To think it’s turning into genocide in real time

[Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73]

Just seen this on the news- how can this be right? It genuinely is starting to feel like genocide.

What Hamas did was beyond appalling. But this is also beyond appalling too. Its trying to wipe Gaza off the map. Over 500 kids have already died. Human rights watch have verified that Israel uses white phosphorus against Gaza, which is a war crime.

And everyone is just watching it happen.

“The Israeli army has just ordered the entire civilian population of Gaza to evacuate south within 24 hours. The UN says that amounts to 1.1 million people& applies to 100s of 1000s sheltered in UN buildings & their staff. This is impossible without “devastating human consequences”
Leaving aside the international law implications, I cannot emphasise enough how impossible this kind of movement of people would be. I have spent a lot of time in Gaza it is one of the most densely populated places on earth, there are pretty much only 2 roads south - along the coast and down the centre - they aren’t wide or well paved. I spoke to the gaza health ministry yesterday who said every hospital was overflowing. How would the wounded and elderly be transported? There is a massive fuel shortage how would vehicles drive? There would be no where for 1.1 million to go even if they got there. Rafah crossing to Egypt is not operational because of Israeli airstrikes.”

This is how Genocide is classified;
U.N. Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide:

"In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

• Killing members of the group;

• Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

• Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part"

The actions of both Israel & Hamas fit this description too. It’s just fucking beyond terrible. And it feels like some world leaders are just cheering from the sidelines 😪

Sadly most non Jews don’t really understand the history here and are subject to massive propaganda.

The palestinaians are pawns for a wider political game.you can read around it above and on other more educated posts on other threads if you’re really interested to actually understand.

I condemn all acts of violence and murder. It’s time we women started removing power from men as war and conflict are their only blunt force trauma method for resolving anything. It’s disgusting.

I completely agree. It galls me that my taxes are being used to go and support another state committing war crimes. Then, as if that is not bad enough, it’s during a cost of living crisis. I’m also not sure Israel is quite the useful strategic partner it’s made out to be either. I suspect particularly the US gets a lot less out of the arrangement than the general public believes whilst simultaneously funding apartheid.

It isn’t a war. A war is when two countries fight. Gaza is not a country, Hamas are not a government!

Israel has warned Gazans to leave, Hamas has ordered civilians to stay.

The cruel irony is that the Gazans have nowhere to go. They cannot leave. And Israel certainly isn't going to help offer them safe passage. Egypt won't open its borders. The Palestinian people have no allies. It is terrible. Hamas doesn't have to order anything. The people have little choice but to stay. It really is an open air prison.

There is a difference.

Israel has not declared its aim is to kill every Palestinian. Not even every inhabitant of Gaza.
A group who intends Genocide does not give warning of air strikes to come nor advises those it seeks to kill to move to a safer area.
Israel is bombing the hideouts of Hamas, who are hiding among the population because they don't care about civilians.

Hamas DOES intend to commit Genocide and will do everything they can to achieve it.

Hamas needs to stop first because they are the only one with publicly proclaimed Genocide as a mission.

No peace is possible while they exist with that stated aim.

Innocent Palestinians will die of course. Just as in every war since the beginning of time.
Those were not Genocide any more than the bombing of Gaza is.

Up to half of Gazas electricity is now from solar power and not reliant on Israel so hopefully incubators will be unaffected.

Egypt won't open its borders. The Palestinian people have no allies

And why is this do you think?

Israel has told people to move south of Wadi Gaza, within Gaza.

@Queucumber both the UN and WHO have said this just isn't possible. Removing people from hospitals isn't possible. But you think that it's okay to expect a million people to move their lives in less than 24 hours?

Why do you think Arab states should step in?

The countries supporting Israel are mainly Christian.

Unless what you really want to say is that Christian countries should not support any muslim countries and it is the responsibility of other muslim majority countries.

I agree with you calling out other human right abuses specially Yemen. Most of them are being committed by other strong countries - Saudi, China so UK and USA dont stand up to them. It is the same for Israel - they don't stand up to Israel too.

What Hamas did were disgusting - targeting women, children, elderly - innocent people going about their day to day lives. It cannot be justified in the slightest - wrong. Targeting Jewish people the way they did I have no qualms calling that genocide.

Israel of course has to take action.

But 1,000,000 cannot leave Gaza in 24 hours. It is not possible. When the number of innocent Palestinians numbers then get reported we will be having another discussion about that.
IDF and Israeli government can say they have given people warning, far more than Hamas gave their innocent civilians but you cannot move that many people.

In an ideal world after whatever action Israel takes the world would come together and help rebuild Gaza and improve the situation in Gaza but this will not happen. There will be more hatred and anger and bloodshed in that region.

We are too focused on blame and who is most to blame. Who caused most of the issues in the region: the ottomans, the British, the French, the UN with their lack of action, the Palestinians, Iranianas the Israelis……how many lives have been lost, injured etc etc etc

Everyone needs to get it into their heads that Palestinians and Israelis have been on that land and need to co exist on that land. Anyone who is against a fair two state solution for both people are part of the problem and responsible for the conflict.

Hamas need to piss off, settlements need to be stopped, Iran needs to shut up, Lebanon need to shut up, America and the UK need to shut up if they can’t bring a sense of proportionality to the discussion with solution focused outlook.

The Muslim countries in the Middle East who are quick to say our Muslim brothers and sisters need to unite to find a solution - again this won’t happen due to sectarian reasons.

We should all be appalled by the loss of life - all innocent life. I am at a total loss about what is happening.

Of course I don’t think it’s ok. Of course many hospital patients can’t be moved.

The healthy population of women and children could head south on foot. It’s not fair or right or just but if you knew bombs were coming wouldn’t you try to get away? Hamas won’t let them though. They need them as human shields.

So declaring that you want to kill someone is now a bigger crime than actually killing, is it?

BBC report what the UK are doing
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-67095846

Air craft will begin patrols today to "track threats to regional stability such as the transfer of weapons to terrorist groups".

the vessels were not being used as warships, but "ships that can assist with hospital facilities".

sending the boats was also about "deterring others from getting involved in the region" and "maligning external influence".

The UN and the WHO have made it clear that people on ventilators and babies in incubators can't be safely moved.

Israel has told people to move south of Wadi Gaza, within Gaza.

And hopefully they will be safer there. But they are still stuck in the region. Most cannot leave the region. And it is such a densely populated region, so many will not make it to the safety of Wadi Gaza and it will have nothing to do with Hamas' 'stay put' order. It will simply be because they don't have the means to move quickly or safely within the densely populated region (one in mid conflict, to add, which destroys existing infrastructure and impedes movement). As I said before, they are fish in a barrel. There is no good outcome here.

@zyymom honestly even the wiki page will give you a quick overview of the actual history rather than whatever nonsense you seem to have absorbed.

Absolutely ridiculous comment. Israel give that ‘warning’ in bad faith, knowing full well it is impossible for them to go anywhere.

I think you should change your sentence to “the support I’m hearing for Israel is a little like saying we should have let aggressors commit genocide like we did in the past”. Bringing up the holocaust in this context is manipulative because there is ethnic violence on both sides, one side doesn’t get a free pass to murder because they have been victims before.

Firstly, 7/7 was carried out by British citizens. People here remained critical of British activities in the Middle East after the event. Mass killing of civilians is not defence.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-44124396

Good grief - I am astonished anyone can be this ignorant about the history

Essentially, they are there to stop anyone from supporting Palestine even if they wanted to, which no country does anyway.

They are a doomed people.

Someone shared this in one of the other threads.

Arguably, that is what both sides want of the other, not just Hamas.

The Israeli government has been criticised rightly for decades but the recent coalition is even more right wing. The finance minister Smotrich said a few months ago that there is no Palestinian nation, and the only options for Palestinians are to emigrate, to accept a life of subjugation to Israel, or to die.

It's about 10km out of Gaza city to the area they are being told to evacuate to. Granted, under poor conditions, but for able-bodied people it's walkable.

Admittedly it is a catastrophe for those who can't.

They have already killed thousands and displaced many. What they’re doing is not new it’s just suddenly more people are watching.