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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think it is actually mostly men?

1000 replies

Nolpp · 26/09/2023 18:48

Maybe I didn’t get the memo in the past but in the last year or so I’ve been so bitterly disappointed by make behaviour. I look back and wonder if it was always this way but I’m only just noticing. I think part of it is I recently became a single parent and so I’ve had more dealings with men than I would usually, as I’ve had to speak to insurance companies, take car for MOT etc. Obviously I did some of these things before and I know women also work in these places but overall I am having more interaction with men.

Examples…

Driving. Whenever a car is right up behind me it is ALWAYS a man driving. I drive at the speed limit, not under, so presumably they think speed limits don’t apply to them.

I recently donated to a sponsorship for cancer research, an old school friend, quite literally not spoken in over two decades. He then messaged me to thank me for the donation and followed it up with a question about sex and positions he can do after his surgery. Why would anyone think that’s ok?

A colleague, well respected in his industry, tells me when drunk on a night out that he wishes all women conformed to the way of the 50s and stayed at home. He wasn’t joking.

In Sainsbury’s a week ago, a man grabbed my arse in a queue, I was shocked and stepped to one side, didn’t know what to do and said get the fuck away from me. I was next up for the till and the man behind the till said he does it to everyone !!! What the actual fuck? He did follow up to say they had tried to ban him from the shop. I cried in the car afterwards, it was awful.

Waiting for the baby changing unit in Mc Donnalds. A man eventually emerges, mutters sorry but he couldn’t wait, and looked sheepish. He wasn’t unwell, he was downing a Mc flurry when I came out.

Around 7 years ago I used to date someone who had recently got a job as a Judge in the family courts. He was very young to have got this job and in part it was to do with his father being a judge in the same court. Anyway one day we were talking about how money is worked out in a divorce and he said ‘it’s disgusting, women expect to be paid out after staying at home doing nothing with kids for fifteen years, so rather than getting a job of their own they steal the x husband’s pension.’ I am ashamed to say I laughed and agreed with him. I had a good job with no interest in giving it up so I felt I was compatible with this man who I now see was a bit of a monster.

I honestly feel like men make up the bulk of shit behaviour. It probably sounds dramatic but I actually feel sad about it, genuinely sad. And embarrassed that it’s taken me until this late in life to see it.

Yes, I know it’s not all men.

Rant over.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
24
Lentilweaver · 26/09/2023 19:51

If you are a mother of a son at what point does he become part of this majority that are horrible?

I am the mother of a son. I think he is lovely, and not horrible. But I would, wouldn't I? I am certain Wayne Couzens's mum thought he was the bees knees.

Personally, I would rather be emotionally wounded by a woman, thanks.

Justifiedcheese · 26/09/2023 19:52

Delmedio · 26/09/2023 19:28

Christ, I hate these kind of posts.
Peak mn.

Most firefighters are men, most members of the armed forces are male.
In fact, most inventors, innovators etc are male.

But yeah men are shit, yeah, whatever.

And many of those firefighters and military men are abusive shits. Ditto artists, entertainers and inventors.
Someone didn't do the research before stepping in to uphold the patriarchy.
Which hates you, BTW.

FedUpOfItA · 26/09/2023 19:52

I frequently feel it starts in childhood and is genetic.

I've noticed some of my single friends battling with their really difficult sons and doing the best they can (me included) and the man is nowhere to be seen. Or he is around and just can't be bothered.

One thing that's improved my life immensely is actually not speaking to men unless it's in a professional capacity or I want sex from them. I just can't do the ego anymore.

BeauSignoles · 26/09/2023 19:52

I work in the courts. At least 7/10 defendants are men.

re firefighters and cops being men - I have a firefighter friend who is trying to expose the rampant harassment and misogyny in the force. This is a bloke bTw - admitted he was complicit in benefiting from a system where he rose up the ranks. But couldn’t deal with it anymore after seeing women consistently denied promotions and much worse.

DeeCeeCherry · 26/09/2023 19:53

Gimjam
Some men even like to sexually abuse and murder dogs

I read about Adam Britton this morning. I could only get to 4 lines or so I couldn't bring myself to read further. He doesn't deserve to live.

I love my DP. Get on well with my brothers. I have 2 male friends I've known for many years. I'm aware that beyond them, I have as little to do with men as possible. They get on my nerves. Rude, entitled, sexist, speaking over women. Just fuck off. I'm unsurprised by the Carricks and Couzens of this world, and that policemen were making jokes about their victims. Every day of the week you can read about male violence.

It would be nice if women stuck together as much as men do. It could change a lot of things.

Alittletripdownmemorylane · 26/09/2023 19:54

YANBA especially the bit about men and driving.
I am on the roads a lot and have encountered many road rage incidents and with cars/vans driving up my arse (even like you, I drive at the speed limit not dawdling) and I can always bet my bottom dollar it will be a man at the wheel of the vehicle trying to push me along. Even had one guy (in a van) threaten to slit my throat just because I wouldn’t go over the speed limit for him.
Many men are absolute entitled arseholes.

Thisismynewusername1 · 26/09/2023 19:54

Delmedio · 26/09/2023 19:39

94% of firefighters are men. Women are allowed to become firefighters if they wish.

But somehow they don't want to or do the dangerous jobs.

It's always the non-dangerous jobs that women moan at not being to do/ discriminated against doing, isn't it?

Personally, I don't right off an entire gender.

Sorry to go against the grain but it's in the spirit of threads like this that someone does.

But that's me out of this one. I can't be arsed to engage further.

It’s not that women don’t want to do the “dangerous jobs”.

it’s that there is a culture of male behaviour that makes it all but impossible for a woman to succeed in that environment.

I worked in a top restaurant kitchen for a while. It’s horrific. The men band together and the women get the worst of it. “Chef sandwich” anyone?

male dominated jobs tend to be male dominated because women are pushed out.

did you know the early computer scientists were women? It was seen as women’s work. Ada Lovelace, Heda Gabler etc. They were pushed aside by men who took their work and credit, once men realised the success of the women’s efforts. Over 50 years later and computer science is still a male domain, and women don’t want to work in an environment where they’re seen as inferior, and will never be given equal opportunities.

I am a female scientist. I was once called “very decorative” at a conference by a male professor.

OspreyLambo · 26/09/2023 19:55

AtmosAtmos · 26/09/2023 19:48

Most of the sexual harassment and abuse and violence is from men. There is a hell of a lot of inequality especially at the top in media, politics, sport etc. and it gets ignored

However I don’t find the majority of terrible people are men. Women have different ways of being manipulative and aggressive even if not physically often to other women.

It’s about power. Men have a lot of physical power and they use it but women (not all as with men) can wound mentally and emotionally just as well.

If you are a mother of a son at what point does he become part of this majority that are horrible?

Exactly.

YABU OP.
Don't get me wrong. I agree with posters like @CyberCritical that the majority of violent crimes are down to men. Social expectations, etc. The sexual behaviour, definitely.

However if we're going to trivialise this by including examples of low-level bad behaviour (like driving and using the baby changing unit) then boy, have I got loads of examples!

Also it's the type of behaviour as Atmos said,,,

Am not one of those 'cool girls' or 'I'm not like other girls' but I find that many tight knit 'female friend groups' tend to turn into a hotbed of drama, gossip and 'she said' hurt feelings.

I don't know whether the same's true for 'the lads'. But these days my social circle is wider, based on mutual interests rather than just being one 'close friend group' that does everything together.

Maybe men have the same, I don't know but if they do it's not just them.

PaulaZackMayo · 26/09/2023 19:55

It would be nice if women stuck together as much as men do. It could change a lot of things.

Going by how much squabbling there is on Mumsnet by women I can't say that's going to happen.

MrsElsa · 26/09/2023 19:57

Saying something mean isn't the same as physically assaulting someone.

Just putting that out there for PP who reckons women saying mean things are committing violent crime at the same rate as men.

SantaBarbaraMonica · 26/09/2023 19:58

Delmedio · 26/09/2023 19:28

Christ, I hate these kind of posts.
Peak mn.

Most firefighters are men, most members of the armed forces are male.
In fact, most inventors, innovators etc are male.

But yeah men are shit, yeah, whatever.

Did you wonder why though? Or is it because they are simply stronger and smarter…

MichaelAndEagle · 26/09/2023 19:58

A colleague, well respected in his industry, tells me when drunk on a night out that he wishes all women conformed to the way of the 50s and stayed at home. He wasn’t joking

I definitely believe most men would not have a problem at all with this as the norm again. They may not admit it, or say they actively want it. But they wouldn't have a problem with it.

Lentilweaver · 26/09/2023 19:58

PaulaZackMayo · 26/09/2023 19:55

It would be nice if women stuck together as much as men do. It could change a lot of things.

Going by how much squabbling there is on Mumsnet by women I can't say that's going to happen.

60 women came forward against Bill Cosby. He is walking around free.

HarridanHarvestingHeldaBeans · 26/09/2023 19:58

Delmedio · 26/09/2023 19:28

Christ, I hate these kind of posts.
Peak mn.

Most firefighters are men, most members of the armed forces are male.
In fact, most inventors, innovators etc are male.

But yeah men are shit, yeah, whatever.

That makes it worse. They are capable of so much more, but so many choose violence instead.

Alittletripdownmemorylane · 26/09/2023 19:59

Gimjam · 26/09/2023 19:15

Some men even like to sexually abuse and murder dogs

I honestly wish I had not stumbled across that news article earlier today, I just can not erase it from my mind. Pure evil fucker and yes, it’s almost always a man behind these kind of horror stories.

junbean · 26/09/2023 19:59

Men have literally destroyed the earth and the future of humanity. They've made it miserable for any woman, people of color, destroyed almost every last bit of any indigenous culture, and basically stole everything they have then blame everyone else. You're not being dramatic.

MysteryBelle · 26/09/2023 20:00

I can understand you feeling that way because of your experiences. I’ve experienced both sexes treating me unfairly or terribly, but it’s been more women than men. And I think that has really disappointed me because I guess I expect women to be better, more empathetic, more honest, ethical. But that’s not true, in my personal experience. The malice, weird competitiveness, and lying, and narcissism, have come mostly from women I’ve had the misfortune of having to deal with. And it’s not random women I don’t really know which wouldn’t bother me, but from family and in-laws and frenemies. That hurts.

OspreyLambo · 26/09/2023 20:01

MrsElsa · 26/09/2023 19:57

Saying something mean isn't the same as physically assaulting someone.

Just putting that out there for PP who reckons women saying mean things are committing violent crime at the same rate as men.

Not sure if you mean me, but if you do I explicitly stated that it wasn't the same and that violent crime, men, definitely.
But we need to define 'shit behaviour' if we're going to be talking about selfishness ,rudeness and things like that it's a different discussion. And that is comparable to mean behaviour.
How is a man using a baby changing unit comparable to violent crime?

Redruby2020 · 26/09/2023 20:01

A few of your events you had bothered/got to me. But the main one is the guy who was a judge(just reinforced why they are not the be all and end all) to say such a stupid and brainless thing. Women who have stayed at home through choice or not, have still given up a lot of their identities and life to do that, including job/career money, despite being able to get something if they are married and split etc.
Whether it was voluntary or not, there is still a man behind it who has bloody benefited!

Unless you get one like all these fathers I see who are a mix between obviously being great blokes and in jobs they can do such things. Who share drop off's/collections from nursery/childcare/school. Who attend events/shows/projects/parents stuff, who take the kids to friends birthday parties etc. Who are also remarkably picking up from after school childcare, taking home and dealing with or at home hands on.
Not something I grew up with or experienced with my own exP.

Sadly the sex comments, yes I get it a lot. Males who i know, whom i may/may not have had any interest or involvement with, send me all sorts of things or make comments, it gets on my nerves.
One guy who is 51 said of course if I am talking with/next to a woman I will talk about sex, I will talk about dcks/p 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️ I was like for gods sakes!

Lentilweaver · 26/09/2023 20:02

Equating malice and narcissism to worldwide, endemic, male violence and sexual assault is ridiculous. Do you think a woman surgeon would have got away with assaulting and groping male juniors?

Thisismynewusername1 · 26/09/2023 20:02

Oh and I am married to a “decent”
man.

he’s still had his eyes opened over the years we’ve been together.

noticed how I’m ignored while other men speak to him.
noticed how when I hand over my bank card back in the day it was always brought to him to sign.
noticed how he ends up the primary lead on accounts or payments I set up.

actually listened when I described coming face to face with a 6’3 tw in a public toilet. And realised it’s not because they are inherently dangerous, it’s because I am immediately vulnerable in a private, enclosed space with a man I don’t know and don’t expect to be there.

TooOldForThisNonsense · 26/09/2023 20:03

YANBU

A lot of them are absolute cocks

I’ve been spoken to and/or dealt with aggressively many many times by men who I know wouldn’t have treated a man the same

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 26/09/2023 20:04

Yanbu.

Also if a man gave up his career to bring up the kids and cook and clean for me for years and then I left him I don't think I could begrudge him some of his pension when due to me he wouldn't have his own

PaulaZackMayo · 26/09/2023 20:06

Lentilweaver · 26/09/2023 20:02

Equating malice and narcissism to worldwide, endemic, male violence and sexual assault is ridiculous. Do you think a woman surgeon would have got away with assaulting and groping male juniors?

I agree there are many dangerous men out there. Women aren't perfect though. A woman has just sent been sent to prison for killing babies. There are some crazy people out there - men and women.

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