meltdown triggered and evening spoilt by saying no to chips and rice

[reallybad]

Ds13 (adhd/asd) had been looking forward to going to a particular restaurant with a family member. We get there and ds asks if he can order his usual favorites and chips. I told him he didn't need chips as well and that was the last straw for him. He shut down, would not speak to anyone or eat anything and put himself to bed as soon as he got home.

Obviously if I'd known that was going to happen I would likely have said yes to the chips. We all had a totally miserable evening and it was heartbreaking to ses DS so overwhelmed when he'd been looking forward to it for so long.

The chips thing was actually the last straw, we were sitting at the wrong table, and the restaurant was also too busy apparently. These things also contributed to him feeling overwhelmed but I'm getting the blame from ds/dh for the whole thing for being mean/controlling.

I'm now trying to understand how wrong I was. It really feels right to me to discourage anyone from ordering chips and rice (on top of starters and a main dish). Also it feels wrong to just say yes to anything DS asks for incase he has a meltdown although obviously i don't want him to have a meltdown.

I feel like I really don't have a clue anymore

Tbh to prevent meltdowns when we go out I let them have what they want pretty much 🤷‍♀️💐

I think the meltdown was already on the cards. The chips might have triggered it, but if you'd said yes to the chips then something else would have set it off.

They obviously have eyewateringly deep pockets. We're high earners and still set limits.

That is just a ridiculous reply, it's not just about the chips it's about a child on the spectrum, how a meltdown could have been avoided, how to move forward and how to try and prevent it happening again.

OP it is NOT your fault.

I have 2 with ADHD and I am permanently trying to balance between making concessions and also having some boundaries and rules.

Healthy eating is a daily fight with my youngest. Not overeating is a daily fight with my eldest.

Sometimes I get it wrong. I too would have said no to that amount of food. "Just let him order what he wants in a restaurant" doesn't work for us.

I am also having to make split second decisions about what I allow and what I don't all fucking day. I am exhausted and overwhelmed.

Sometimes it's not about the chips. As you say, it was the staw that broke the camels back. You might have said yes to chips and your partner might have said 'pass the salt' and that tipped him over. Its not fair of your partner to blame you. Sometimes its not possible to second guess everything. And even if you could have antcipated that, no one is perfect.

Op it sounds like your response to the chips was more to do with ds demanding takeaways and what he's eating generally? My dd is also this age and autistic and we have this too, she'd eat takeouts every night if I let her! It's really hard but we have to have boundaries and say no to things, ideally at home if it could trigger a meltdown or shut down. We discuss and plan details in advance if we're going out so we're all on the same page. If we were at a restaurant and she wanted chips and rice as well as the rest of her food, and I knew it was her favourite I'd say yes, because it's a treat and part of a routine if they always order those. I'd pick my battles at home and of course teens are generally moody and emotional anyway so the same scenario could set a NT child off! It's all a learning curve, I'm still learning about parenting every day, things are always evolving, plus they're changing into teens as well now (and change itself is very hard in our house), things are bound to crop up that were previously ok or different in the younger years.
I think you're being too hard on yourself op, your dh isn't helping. Stop apologising now, and if he felt you were in the wrong he should have said something at the time. I think I'd work on getting a balance on the takeaways as that sounds like what influenced your decision on the chips; as others have said, hindsight is a wonderful thing! I'd let dd have both if we were out for a treat, but food at home day to day is different. I've had to say no to takeaways so many times she's used to it now, and as she's getting older can understand about health and finances more. We tend to have strops and going off to her room now rather than dramatic and very upsetting meltdowns when she was younger. Shut downs are horrible too though when she's so clearly internalising everything and can't cope (usually to do with school). It's hard op sending

if its at home then i can understand, if its a special occasion then let them eat cake so to speak

I really feel for you, it is so hard.

We don’t have teens yet but ND boy and tend to go with the - whatever he wants to keep the peace and shut him up when we are out. It’s not shut down but noisy uncontrolled meltdown. Very hard to say which is worst!!

Your son may have a sensory issue and not be able to realise whenever he is hungry or full. He may also be comfort eating to deal with anxiety. Or he may have comorbid adhd which would lead to problems with executive function, self control and self regulation. Indeed it could be a combination of it all.

Very likely he was psychologically overloaded before he even got to the car to go to the restaurant. I’ll leave you to try and fill in the blanks as to what may be going on for him. The issues while there just tipped the balance.

I would work on emotional communication, how are you feeling today, how are your friends, did anything interesting happen - approaching from multiple different angles in a chat not an interrogation. So you can figure out where he is emotionally.

As to future restaurants, book the table he likes, evaluate and choose from the menu at home, if he hasn’t been before show him pictures from the website etc and try and go a walk beforehand.

It’s a lot I know. Huge hugs there will be other times where you have a lovely evening 💐

I have just flipped forward through the thread to say exactly this. I think just having anticipated the visit for so long and the high expectations of how good it would be probably set it up to be overwhelming. Then being busy on top. Chips y have triggered the shutdown but I completely agree with @Ribena20 that if they hadn't, something else would.

Agree, chips is too minor at this age.

He was overloaded hours beforehand.

You didn't nothing wrong about the chips.

I personally would have taken the child outside for 10 minutes and nicely, but firmly, told it to sort itself out.

If it then decides to not speak, eat or engage with anyone during a lovely meal arranged for it - and then decides to put itself to bed as soon as it gets home - then so be it. The World moves on.

You did nothing wrong.

Most restaurants have menus online these days. Our asd child always goes in with a plan. If she changes the plan, I rarely say anything and she isn’t even prone to meltdowns in public. I just know how difficult food is for her. I pick the time and place to have discussions about food and that is pretty much only at home with no one else present.

i try to draw as little attention to her disordered eating as possible. Maybe this is one of those big differences between male and female autism, but I just can’t imagine doing this. Even if my teen wanted to only eat rice and chips and nothing else, I would just be happy she was eating

Try and use it for a teaching moment as a family.
Things we now know
This restaurant at that time probably won't work
Would ear defenders have helped
What do you want us to do if we can't get the table you want in future.
I can't always let you have the food that you want, just as if you didn't have autism I wouldn't. But how could we have handled it differently. Is there a way that you can say, I really need it and I'll know.

I'm sorry you had a meltdown, hopefully we've got a plan to minimise them at this restaurant going forward.

And don't take the blame, all the above contributed. You were being a good mum
looking after his health.

"It really feels right to me to discourage anyone from ordering chips and rice (on top of starters and a main dish)"

You need to give your teen independence to decide what to eat, if you need to, set a spending limit. If money isn't the issue then you sound very controlling.

@SensationalSusie the time of table and restaurant choice WAS the son's.
Also the table was one that's been happily sat at before.
As pp have said I don't think the 'have whatever/do whatsoever you want so we don't have to deal with the outcome if you don't' method works well in the long run.

I feel for you OP. I have a child with similar diagnosis and we had these issues but miraculously almost all disappeared, at least for now. I don't know what is right, because our approach was to avoid meltdowns at all costs, if he wants 3 portions of chips fine whatever. But DS started to play us, asking for extra things especially when we were with others and he knew we wouldn't argue back. This was even after agreeing food or drink in advance. He became manipulative, he knew we got very easily embarrassed and used the threat of a meltdown against us. I understand a true meltdown isn't controlled, this was around the time he was learning to process better and genuine meltdowns were getting rarer, but we were never sure what we were dealing with. I know for a fact many friends and family see him as very spoilt but they have no idea of the shit he put us through.

But the issue wasn't about the amount of food! That was the trigger and contributed to his distress but wasn't the issue itself.

My anecdotal experience is that by commiting to react (i.e. accomodate their needs) if your autistic child is at the point of meltdown, they learn to trust you. And will allow themselves to push their own comfort zones, because they know if it becomes too much their safe adult will respond.

Trust is key.

A simple example, my autistic dd gained the confidence to go to new places because I promised we would leave whenever she asked. And I followed through with that.

We had some very shortlived visits to people and places but over time she felt less urgency to leave because she knew I would.

She's 19 now and is currently out with her boyfriend having driven them both to a place she's never driven to before.

She's still socially much more reserved than many of her peers but she is unrecognisable from the traumatised child that couldn't meet the unrealistic expectations of a mainstream primary school.

I believe many people get it the wrong way round. They're so busy trying to teach an autistic child how to live in a NT world, how to behave more like there NT peers etc. that they fail to allow autistic children to learn what it is to be autistic!! To learn about themselves first so they are then better equipped to find the least traumatic way to live in a world that is inherently challenging.

I rage every time I hear "They've got to live in the real world" or "They've got to learn that the rest of the world isn't focused on them" etc. Because this is always used as a justification for a 'tough love' type approach.

There are other approaches to tough love, that get dismissed as "pandering" and parents are painfully aware of the judgemental attitudes of others.

You DH is a dick for blaming you. Given all the background you have given you were not unreasonable to try and cut down on the amount of food (and I say this as someone whose kids have way too many takeaways and eat out too much). I understand he is ND but I have to be honest and say this is the kind of thing my 10 year old DD would do although I think she would give in if I then said she could have the chips.
I understand a few things had accumulated and upset him (which you can't know) but you do also have to have some discipline and you can't let him eat what he wants. I think you are trying your best and what you did really wasn't that unreasonable especially when you said he could have chips when you realised how important it was.

It's a learning process for you all and will continue to be. So next time you prepare better and agree how you will cope if things go wrong. I'm not in your situation so can only try to imagine how difficult it must be every day, trying to understand your DS world when it's so different from your own.

@CorylusAgain does that mean you then do whatever/give whatever they want everytime there could be a risk of a meltdown no matter what?

@CorylusAgain

ok. So what do you think OP should have done then?

Bought him chips

Its not as simplistic as that.
I'm not going to get drawn into a list of "if he does x do you just let him?" Or if "he wants x just give it to him". Every situation is complex.
I'm just pointing out that the starting point is the child/young persons trust. Not necessarily rigid boundaries and expectations.

@CorylusAgain

ok…. but what if he had wanted something else extra on top? Or two deserts? Or a pint of lager?

At one point do you draw the line, buckle up for the reaction and just say ‘no’?