To think it’s turning into genocide in real time

[Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73]

Just seen this on the news- how can this be right? It genuinely is starting to feel like genocide.

What Hamas did was beyond appalling. But this is also beyond appalling too. Its trying to wipe Gaza off the map. Over 500 kids have already died. Human rights watch have verified that Israel uses white phosphorus against Gaza, which is a war crime.

And everyone is just watching it happen.

“The Israeli army has just ordered the entire civilian population of Gaza to evacuate south within 24 hours. The UN says that amounts to 1.1 million people& applies to 100s of 1000s sheltered in UN buildings & their staff. This is impossible without “devastating human consequences”
Leaving aside the international law implications, I cannot emphasise enough how impossible this kind of movement of people would be. I have spent a lot of time in Gaza it is one of the most densely populated places on earth, there are pretty much only 2 roads south - along the coast and down the centre - they aren’t wide or well paved. I spoke to the gaza health ministry yesterday who said every hospital was overflowing. How would the wounded and elderly be transported? There is a massive fuel shortage how would vehicles drive? There would be no where for 1.1 million to go even if they got there. Rafah crossing to Egypt is not operational because of Israeli airstrikes.”

This is how Genocide is classified;
U.N. Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide:

"In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

• Killing members of the group;

• Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

• Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part"

The actions of both Israel & Hamas fit this description too. It’s just fucking beyond terrible. And it feels like some world leaders are just cheering from the sidelines 😪

That tweet doesn't make much sense to me

Hamas have been firing missiles at Israel for years and were on the night the hospital was hit - Al Jazerra has been showing footage !

Hamas have weapons and missiles stored inside Gaza - the seige makes no difference as they have a stockpile.

Yes, why does it need to be a "very hi-tech" weapon?

Yes very interesting, I think I remember him writing for Middle east eye, known for the balanced take, I think he still blames Nato for Russia and Ukraine, talks a lot about not trusting mainstream media, very pro corbyn so 'interesting' if you understand the slant at which he wants to find the answers....

sigh

His first point doesn't make much sense since Hamas and PIJ have weapons stockpiles in Gaza.

And they can manufacture their own as a Hamas leader, Ali Baraka is quoted saying in Reuters:

"Hamas' deadly attack on southern Israel six days ago - unprecedented for the group in its planning and scale - was a devastating demonstration of the military expertise it has gained since seizing control of Gaza in 2007....

Necessity is the mother of invention," said Ali Baraka, a senior Hamas official, adding that the group had long drawn on money and training from Iran and Iranian regional proxies like Lebanon's Hezbollah, while bolstering its own forces in Gaza.

Difficulties in importing weapons meant that over the past nine years "we developed our capabilities and are able to manufacture locally", said Baraka, who is based in Lebanon....

In the 2008 Gaza war, Hamas rockets had a maximum range of 40 km (25 miles), but that had risen to 230 km by the 2021 conflict, he added.

After the most recent Gaza war in 2021, Hamas and an affiliated group called Palestinian Islamic Jihad managed to retain 40% of their missile inventories, a key target of the Israelis, according to the U.S. based non-profit Jewish Institute for National Security of America, keeping roughly 11,750 missiles compared with 23,000 before the conflict."

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/bombardments-hit-area-gaza-sinai-border-crossing-gaza-officials-2023-10-10/

At this point, I think there's several posters, including the OP, who really don't read this kind of information.

And seem very intent on deflecting responsibility away from Palestinian terrorist groups. 🤔

Quite.

Cook is wrong that Hamas would need to get around the blockade since they've had difficulties importing over the last 9 years so they evolved their ability to manufacture their own.

And that's just his first point! 🤦‍♂️🙈

He sounds very un-balanced then.

More carnage today.

I'm looking at pictures on the news of children in their beds covered with rubble. And 17 members of one family killed.

Well done Israel. You're doing a great job at genocide ❤️

Conflicting news today on hospital deaths.
This is very confusing.

Why would such a statement be made by Israel

This. I don’t know how anybody - and some of the posters on here - can think that this is morally acceptable.

Stop trying to score points. Just stop.

Genocide is happening in front of us all.

“Yes very interesting, I think I remember him writing for Middle east eye, known for the balanced take, I think he still blames Nato for Russia and Ukraine, talks a lot about not trusting mainstream media, very pro corbyn so 'interesting' if you understand the slant at which he wants to find the answers..“

@Justanotherlurker oh so he’s got a left wing perspective so clearly can’t be trusted is what you are saying? He also lives partly in Israel. Are we meant not to trust anyone who supported Corbyn either?!

@DownNative “And seem very intent on deflecting responsibility away from Palestinian terrorist groups. 🤔”

I think there are some/lots of us on here who dont nescessarily believe Israeli propaganda any more than we believe the propaganda from Hamas!

So, you read my post deconstructing Cook's first point on his tweet and....THAT'S what you chose to respond to?

I think that demonstrates the truthfulness of my quote you used....🤷‍♂️

You could have acknowledged Cook's first point in his tweet YOU posted is discredited. But no.

Doubt that many PP read your Chat GP-style repetitive mega posts tbh - seen so many posts complaining about them

Perhaps if you were to be more concise and focussed more PP would read them?

The OP quite clearly did which is how they got to the specific part they quoted.

Chat GPT style, my arse!

What I do is respond to multiple points anyone makes in their posts in one go and provide various pieces of sources at the same time.

Its what you're taught to do in secondary school when formulating an argument.

I have no intention of dumbing anything down to suit some people's short attention spans on a topic as complicated as international terrorism and counter-terrorism. Perhaps a topic of this nature isn't for those who have short attention spans....? 🤔

In my home country, a Nobel Peace Prize winner was asked once why he repeats his words often. He replied he has to until certain people get the message. And they eventually did.

Same principle here.

@DownNative think that demonstrates the truthfulness of my quote you used....🤷‍♂️

I have no doubt that Hamas do have weapons stockpiled. But it’s whether I believe that this was them or it’s merely Israeli war propaganda. Channel 4 questioned it all quite well too:

https://twitter.com/Lowkey0nline/status/1714775482283991172/mediaViewer?currentTweet=1714775482283991172&currentTweetUser=Lowkey0nline

Yep you carry on, it's working really well

I don't think it matters all that much what you personally believe. But you posted Cook's tweet for a reason which is you completely believed every word of his tweet.

Unfortunately for you, his first attempted point was discredited well enough.

It doesn't bode well.

IIRC, Channel 4 doesn't come to any firm conclusions either. 🙈

That simply means you misunderstand the target audience which is actually never posters themselves. Research shows those who post on forums are much less open to new information than those who lurk only.

Having said that, it's clear a good number of posters do read my contributions which is usually sourced, I might add.

I would say attempting to deflect the debate at hand onto me doesn't work. It's a distraction. Less trying to personalise the debate and more focusing on actual content of posts. 🤦‍♂️

@DownNative i think Cook makes some interesting points. It’s been discredited by you but not by anyone else!

I am interested in varying viewpoints - there’s an Al Jazeera video report going round that completely discredits Israel but no doubt that would be shouted down too as it’s the ‘wrong’ kind of angle for some commentators on here.

Here we go- Al Jazeera’s report https://twitter.com/AJEnglish/status/1714984258358391057

Take Cook's point 4 - that's a Non-sequitur Fallacy.

Points 2 and 3 don't stand up either.

From a terrorism, security and counter-terrorism perspective, his tweet would be considered a shoddy attempt at analysis. 🤷‍♂️

This is extremely interesting and possibly explains why Israel is dulling down the number killed at the hospital.
Thankyou for posting

No, not discredited by me personally. The available evidence discredited Cook completely, including the words of a Hamas senior member, Ali Baraka as sourced from Reuters.

The infographic I provided also discredited Cook. You can see the source on it in the corner.

In attempting to create a false equivalence between the sources I've provided and Al Jazeera, you've unwittingly reinforced the point I made previously which you quoted.

Al Jazeera is funded by the Qatari Government. Its considered a propaganda machine.

Reuters, on the other hand, is fully independent of government. Hence no YouTube publisher note for them.

You're falling into the False Balance Fallacy here. 🙈

I don’t really have skin in the game and I’ve just been lurking to understand the situation. But doesn’t this actually support Israel?

They track missiles from Israel and the impacts which end before missiles are then launched from Gaza, the first of which is intercepted.

5 seconds later the hospital is hit, with no tracking of missiles from Israel or Gaza? Doesn’t that exactly point to a (relatively) low powered rocket misfiring from a local source?

“Al Jazeera is funded by the Qatari Government. Its considered a propaganda machine.”

I mean you could say that about pretty much ALL the media sources in the U.K. frankly - especially the newspapers. The BBC is a bloody propaganda machine.

No, the BBC is independent of the UK Government.

Al Jazeera, RT and NK news channels are very different.

Ever wonder why BBC also has no publisher notes attached on YouTube like Al Jazeera does? 🤦‍♂️

I think you're scrabbling around for half baked claims now...