me about my childlessness or singleness and that feeling I had of having to go home alone to an empty bed while everyone else had someone.

I'm neurodiverse, with siblings much older and in different countries so grew up as an essentially only child. I've always felt quite lonely and generally loved company...always wanted someone to play board games with and giggle with. I've always felt on the outside looking in.

I actually do have really good friends who I see at least once a week and lots of acquaintances but not having a husband or children really affects me and my friends are all married with beautiful kids so that limits the sorts of things we can do. When I try new hobbies, there aren't many people there in their late 30s and people only seem to be able to talk about their partners and kids then act suspicious and instantly distance themselves when they realise I have neither.

And it's really hard to meet men in real life. When they are around, at a hobby or social event, they make no attempt to talk to women. Unless they are 20+ years older, then it's hard to shake them off!

I also hate small talk which makes life hard. I hate the way everything is generally so superficial these days and on the surface. I want to know people and be known. I want community.

But neediness is off putting. Closeness is weird or suspicious. We'd rather watch other people have close relationships on Netflix or Love Island than take the actual risk in real life.

I'm sick of it. Life's so grey.

I'm sure my grandparents lives weren't this lonely...their villages were close and people could rely on each other, spend time with each other, support one another. They had social skills. I'm not sure that we do anymore.

I wish I had a time machine. I think I was meant for the days of dances in church halls, lending your neighbour a cup of sugar, leaving your front door open so your friends and family could pop in for a chat, having a laugh with your neighbour while you peg your washing out.

I honestly think that someone needs to come up with decent groups where lonely people can get together and learn how to interact and have fun.

One of the best things I ever did was join an Alpha group years ago when I was suicidal (over childlessness) and had big questions. We had a meal together, about 8 of us (there were about 30 in total) every week and learned about each other's lives, talked about the big questions, had a laugh, a cry...got deep, quick. Then we went away for a weekend together which helped the bond grow more.

I live quite a long way from most of them now but I'm in quite regular contact and we see each other every 2/3 months - it's really like a family. It never would have happened without that Alpha model of bonding...the food and "fellowship", the weekend away, the deep questions...

Is there a secular alternative?

Or something like adult scouts/brownies?!

@All2Well What a great post. Yes, most interactions are superficial and we're so much poorer. People prefer clicks and likes to real conversation getting to know and value each other.

I was thinking earlier about how communities used to be stronger and neighbours were extended family. There was always company and somebody to rely on. People on their own didn't have to be on their own. There was room for them instead of being isolated.

Agree, sadly groups of friendly people are in short supply. What a nice group that sounds with supportive likeminded people.

A secular group sounds great!

I'd love a secular group but no local ones

I have given up on groups though. Everyone gets married and has kids. Surprised to see so many married folk on here.

i have spent a couple of hours this evening cuddling my ex. I'm not sure I'd have done that, if .i had the friendships I had pre lockdown.

we are friends now but there can't be any cuddling when he gets another girlfriend.

I'm not an only child but my sister isn't nearby.

I hope it’s ok to post here, your posts really resonated with me & that feeling of connection is something I love about mumsnet. I am someone that is fortunate to have friends & family around me but I still experience feelings of real loneliness & feeling set apart from others. I think on some level I have always felt that way & now I am living with cancer & have a daughter with autism I just feel that I can’t relate to the majority of people any more. It’s like my life has become more & more outside the mainstream while everyone else carries on as normal. You all sound like lovely thoughtful people so I’m sorry that others experience this.

Everybody dosent have kids.
Not everyone with grown up kids has a good relationship with them or sees them. Not everyone sees their grandchildren.
Not everyone who is married is happily married.

I read articles like this and think I'd happily fast forward to old age if I could end up in a retirement community like this which is a genuinely a community. The Guardian had a similar article a few weeks back about a women only retirement community which sounded even more fantastic. You were only ever a few feet from someone to have a cuppa with. I will say that my mums friendships are the strongest they have ever been in rhe last 10 or 15 years. (She's 78)..she always knew a fair few people but now she has a really strong network of maybe 4 or 5 people who really look out for one another as well as have lots of fun. Life circumstances mean that they simply have more flexibility and time to build and maintain those friendships- some of her friends are widowed though not all. The last she Iis closest friends with she was only an acquaintance up until 7 or 8 years ago and they are supertight. So there is always hope https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2023/nov/01/retirement-home-alpine-spa-appleby-blue

theleaf my parents' friendships were very strong at that age but very depressing, lots of ill people who dad used to drive around till he fell ill himself.

I really don't want to live that long. I'd like to move into over 55s when I get there though, because there'd be no kids. But others have said to me that it's mostly much older people who buy there and that a 55 year old might feel they have wandered into a care facility? I have never been in one so I have no clue.

Tbh I swither with the lonely thing....I'd love my pre-lockdown life back but I miss those friends in particular. I think for me, it's not a case of meeting people generally but just one or two who really get you and who keep in touch makes a huge difference to quality of life.

I definitely feel better today for having had company yesterday.

There is an organisation called Ageing without Children.

girlfriend sorry if I misunderstood but were your last couple of posts intended for me?

I don’t consider myself to be ageing 😂

Yes I understand.

I have good friends elsewhere but have moved to retrain and can't seem to get a handle on this new place socially despite meeting a lovely partner.

I'm not the world's most confident person but have always done fine socially as an adult wherever I have lived but here just can't seem to make any headway! I've tried all different types of groups, my course (all much younger) and several workplaces (agency PT work) and have simply clicked with nobody. It's a real kicker to the self esteem.

Have you always lived in the same town/moved recently like me? If so maybe consider a move to somewhere you like the vibe. I genuinely think my issue will resolve in another place as I've always been alright until now except my hometown which was a very similar place. No criticism of the people, it just isn't working for me and I can't wait to live elsewhere.

Ahhh thank you for your lovely thoughtful response! I think it holds true that just a little kindness ( even from a stranger on here!) Can make all the difference in the world . It's the feeling of invisibility which is the killer - not being seen or heard or listened to. Not feeling part of the workd, just floating around the periphery.

I've had similar when being shut down by people : I thought I'd share with a " friend" how I was suffering with anxiety and she literally, not figuratively, turned her back on me! Turned round in her chair and started a conversation with someone else! I'm aghast at how anyone can think this is decent behaviour. I really hope you're not still being the listener to your colleague, she truly doesn't deserve your ear or your friendship ! But I know what you mean, when you say you become a closed book; it's like why bother!

It's such a shame you can't continue the volunteering because you are exactly the type of person to help people in crisis : supportive, empathetic, caring with lived experience. But some charities are vipers nests unfortunately that seem to attract a fair share of toxic psople. Why they're drawn to the caring fields God only knows! Maybe there is somewhere else where you could help out - grassroots organisations often offer a better environment, mainly because they're not operating as businesses and as such attract people who are there for the right reasons.

Yes, thank God for mn ! You're never alone when you're on here!

I relate to this thread so much I have a wonderful husband and colleagues but I don't really have anyone else.
It's taboo to admit to feeling lonely, feeling ignored, feeling different / outside the mainstream, or having really good friends who you can really talk to and be honest and open with, and I think others here have articulated it far better than I ever can. It's also taboo to admit that some things (even supposedly "nice" things) can remind you of this.
But IMHO the biggest taboo seems to be talking about the reasons for all of this. We've all been sold this fairytale of moving around for opportunities and nobody wants to admit that it can lead to loneliness or a lack of community or to people feeling they can take advantage of each other.

Thanks so much for replying again! Kindness means so much and the world's better for having you in it. It's brill having this site with so many kind people to chat to!

Yes it is and I also wonder if your two "friends" couldn't cope when you weren't staying in your lane as the "fun single pal" who's a great laugh on nights out and also strong and there for everybody. I'm so sorry they weren't there for you when you just showed some vulnerability. That's so upsetting and then it's clear things are one-sided. Eventually you've seen it too many times and know it's no friendship. They weren't "yours" to begin with. You can't then unsee that and step back. They will realise too late sadly they've lost a good friend who's like gold dust and might not have others to meet their needs.

No more playing listener. We work in different places so message a lot, phone and then meet up every few weeks. After sending said message and getting a Hi reply six days later with no acknowledgement of that heartfelt but matter of fact message, I replied Hi but will be polite and distant.

Thanks for being so smashing and you have a place in the world. Please don't give up, you have loads to offer and glad you have a nice friend to go out and enjoy things! Please ignore the remarks or you could ask them why they have a problem with it? It's sad people use their own insecurities against a genuine friendship.

It is a shame many don't have good intentions. My only reasoning is some do it for the ego and to be "better" than those they're meant to be helping or they do that to impress the neighbours and their friends at dinner parties.

Yes, so grateful for MN and for the great wisdom here!

Yes. it's the luck of the draw and the reasons aren't looked at. Agree we live in a fragmented society where progression's favoured over community and friendship. Also many have been taken advantage of under the guise of friendship. Genuine people get fed up and too upset eventually choosing loneliness rather than being mistreated only to end up lonely anyway!

This may sound crass but one of my main issues with living alone is how boring it is. Nobody to talk to, share things with. Just me and my dog. Silence and no communication. Feels like total failure if I am honest. I've failed at being enough for anyone.

I can completely relate to this. I have DC and my mum but other than that no real connection with anyone. It makes me worried for the future, when my DC have their own lives. Not for the big things, like illness but the day to day stuff.

I seem to have what I think are strong friendships with people but get dropped for other friends or new partners. I think I am a really generous, caring person but seem to end up being taken for granted or used.

No wish to have a romantic relationship so not really sure what the answer is.

OP you've really managed to articulate something I've felt very alone in feeling.

I remember when I was single and newly moved to an area, feeling adrift I really tried to "put myself out there" and read everything I could about making friends. It just didn't work, I'd be physically around people but the more I tried the lonelier I felt.

It was really confusing, I was doing everything I was supposed to so why wasn't it working? No one got it, if I tried to talk about this I wasn't believed or I was told that it must be because I wasn't trying hard enough.

At a new stage in life and new place I lucked into a nice group of friends in a similar situation which we bonded over. My theory is that you either meet the right people at the right time or you don't. If you're at a gathering with people who aren't a good fit it doesn't tend to get better with time.

@WhatNoRaisins that's a very good point. I tried a local group recently but the more people were talking about their lives, the less I felt I had to contribute - and went home feeling lonelier and more inadequate than ever.

As a single parent to one dd, I used to get really upset seeing Facebook posts about other mums I knew having group outings, with or without their kids, that dd and I weren't invited to. And in lockdown, when single people could bubble up with someone - I had noone to bubble with, and no one ever checked in to see how we were doing 😪. If I didn't work, I'd never speak to another adult.

The other tricky thing with groups is that they don't always meet very frequently, especially for working age adults. Problem is that when you only meet monthly it's hard to build rapport with people, feels like you're starting from zero each time.

Not sure how you solve that one as obviously a lot of people can only spare so much time for this sort of thing.

I used to think this, after my husband died l felt really out on a limb. I spent a lot of time, effort and money joining groups, clubs, meet ups, and never really met one friend, most people tended to rush in and rushed off again. I also tried OLD. It had more of a negative impact on me than anything else.
Now l am of a completely different mindset, what's meant for me will be, when l think back to how l met my other friends, boyfriends and husband, it all happened so naturally and effortlessly. It wasn't forced.
Also l remind myself that previous friends and relationships have sometimes turned out to be more of a burden than anything else, which then became uncomfortable trying to disentangle myself from, and l often played a different kind of role/ character depending on who l was with. I just can't be bothered with all that anymore.
I have made peace with my solitude now. I stay open to meeting different people, but l don't feel I'm missing out. I work with the relationship l have with myself.
I have also noted that many famous people who are apparently so loved and popular, seemingly surrounded by friends, often end up dying alone in tragic circumstances. These same so called friends love to show up for the funeral, but where the hell were they? When was the last time they spoke or texted the deceased? It's all a farce.

I read once that true friendships are built slowly over time when lots of incidental meetings with the other person happen - often daily. In situations where there is no pressure to actually be friends. So this is why friends from school are often long lasting. Or a neighbour you get in with. Or someone next to you in halls at university or who you work with or volunteer with. Trying to build a friendship where you only see each other for coffee once a month is just not going to work (generally)

Re Ageing without Children. Not to you poster but anyone in general. If your worrying about getting older with no family check them out.