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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To have lost it at DS aged 11

1000 replies

FluthyFeaffers · 26/09/2023 21:56

I have yelled at him this evening.
He is 11, soon to be 12.
Started Yr 7 in secondary school 3 weeks ago.
He is struggling so much with his (lack of) organisation in the mornings before school, I am at my wits end.
I spent the whole of year 5 and 6 battling, absolutely battling with him to get ready for school, but never succeeded. We were late every single day for 2 years.
"Eat your breakfast" gets distracted eating breakfast.
"Clean your teeth" goes upstairs to clean teeth but wanders around doing something else.
"Get dressed" goes in to bedroom to get dressed but ends up doing something else.
Etc. Etc. All through year 5 & 6.
It made us late because whilst this was going on I'm racing around trying to get myself ready for work and trying to get my other younger DC ready. Then I'd go and check on DS and he'd never ever have done what I'd sent him to do.
Nothing worked to motivate him. No reward system, no sticker chart, no amount of explaining about the repercussions of not doing as asked, no amount of explaining about the knock on effect of being late for school. I tried it all for 2 years. Nothing worked.
But because it was primary school, all that happened to him was we missed the school gate and had to go roundcto the front reception to be let in. He got a warm friendly greeting from teachers and I got a look of "Why can't you get your poor child in to school on time" and then I'd arrive late for work and get reprimanded for it.
So I spent the whole summer drilling it in to him that in Yr 7 he must must must get to school on time, because in secondary school if you're late you get a detention, because you're causing your sibling masses of stress by making them late for school every time you're late for school, because I am getting in to serious trouble at work because of arriving late every day because I drop you in late because you're not ready to leave on time, because it creates SO MUCH STRESS when you won't get ready in time to leave on time for school.
Yes yes yes yes yes mum, he said every time I brought it up over summer.
I promise, promise, promise I will change, he said.
4 weeks in to secondary school, and it is a nightmare every single morning.
He cannot, cannot get himself ready for school in time to leave.
I spell out for him every single morning what he needs to do. It's soooooo eeeeeasy. It's the same god damn things every single day! Nothing changes! Do x, y, z.
"Yes mum" wanders around.
"Have you done x, y and z?"
"No, sorry, I forgot. I'll do it now"
Wanders off.
"Why haven't you done x? Ive asked you twice now"
"Sorry"
"Do it now"
"Why haven't you done y? I've asked you 3 times"
"I'm sorry. I'll do it. I'm trying my best"
Last week he needed to take his PE bag on 1 of the says.
"Remember to take your PE bag today, it's hanging in the cupboard " I said.
"Oh yeah!!!!! PE!!!!! I forgot!!!!!! Thanks for reminding me!!!!!"
20 mins later:
"Have you got your PE bag?"
"Oh No! I forgot! I'll get it now...."
15 mins later, after non stop constant continuous marshalling to get ready, do this, do that, do this, do that:
"Right, come on, we're late again, pick up your rucksack and your PE bag we need to leave NOW"
DS hovers around putting on tie and blazer which I'd asked him to do the the past hour sling with all his other things he needs to do.
"NOW" I raise my voice, as he's making my other child late for school and me late for work.
He runs out the door, jumps in the car.
We get to school.
He turns pale and says "I've forgotten my PE bag"
"Tough" I say. " I have told you 3 times this morning to take your PE bag. I reminded you for the 3rd time right before we left home."
DS starts crying
"I will get a detention!!!!!!!!!"
His worst, absolute worst fear, is getting a detention. He's never had one, and is terrified of getting one.
"Maybe you'll learn if you get a detention " I say.
Then he starts begging and pleading with me to take him home to get his PE bag. He's crying sorry over and over again. He looks physically ill, sweating, clammy, pale.
So I drive him home to get PE bag.
My other child starts crying because now she is horribly late for school (different school) and is too young to go in by herself plus she has SEN and isn't mature enough to cope with going in by herself.
I drop him back to school. He's late. I drop DD toschool. She's late. I get 'the look' from her teachers. I drive to work. I'm late. I get disciplined by my boss.
That evening, I talk to DS for a very, very long time about the impact of his disorganisation in the mornings.
We work out that it would help him if I wrote down for him everything he needs to do in the mornings.
So I write it all out in very clear, bullet point steps. I show it to him, he thinks it's really helpful.
Great, I think.
Why didnt I think of this before.
1 week on, it's of no help at all.
This morning, he's wandering around telling me he's ready whilst simultaneously having forgotten 7 instructions in his morning list. I pointed each of the 7 things on the list out to him, staring each thing that was on the list that he hadn't done.
I told him to do them.
Went off to get other child ready to leave, I'm ready to leave, DS still not ready to leave. We were all late again.
Yesterday, he had something really important to take to school. His timetable. I askedchim SIX TIMES to put his timetable in to his rucksack (he'd got it out at home and I'd seen it in theclounge). I told him the night before, and again in the morning, 6 separate times in total "Put your timetable in to your rucksack now, otherwise you will forget" . 6 times. The 6th time was just before we left. I mean, I was getting more and more stern each time. "Put. Your. Timetable. In. To. Your. Rucksack. NOW. NOW!" We got to school. He turned pale. Panicked. "Mum I've forgotten my timetable!!!!!!!".
I point blank refused to go back and sent him in to school without it. He was really upset. Told me after school today that he'd gone to the wrong classroom at one point in the day as couldn't remember without his timetable. So I said "Go and put it in your rucksack now then, do it now".
"Ok" he says.
Dinnertime:
"Did you put your timetable in your rucksack?"
"Oh No! I got distracted! I'll do it now!"
Evening time
"Is your timetable in your rucksack?"
"No.......I forgot......."
"Go and do it immediately "
"OK...."
Bedtime, he's in bed, reading:
"Darling, is your timetable in your rucksack, did you do it?"
"No, sorry, I'm sorry mum, I forgot"
And that was that.
I lost it.
Yelled at him. For ages.
I have NEVER yelled at him before. Never.
He was devastated. So remorseful. Said sorry over and over again.
And finally, he broke my heart by sadly and quietly saying "I'm so sorry for being me. I really struggle with my short term memory mummy. I know it causes problems butvi cant help it".
He's soon to be 12.
He has not got SEN.
He's bright.
He's average at school except for maths where he's below average.
He's amazing in every other way.
He's such a good boy.
He tries so hard all of the time to do his best.
He's a clever boy.
He's a wonderful personality.
Fantastic sense of humour.
Loving.
Kind.
Affectionate.
Funny.
Friends love him.
Teachers complimentary about him.
What the hell is wrong with him in tbe mornings?????????
Am I being too hard?
Am I expecting too much????

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
Sugarfree23 · 29/09/2023 16:45

MyNDfamily · 29/09/2023 16:27

He has ADHD. How could you not notice?

Because not everyone is an expert. Most think of ADHD as a child with ants in their pants.
Why not say something helpful rather than unhelpful?

sammie66 · 29/09/2023 16:51

This could have been me writing this. My son was undiagnosed ADHD and ASD until 15, he ended up with severe anxiety, severe depression and a school refuser. Hyperfocus was one of his traits too. As he went through puberty it got a lot worse. We went through a hellish time with him. He's know in his 2nd year at uni and loving it, still really struggles with focus. But don't underestimate what could be a processing problem.

Dalekjastninerels · 29/09/2023 17:13

Sugarfree23 · 29/09/2023 16:45

Because not everyone is an expert. Most think of ADHD as a child with ants in their pants.
Why not say something helpful rather than unhelpful?

Yes!

It is easy not to notice when the Disability is not obvious; I am a carer for Moderate to Profound ID Residents who are obviously disabled; but occasionally we have a Short Stay/Emergency/Respite Resident with a Mild/Borderline ID and their Disability is much less obvious and easily missed as they have better communication/literacy/daily living skills than our usual residents. But they still struggle more than a person without an ID.

Dramaticpenguin · 29/09/2023 19:16

This is exactly consistent with ADHD. Hyper focus completely normal. And he is trying but it's very frustrating to live with as the person with it and as a parent or partner. I'm on the waiting list to be assessed and that was absolutely me at school and I see some traits in my middle child too. It's also an exact description of my friend's daughter who is dyslexic and is also waiting for ADHD assessment. Being bright doesn't mean no sen.

muddymommy · 29/09/2023 19:16

My Asperger's son was like this. Yelling just reinforced him feeling he was no good.
You know where your frustrations are so deal with them. Don't set goals he can't achieve. Don't yell! If he's feeling bad anyway then you have to be the one safe place that won't make him feel worse. Check he's got everything before setting out. Do it for all the kids so he doesn't feel singled out. He's an 11 year boy who needs support and love. I know it can be hard but please don't shout or make him feel ashamed of himself, he will carry those feelings for ever x

DorisDill · 29/09/2023 19:22

FluthyFeaffers · 26/09/2023 22:08

He can hyper focus on things though.
He can spend hours focusing on things that he's interested in, or is enjoying.
To me that's not consistent with ADHD, is it?
Or am I wrong?
He's gone through the whole of primary school with nothing ever being picked up. His grades are always average. He's amazing at reading and spelling, above average in my opinion but school says average. Poor at maths.
And his long term memory recall is phenomenal. Shocks me with the details he can remember long term. But can't bloody remember an instruction from 2 minutes ago.
He said tonight that he needs help because he thinks he's got "listening problems". I don't know what this means.....😞

That is very consistent with ADHD, actually.

DorisDill · 29/09/2023 19:28

I don’t think you can blame him for you being late every day for years either, annoying as it is. You are the adult.

Lie all his clothes out for him the night before, including socks.

Check the school bag is ready the night before and coat and shoes are ready together.

Buy pan au chocolate, concentrated juice cartons etc, forget “healthy”, just keep life simple.

Get up early enough to get yourself totally ready, shower, make up, everything but shoes.

Go into his room, wake him, pop in and out while you are sorting other DC, offer to help - literally, I can help you put yours socks on if you like (probably won’t take you up on it).

Watch him brush his teeth.

When he goes downstairs, he doesn’t go back up again. Watch him put shoes on.

Breakfast is then at table or in car if needed. Done.

DorisDill · 29/09/2023 19:33

You need to be organised as well OP, you can’t be “racing around getting ready” in amongst this, when you have a kid who can’t organise himself.

I have ADHD, and one of my DC has it. I am not naturally organised at all 🙈 But, if we are late for school, it’s my problem as I am the adult and if I can’t get us out of the house on time then it means I need to get up earlier, and put more effort into organising things the evening before.

Violinist64 · 29/09/2023 19:35

I think virtually all of us agree that @FluthyFeaffers son has undiagnosed SEN but I think we should be cautious about diagnosis by Internet. In my own two posts, I have shared similarities that affected my own children but I am not a doctor or psychologist, nor have I met the child, and I believe a lot of diagnosis comes through observation as well as a battery of tests, so would not dare to say what this boy has. Many people here are saying "it's ADHD," and I am sure that these people are no more qualified to diagnose anything than l am. It may well be ADHD, but there is an umbrella of diagnoses which present with very similar symptoms, which is why l would urge the @FluthyFeaffers to go for a professional diagnosis as soon as possible.

Newmumatlast · 29/09/2023 20:44

I came to say the same thing. As a bright kid who noone wouldve thought had SEN but has been diagnosed as an adult and now know I wasn't shit and disorganised through my own fault...

Esher11233445 · 29/09/2023 21:46

This sounds like ADHD. My DS has it and is also dyslexic. The fact that he can hyper focus is even more indicative of ADHD - it’s commonly Mis understood as a lack of focus, but it is rather an inability to regulate focus. My DS can hyper focus on things he’s interested in, but things he isn’t interested in, such as getting ready in the morning, and he is exactly as you describe.

dearanon · 29/09/2023 21:57

@FluthyFeaffers

My reply will have got lost but ds has both adhd and autism.

We use a wipe clean visual of what he's do to each morning and have set Alexa up with alarms to go off with what's written on the visual.

pacificoceanwhale · 29/09/2023 23:19

I have no advice to offer you OP as I'm only in the very early stages of trying to figure things out with my own DS. But I wanted to say what a wonderful mother you are. And the fact that your DS can talk so openly and comfortably with you is testament to the great job you have done.

Shame about some of the rather harsh remarks from other Hmm but I've learned a lot from this thread today so thank you for facilitating that!

Wishing your DS (and you!) all of the very best for the future Flowers

mollyfolk · 30/09/2023 00:17

I completely forget stuff like that at all the time. I have loads of systems to help me remember stuff. Everything has a calendar notification on my phone - I leave a post it note on the front door if I need to take a particular thing in the morning. I try and help my kids organise themselves the night before. Like with the timetable - could you walk with him and make sure he puts it in his bag the night before. Help him get coat , shoes clothes ready at the door. leave Pe bag ready to go. Yeah he should be able to do it at 11 but he can’t so he needs your help to organise himself and learn strategies to get his build up to getting his disorganised ass out the door in the morning himself.

Adhdmomoftwo · 30/09/2023 07:37

He means when people talk to him his brain does not listen. No matter how hard you try if it’s not interesting his brain does not take it in. He sounds completely adhd to me OP, in everything you have said. Hyperfocus on things that interest him in a huge part of it xx

April489 · 30/09/2023 08:16

Does he feel that he might manage better with simple visual lists? 3 or 4 things max on each to have done, for example, before going downstairs and another for once downstairs before being ready to leave? Or, if he won't immediately misplace them, some A4 picture print outs of the tasks he needs to do that you can give him one at a time - he can then take each to prompt him to do/finish each item and return it to swap for the next one once done? Depending on his preferences that might support some independence.

CathyFitzs · 30/09/2023 09:08

Am I missing something here? Why do so many morning tasks? I’m a teacher with four children and cannot be late in the mornings so I do understand the utter pain of leaving the house on time!
why not get everything ready the night before for all of you (your kids can contribute to this) even put things in the car if possible or have stuff in front of the front door, then at least the three of you only have to get dressed, breakfast ( this can be eaten in the car at a push) and clean teeth .

RainboMelon · 30/09/2023 09:12

"He has ADHD. How could you not notice?"

Most (if not all) ND children have ND parents. It's not always easy to spot when you do it yourself and your parents, and siblings and aunties...

I didn't know I was Autistic and had ADHD until I realised my children were. Then I saw it in both mine and my husband's family until then I was obvious to what Autism and ADHD really looked like.

DorisDill · 30/09/2023 09:24

RainboMelon · 30/09/2023 09:12

"He has ADHD. How could you not notice?"

Most (if not all) ND children have ND parents. It's not always easy to spot when you do it yourself and your parents, and siblings and aunties...

I didn't know I was Autistic and had ADHD until I realised my children were. Then I saw it in both mine and my husband's family until then I was obvious to what Autism and ADHD really looked like.

Edited

I did think this when I noticed the OP said that she is “racing around” at the same time trying to get herself ready… 😄

I’ve met so many mothers of diagnosed autistic children, where I have wanted to say to the mother “You do know you have ADHD, don’t you?!” ad it’s just written all over them.

I manage to keep my mouth shut though and then a lot of the time I find out that they are diagnosed or are waiting to be. The others… maybe they will get there in their own time!

DawnInAutumn · 30/09/2023 09:52

I never ‘noticed’ mine had adhd. We were having a cognitive assessment when he was 11 and the psych suggested we get him assessed for adhd. I scoffed actually because he was not hyper in any way which was I thought it was about. I thought any issues were just a part of his autism. I was floored when his psychiatrist said he had it.

RainboMelon · 30/09/2023 10:13

DorisDill · 30/09/2023 09:24

I did think this when I noticed the OP said that she is “racing around” at the same time trying to get herself ready… 😄

I’ve met so many mothers of diagnosed autistic children, where I have wanted to say to the mother “You do know you have ADHD, don’t you?!” ad it’s just written all over them.

I manage to keep my mouth shut though and then a lot of the time I find out that they are diagnosed or are waiting to be. The others… maybe they will get there in their own time!

Yes I noticed that too.

My husband is like this, he always thought it was the children but he also knew what it was going to be like every morning so he could have planned - yet he didn't, just like the kids. I think it's harder to see it in yourself than it is others. Lack of time is a big motivation for those of us with ADHD as we get dopamine from the rush.

Once I started my ADHD medication I really could SEE it in my husband. When your rushing around yourself like a headless chicken it's hard to see what everyone else sees.

Cantgetouttabed · 30/09/2023 10:33

This sounds like my son to a t and my son is everything you’ve listed ie he’s bright, average at school etc but he is SEN. He has dyslexia. His dyslexia is more of the information processing side oppose to needing things like overlays, words moving etc and so on. He can read very well but has no idea of what he’s just read, like he can’t retain the information so has to re-read it again and again. Giving him a verbal list of things to do is a no no with my lad. He’ll go up the stairs and have forgotten by the time he’s at the top. We’ve put up a list in his bedroom…get dressed, deodorant, brush teeth etc and then one at the front door for him to check off every morning before leaving the house..ie pen, pe kit, keys etc. it’s worked very well as it’s also giving him some independence. I do check off with him every morning before he leaves the house that he’s got it all and he re-checks again even though he’s done it. Bless him. I too have the same traits as my son but am undiagnosed. Good luck and I’m sure with all the fab advice here you’ll go on to get the right diagnosis for your son. You sound like a fab mum as you HAVE noticed something isn’t right as you wouldn’t have posted your frustration. Xx

April489 · 30/09/2023 10:39

To clarify above I meant pictorial/icon lists, not just a written list printed out. :)

potterycorner · 30/09/2023 11:02

@CathyFitzs

Am I missing something here? Why do so many morning tasks?

Just sticking up for the OP: I love the idea that in the evening, time magically expands so that you can do your evening tasks and also have lots of spare time to do morning tasks, without pushing against the falling asleep with exhaustion point.

As an example - I get back from work at 7pm/7.30 depending on trains.

By the time I've eaten, washed up and put the children to bed it is 8.30/9pm - when I wash their uniform and do an hour (often two) of work admin.

Their uniform tumble dries overnight. This means I do have to get it ready in the morning, rather than the night before.

Preparing the night before means staying up - which I do sometimes do, particularly if I have to leave before 7am the next day and can't use the morning to iron uniforms or polish shoes.

But I'm interested in why 10pm-6am sleep with more to do in the morning is somehow worse than 11pm-7am. What's the difference?

Cantgetouttabed · 30/09/2023 11:02

Also to add that it was one thing off the list at a time as a whole list is too overwhelming for him.

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